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jujuhound · 07-29-2004, 10:44 AM

Quote:

TecmoBowl said:
Dropped passes? What dropped passes? I throw to guys that get hit right after they catch the ball and still hang on to it. What dropped passes?

I agree here. This EASega guy is full of it. I haven't had any problems whatsoever with dropped passes about 12 games into my season. He also mentions stopping the CPU run was too easy last year. Was he playing on Pro? whatever. Try stopping Ricky on Legend default in 2k4.

aholbert32 · 07-29-2004, 10:45 AM

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EASegaRule said:

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aholbert32 said:

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EASegaRule said:

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LBzrule said:

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EASegaRule said:

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rudyjuly2 said:
VC made such a big leap in polish last year that I was hoping for another leap. I guess my expectations in that department were too high.

ESPN 2K5 isn't a push forward. It feels like a roster update with some other minor tweaks and a slew of new bugs. The more I play it, the more disappointed I am by it.

I wouldn't go that far. That's pretty extreme calling it a roster update. Running game isn't close to being as power as last year, passing game is easier as if it needed to be, they listened too much to a thread on here that I remember graphics are a ton better on Xbox, there is alot of stuff that you can do on defense with the hot routes system and the list could go on. CAlling it a roster update is overstating the case. If you are disappointed that's one thing but to call it a roster update is going to the absurd.

Absurd to you, perhaps, but that's what it feels like to me. They fixed the devastatingly awful running game from last year, but then they re-introduce the WR pass dropping problems from NFL2K3. Seems like they can't ever put the whole package together. The best thing I can say about the game is that it only cost 19 bucks.

Ok, now your making up stuff. I have been playing this game non stop since release and I have never had a problem w/ dropped passes especially like 2k3. You seem to like to overstate your case for example describing 2k4's running game as "devestatingly awful". Thats a bit of an exaggeration. There were too many broken tackles last year but that could be fixed w/ sliders and good defense. I know because I played the game all last year and I would have quit if the running game was was "devestatingly awful." But that seems to be your thing. You like to exaggerate certain "problems" w/ the game to bring attention to your self. The posters here get that you dont like the game. We understand you are dissapointed. The staff here gets that you think we should have written a better review. You dont need to repeat that in every post. If you dont find something new to say, either positive or negative, then im gonna assume your just trolling and ill take it from there.

Where did I mention your review in the message you quoted? As far as exaggerating the awful running game last year, I don't think I am. Proof of that is that Sega went out of their way to let everyone know they FIXED the major running game problems. Broken tackles were a huge problem, but an equally distressing problem was how easy it was to stop the CPU run. You say simply "adjust some sliders!". No thanks. Why should the user have to neuter their defense\offense to compensate for poor coding on the part of VC? This year they made the user's running game more challenging, but didn't do a thing to make the CPU running game any better. On all pro the CPU is averaging 10-25 yards a game rushing. You may not think the dropped passes are a problem again, but there's people in forums all over the net that think otherwise. Far too many wide open dropped passes. Yes, they happen in real life, and no, they dont happen with the regularity that they happen in this game.

First things first. I was just talking about your posts in THIS THREAD. Im talking about your various posts in other threads especially the OS review thread. My point is still the same. You are unhappy and we know it, no need to continue to beat that into the ground.

Also, thank you for clarifying something for me. You have a problem w/ the gameplay because U DONT USE SLIDERS! People like you amaze me. You expect EA or Sega or any game company is supposed to create the game specifically for you out of the box and when it isnt up to your standards, you bitch about how its bad coding. Give me a break. There are plenty of people who play on all pro that have no problems with the drops in 2k5. You do have a problem with that but instead of adjusting a slider, you choose to come on this board and complain about it.

