MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

[Bard]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

As I am the Twins,if I had a chance to acquire a guy like Sale, I would easily give up Gordon and Jay to start and add onto that

Don't mean to sound like a jerk, but not sure what you're getting at here?

I think any team would give up their top two prospects for Sale. Not exactly what I was getting into.

I was more getting into how I at least feel about the Red Sox prospects. I would deal Espinoza + Benintendi + Kopech for Sale.

[GamecocksLaw17]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

As I am the Twins,if I had a chance to acquire a guy like Sale, I would easily give up Gordon and Jay to start and add onto that

Yeah, that doesn't scratch the surface. Need to be Sano/Buxton.

[k_mac]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

I honestly just think we're ready to stop counting on prospects and get talent that will help us now. I know I am.

I love both Swihart and Owens, but I wouldn't be sad to see them go anymore to be honest. They both used to be top prospects, and they both hold solid value, but we do need to add in an Epinoza or a Benintendi for an elite arm or bat.

You're right, Espinoza/Moncada/Benintendi are all in play if the Sox want a top of the rotation arm or a big bat. Probably two of the three plus some if we're talking an elite return. The notion that they're untouchable is quite silly to me. There's a difference between liking a player and not wanting to trade them and them being "untouchable." I'm not trying to direct this at you Bard, just a general assessment in the thread as a whole.

As for media reports linking the two Sox teams together, that's just someone connecting two very obvious dots. The White Sox have a very valuable major league asset.. The Red Sox have a very interesting bunch of minor league talent. Doesn't mean they're going after Sale or if they're even considering it. Any team with young talent is going to be the subject of media reports along the lines of "_____ (team) should trade for _____ (player)" with no actual relevance.

[Bard]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

You're right, Espinoza/Moncada/Benintendi are all in play if the Sox want a top of the rotation arm or a big bat. Probably two of the three plus some if we're talking an elite return. The notion that they're untouchable is quite silly to me. There's a difference between liking a player and not wanting to trade them and them being "untouchable." I'm not trying to direct this at you Bard, just a general assessment in the thread as a whole.

As for media reports linking the two Sox teams together, that's just someone connecting two very obvious dots. The White Sox have a very valuable major league asset.. The Red Sox have a very interesting bunch of minor league talent. Doesn't mean they're going after Sale or if they're even considering it. Any team with young talent is going to be the subject of media reports along the lines of "_____ (team) should trade for _____ (player)" with no actual relevance.

I will let you know that DD has come out saying these players are as close as untouchable as it comes. That is more than likely why a lot of people sway into that way of thinking. Heck, I would love to think Swihart + Owens + Espinoza would land Fernandez/Sale but in reality it won't. It just gets to the point of are you really willing to be realistic, and get hurt in a deal for an elite player.

And don't need a long post to say I agree with your second part.

[TheBigTee]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

As a sox fan I can add that betts and bogaerts are not going anywhere. There is absolutely no reason to trade either of them. The Red Sox have plenty of top prospects in the farm system to shop with if they choose to do so.


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[HolyStroke3]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

Close to the end of 2017 in my 30 team control (I play as Oakland), looking to move Josh Donaldson in the offseason. Bautista and Edwin left after '16, and Toronto has had a down (but not terrible) year. He's under team control through '18 then will hit free agency. Obviously Toronto would need a big return. Any ideas of a club with the assets to realistically do it?

[CBoller1331]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

Close to the end of 2017 in my 30 team control (I play as Oakland), looking to move Josh Donaldson in the offseason. Bautista and Edwin left after '16, and Toronto has had a down (but not terrible) year. He's under team control through '18 then will hit free agency. Obviously Toronto would need a big return. Any ideas of a club with the assets to realistically do it?

What teams need a 3B in your franchise?

[AC]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

I will let you know that DD has come out saying these players are as close as untouchable as it comes.

I don't know why people put so much faith in what GMs say in the media. It's PR. What are they gonna say, "It's unlikely that our guys are as valuable as that guy so we'd love to make that trade?"

[Bard]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

I don't know why people put so much faith in what GMs say in the media. It's PR. What are they gonna say, "It's unlikely that our guys are as valuable as that guy so we'd love to make that trade?"

I trust he won't bash our guys for obvious reasons, and he is an open dealer. Kinda explains itself here.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

How the mighty have fallen..

I remember when Swihart was the catcher of the future and both him and Owens were the type of "high end talent" that wouldn't be traded for anything short of *insert incredibly valuable superstar here*.

Also, Sale >>>>>> Gray.