If I think tackling is to hard for me, I adjust the slider. If passing is too easy I make it harder. I dont expect any game company to make a game perfect for me but I do expect them to give me a slider so I can tailor it to my skills. The franchise mode bugs are inexcusible and im dissapointed that they didnt fix that. I never say stuff like this but since you see so many flaws in the gameplay, sega didnt make the game perfect for YOU and since you refuse to adjust sliders, TAKE THE GAME BACK!! Legitimate gripes are from people who make an effort to correct flaws they see in the game not from people who make no effort.

mcquillian · 07-29-2004, 10:49 AM

If you think about it VC/Sega are just playing the odds. They crank the game out early, slash the price and get the consumers excited. However the down side to this is that there is obviously less time to test for bugs and glitches.

IMO, EA/Madden spend more time regarding the testing period of their products - especially Madden. Don't miss understand me, EA is not perfect, and I am expecting there to be issues with Madden 2005 as has been previously mentioned by those who have the game early.

Also, as previously mentioned, Madden has been refining their same engine for quite a while now. This might not be as exciting for the consumers, but it easier for EA to control the overall QC of their product.

LBzrule · 07-29-2004, 10:50 AM

I have no idea on the "dropped passes issue"

I put indexical marks here because I think that phrase is problematic. My V.I.P shows I'm completing 71%, so from my point of view dropped passes is not an issue. But now there are some games where WR's do drop passes, but I don't think it is a problem in the game. And I don't use sliders. If anything the passing game is TOO EASY. I have a guy in one of my leagues last year, whom I have yet to play yet, but he's toasting fools online for 700 passing yds a game. And we get people complaining about dropped passes. I'm passing for around 250-275. I won't deny that when you play you have dropped passes. This is probably true. I don't know what you are doing OR IF you me and the guy in my league are all doing something different.

I played online with Seattle Tuesday evening, Itula Mili caught EVERY pass barring one, that I threw to him. He was 6/7 142 yds and 2 TD's. I played azn essence last night, I let him use my Ravens against me, Todd Heap caught EVERY pass thrown to him. TE's catch alot of passes in here. I've even had games where I had freaking Alex Bannister folks, Alex Freaking Bannister for over 100 receiving yds. And he's what a 50 something overall? LIke I said, I won't deny that you are having dropped passes, but I do not know what we are doing differently. In the end, from my point of view, this game isn't even comparable to 2k3 in terms of dropped balls by WR's. 2k3 was just atrocious in that aspect, this game on the other hand is far away from that.

On another note, I don't think that my claim of someone saying it is a roster update as being absurd is simply confined to me. I think if one examines the empirical evidence by throwing in 2k4 and then playing 2k5 that the evidence indicates that claim to be absurd. To say the game is simply a roster update is to say nothing has been done. That's a lie. You might be frustrated and pissed off with the game and that's understandable but to call it a roster upgrade out of that frustration is overstating the case. If you want to say the game plays similar to 2k4, then you are correct.

frina · 07-29-2004, 10:53 AM

Quote:

EASegaRule said:

Absurd to you, perhaps, but that's what it feels like to me. They fixed the devastatingly awful running game from last year, but then they re-introduce the WR pass dropping problems from NFL2K3. Seems like they can't ever put the whole package together. The best thing I can say about the game is that it only cost 19 bucks.

Boy for a guy who dislikes the game that much, you sure do spend a lot of time talking about it. Is VC paying for that space they have rented in your head?

TombSong · 07-29-2004, 11:01 AM

Fellas, I think to a large extent most of the people who are not enjoying the game are those who do not know how to play it, nor wish to learn how to play it. Some of the excuses I am hearing are way off.

Sega has a bigger problem here that goes beyonf marketing or creating a game loaded with good features. There problem is Americans. Most of us are lazy by nature and having to deal with actually learning something is enough to turn most of us off. If these people cant play the game right out the box in 5 minutes, its not them, its the game that has the problem. I think this is why more people like Madden. Its a easier game to pick up and play. Thats why the games are so wide open, and high scoring. Madden is more a game of attrician than a game of football. Its a AI exploit fest. Whoever knows how to bust up the AI the best wins. (Go to any barber shop where they have the game hooked up (or just play online) and watch how they play) People that play that way should be made to suffer for playing that way. In ESPN you cant run around the pocket as long as you want, I dont HAVE to send a blitz after you to get pressure on the QB like you do in Madden.

One thing I will say in defense of EA, they are doing things to prevent the garbage play by those who play that way. In NCAA I have noticed you cant call hot routes or audibles till the QB gets under center. THAT is a good idea and cuts down on the guys that are constantly audibling/hot routing.

EASegaRule · 07-29-2004, 11:01 AM

Also, thank you for clarifying something for me. You have a problem w/ the gameplay because U DONT USE SLIDERS! People like you amaze me. You expect EA or Sega or any game company is supposed to create the game specifically for you out of the box and when it isnt up to your standards, you bitch about how its bad coding. Give me a break. There are plenty of people who play on all pro that have no problems with the drops in 2k5. You do have a problem with that but instead of adjusting a slider, you choose to come on this board and complain about it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you're happy neutering your defense or offense to compensate for Sega's/EA's inability to code AI, then cool for you. People that happily accept a shoddy product amaze me.

aholbert32 · 07-29-2004, 11:12 AM

Quote:

EASegaRule said:
Also, thank you for clarifying something for me. You have a problem w/ the gameplay because U DONT USE SLIDERS! People like you amaze me. You expect EA or Sega or any game company is supposed to create the game specifically for you out of the box and when it isnt up to your standards, you bitch about how its bad coding. Give me a break. There are plenty of people who play on all pro that have no problems with the drops in 2k5. You do have a problem with that but instead of adjusting a slider, you choose to come on this board and complain about it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you're happy neutering your defense or offense to compensate for Sega's/EA's inability to code AI, then cool for you. People that happily accept a shoddy product amaze me.

Bottom line: You'll never be happy. Keep waiting for the perfect football game.

07-29-2004, 10:44 AM	#65
jujuhound MVP OVR: 7 Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 1,040	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... Quote: *TecmoBowl said:* Dropped passes? What dropped passes? I throw to guys that get hit right after they catch the ball and still hang on to it. What dropped passes? I agree here. This EASega guy is full of it. I haven't had any problems whatsoever with dropped passes about 12 games into my season. He also mentions stopping the CPU run was too easy last year. Was he playing on Pro? whatever. Try stopping Ricky on Legend default in 2k4.

07-29-2004, 10:45 AM	#66
aholbert32 (aka Alberto) OVR: 44 Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 33,173 Blog Entries: 8	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... Quote: *EASegaRule said:* Quote: *aholbert32 said:* Quote: *EASegaRule said:* Quote: *LBzrule said:* Quote: *EASegaRule said:* Quote: *rudyjuly2 said:* VC made such a big leap in polish last year that I was hoping for another leap. I guess my expectations in that department were too high. ESPN 2K5 isn't a push forward. It feels like a roster update with some other minor tweaks and a slew of new bugs. The more I play it, the more disappointed I am by it. I wouldn't go that far. That's pretty extreme calling it a roster update. Running game isn't close to being as power as last year, passing game is easier as if it needed to be, they listened too much to a thread on here that I remember graphics are a ton better on Xbox, there is alot of stuff that you can do on defense with the hot routes system and the list could go on. CAlling it a roster update is overstating the case. If you are disappointed that's one thing but to call it a roster update is going to the absurd. Absurd to you, perhaps, but that's what it feels like to me. They fixed the devastatingly awful running game from last year, but then they re-introduce the WR pass dropping problems from NFL2K3. Seems like they can't ever put the whole package together. The best thing I can say about the game is that it only cost 19 bucks. Ok, now your making up stuff. I have been playing this game non stop since release and I have never had a problem w/ dropped passes especially like 2k3. You seem to like to overstate your case for example describing 2k4's running game as "devestatingly awful". Thats a bit of an exaggeration. There were too many broken tackles last year but that could be fixed w/ sliders and good defense. I know because I played the game all last year and I would have quit if the running game was was "devestatingly awful." But that seems to be your thing. You like to exaggerate certain "problems" w/ the game to bring attention to your self. The posters here get that you dont like the game. We understand you are dissapointed. The staff here gets that you think we should have written a better review. You dont need to repeat that in every post. If you dont find something new to say, either positive or negative, then im gonna assume your just trolling and ill take it from there. Where did I mention your review in the message you quoted? As far as exaggerating the awful running game last year, I don't think I am. Proof of that is that Sega went out of their way to let everyone know they FIXED the major running game problems. Broken tackles were a huge problem, but an equally distressing problem was how easy it was to stop the CPU run. You say simply "adjust some sliders!". No thanks. Why should the user have to neuter their defense\offense to compensate for poor coding on the part of VC? This year they made the user's running game more challenging, but didn't do a thing to make the CPU running game any better. On all pro the CPU is averaging 10-25 yards a game rushing. You may not think the dropped passes are a problem again, but there's people in forums all over the net that think otherwise. Far too many wide open dropped passes. Yes, they happen in real life, and no, they dont happen with the regularity that they happen in this game. First things first. I was just talking about your posts in THIS THREAD. Im talking about your various posts in other threads especially the OS review thread. My point is still the same. You are unhappy and we know it, no need to continue to beat that into the ground. Also, thank you for clarifying something for me. You have a problem w/ the gameplay because U DONT USE SLIDERS! People like you amaze me. You expect EA or Sega or any game company is supposed to create the game specifically for you out of the box and when it isnt up to your standards, you bitch about how its bad coding. Give me a break. There are plenty of people who play on all pro that have no problems with the drops in 2k5. You do have a problem with that but instead of adjusting a slider, you choose to come on this board and complain about it. If I think tackling is to hard for me, I adjust the slider. If passing is too easy I make it harder. I dont expect any game company to make a game perfect for me but I do expect them to give me a slider so I can tailor it to my skills. The franchise mode bugs are inexcusible and im dissapointed that they didnt fix that. I never say stuff like this but since you see so many flaws in the gameplay, sega didnt make the game perfect for YOU and since you refuse to adjust sliders, TAKE THE GAME BACK!! Legitimate gripes are from people who make an effort to correct flaws they see in the game not from people who make no effort.

07-29-2004, 10:49 AM	#67
mcquillian Rookie OVR: 2 Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Orlando, Florida	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... If you think about it VC/Sega are just playing the odds. They crank the game out early, slash the price and get the consumers excited. However the down side to this is that there is obviously less time to test for bugs and glitches. IMO, EA/Madden spend more time regarding the testing period of their products - especially Madden. Don't miss understand me, EA is not perfect, and I am expecting there to be issues with Madden 2005 as has been previously mentioned by those who have the game early. Also, as previously mentioned, Madden has been refining their same engine for quite a while now. This might not be as exciting for the consumers, but it easier for EA to control the overall QC of their product.

07-29-2004, 10:50 AM	#68
LBzrule Hall Of Fame OVR: 40 Join Date: Jul 2002 Blog Entries: 8	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... I have no idea on the "dropped passes issue" I put indexical marks here because I think that phrase is problematic. My V.I.P shows I'm completing 71%, so from my point of view dropped passes is not an issue. But now there are some games where WR's do drop passes, but I don't think it is a problem in the game. And I don't use sliders. If anything the passing game is TOO EASY. I have a guy in one of my leagues last year, whom I have yet to play yet, but he's toasting fools online for 700 passing yds a game. And we get people complaining about dropped passes. I'm passing for around 250-275. I won't deny that when you play you have dropped passes. This is probably true. I don't know what you are doing OR IF you me and the guy in my league are all doing something different. I played online with Seattle Tuesday evening, Itula Mili caught EVERY pass barring one, that I threw to him. He was 6/7 142 yds and 2 TD's. I played azn essence last night, I let him use my Ravens against me, Todd Heap caught EVERY pass thrown to him. TE's catch alot of passes in here. I've even had games where I had freaking Alex Bannister folks, Alex Freaking Bannister for over 100 receiving yds. And he's what a 50 something overall? LIke I said, I won't deny that you are having dropped passes, but I do not know what we are doing differently. In the end, from my point of view, this game isn't even comparable to 2k3 in terms of dropped balls by WR's. 2k3 was just atrocious in that aspect, this game on the other hand is far away from that. On another note, I don't think that my claim of someone saying it is a roster update as being absurd is simply confined to me. I think if one examines the empirical evidence by throwing in 2k4 and then playing 2k5 that the evidence indicates that claim to be absurd. To say the game is simply a roster update is to say nothing has been done. That's a lie. You might be frustrated and pissed off with the game and that's understandable but to call it a roster upgrade out of that frustration is overstating the case. If you want to say the game plays similar to 2k4, then you are correct.

07-29-2004, 10:53 AM	#69
frina Rookie OVR: 2 Join Date: Feb 2003	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... Quote: *EASegaRule said:* Absurd to you, perhaps, but that's what it feels like to me. They fixed the devastatingly awful running game from last year, but then they re-introduce the WR pass dropping problems from NFL2K3. Seems like they can't ever put the whole package together. The best thing I can say about the game is that it only cost 19 bucks. Boy for a guy who dislikes the game that much, you sure do spend a lot of time talking about it. Is VC paying for that space they have rented in your head?

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07-29-2004, 11:01 AM	#70
TombSong MVP OVR: 21 Join Date: Jul 2002	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... Fellas, I think to a large extent most of the people who are not enjoying the game are those who do not know how to play it, nor wish to learn how to play it. Some of the excuses I am hearing are way off. Sega has a bigger problem here that goes beyonf marketing or creating a game loaded with good features. There problem is Americans. Most of us are lazy by nature and having to deal with actually learning something is enough to turn most of us off. If these people cant play the game right out the box in 5 minutes, its not them, its the game that has the problem. I think this is why more people like Madden. Its a easier game to pick up and play. Thats why the games are so wide open, and high scoring. Madden is more a game of attrician than a game of football. Its a AI exploit fest. Whoever knows how to bust up the AI the best wins. (Go to any barber shop where they have the game hooked up (or just play online) and watch how they play) People that play that way should be made to suffer for playing that way. In ESPN you cant run around the pocket as long as you want, I dont HAVE to send a blitz after you to get pressure on the QB like you do in Madden. One thing I will say in defense of EA, they are doing things to prevent the garbage play by those who play that way. In NCAA I have noticed you cant call hot routes or audibles till the QB gets under center. THAT is a good idea and cuts down on the guys that are constantly audibling/hot routing.

07-29-2004, 11:01 AM	#71
EASegaRule Banned OVR: 2 Join Date: Jul 2004	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... Also, thank you for clarifying something for me. You have a problem w/ the gameplay because U DONT USE SLIDERS! People like you amaze me. You expect EA or Sega or any game company is supposed to create the game specifically for you out of the box and when it isnt up to your standards, you bitch about how its bad coding. Give me a break. There are plenty of people who play on all pro that have no problems with the drops in 2k5. You do have a problem with that but instead of adjusting a slider, you choose to come on this board and complain about it. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you're happy neutering your defense or offense to compensate for Sega's/EA's inability to code AI, then cool for you. People that happily accept a shoddy product amaze me.

07-29-2004, 11:12 AM	#72
aholbert32 (aka Alberto) OVR: 44 Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 33,173 Blog Entries: 8	Re: Reviewers not being honest.... Quote: *EASegaRule said:* Also, thank you for clarifying something for me. You have a problem w/ the gameplay because U DONT USE SLIDERS! People like you amaze me. You expect EA or Sega or any game company is supposed to create the game specifically for you out of the box and when it isnt up to your standards, you bitch about how its bad coding. Give me a break. There are plenty of people who play on all pro that have no problems with the drops in 2k5. You do have a problem with that but instead of adjusting a slider, you choose to come on this board and complain about it. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you're happy neutering your defense or offense to compensate for Sega's/EA's inability to code AI, then cool for you. People that happily accept a shoddy product amaze me. Bottom line: You'll never be happy. Keep waiting for the perfect football game.

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Reviewers not being honest....