I've mentioned this once or twice before in here because this 'trade Swihart in every deal' thing is so bizarre, but 18 months ago Red Sox fans were more likely to cut you, to give you the old shiv, over suggesting they include Swihart in a trade package. I can remember the "what do you mean his POT is less than 95?!?!?" posts in roster threads. Now, he's just like movie popcorn that gets dumped all over the floor. And the kicker is that these same fans are still maintaining he has some really nice value (the main piece for Sale? lololol) even though defense only Christian Vazquez (batting .221/.257/.310 this year with a career wRC+ of 59 in just 353 MLB PA) has basically taken over instead of Swihart. Vazquez's offense is so bad, that he's providing negative fWAR despite his defense. If Swihart can't get playing time over a catcher that's hitting like a pitcher, what does that say to a prospective trade partner? Do you think they'll line up to give you ace pitchers and middle-of-the-order sluggers to get this guy?

Six months from now, when these same fans realize Vazquez can't hit at all, then he'll appear in all the trade proposals. I'm calling that one.

[ItAllFades]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

Boston's prospects have always been vastly overrated by their fans and the East Coast media. Every team overrates their own prospects, but the Red Sox's fans seem to be some of the worst. Everyone in their system is "untouchable" or "can't miss" and they think they can get any player in the league without giving up anything of value. For every Betts, there have been dozens of other guys who were "the next big thing" and flopped.

Swihart joins a nice long line of recent can't misses who missed:
Lars Anderson
Ryan Lavarnway
Anthony Ranaudo
Will Middlebrooks
Garin Cecchini
George Kottaras
Ryan Westmoreland (not his fault, but still)
Craig Hansen
Led Lowrie (He's a decent player, but was talked up as being way more than he has been up to this point in his career)
Ryan Kalish

Some of these guys have done more than others, and some were hyped more than others, but most of them were touted as being "sure things". Like I said, every team overvalues prospects, but the Red Sox have the annoying ability to overdue it thanks to the media.

[GamecocksLaw17]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

Boston's prospects have always been vastly overrated by their fans and the East Coast media. Every team overrates their own prospects, but the Red Sox's fans seem to be some of the worst. Everyone in their system is "untouchable" or "can't miss" and they think they can get any player in the league without giving up anything of value. For every Betts, there have been dozens of other guys who were "the next big thing" and flopped.

Swihart joins a nice long line of recent can't misses who missed:
Lars Anderson
Ryan Lavarnway
Anthony Ranaudo
Will Middlebrooks
Garin Cecchini
George Kottaras
Ryan Westmoreland (not his fault, but still)
Craig Hansen
Led Lowrie (He's a decent player, but was talked up as being way more than he has been up to this point in his career)
Ryan Kalish

Some of these guys have done more than others, and some were hyped more than others, but most of them were touted as being "sure things". Like I said, every team overvalues prospects, but the Red Sox have the annoying ability to overdue it thanks to the media.

To be fair to Boston fans, this issue isn't strictly about them. Mets fans think they can get an elite bat while keeping Thor/deGrom/Harvey/Matz/Wheeler. Braves fans think Benintendi AND Moncada are fair value for Teheran. Yankees fans think they will get Schwarber/Gallo/Giolito/Robles for Chapman or Miller (Thanks Buster Olney). It just seems to be an overwhelming issue that people want to improve their team by giving spare parts.


So when we shoot your proposals down it isn't because we enjoy raining on anyone's parade, it is just to give the actual perceived value of the players asked about. If you have specific prospects/young players who are off limits that's completely fine, but you've got to realize that those limitations also cut the player pool you can choose from considerably.

[Zim]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

I understand what you guys are saying and I agree that some Red Sox fans over value some prospects. That being said it is way to early to call Swihart a bust. He was progressing perfectly fine for a young catcher before being demoted for really no good reason. He should still be catching for the MLB team Vaz should still be in AAA but someone decided to stick a guy with an above average catcher bat but average OF bat in LF.

I think it is still possible for Swihart to right the ship and end up a pretty good switch hitting catcher. It may not be for Boston though since they seem to be screwing up his development about as badly as you could.

Lets not call a guy with a 271 batting average who only has 380 PA in the majors a bust just yet.

On a side note, anyone else have feedback on my trade from page 327?

[GamecocksLaw17]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

I understand what you guys are saying and I agree that some Red Sox fans over value some prospects. That being said it is way to early to call Swihart a bust. He was progressing perfectly fine for a young catcher before being demoted for really no good reason. He should still be catching for the MLB team Vaz should still be in AAA but someone decided to stick a guy with an above average catcher bat but average OF bat in LF.

I think it is still possible for Swihart to right the ship and end up a pretty good switch hitting catcher. It may not be for Boston though since they seem to be screwing up his development about as badly as you could.

Lets not call a guy with a 271 batting average who only has 380 PA in the majors a bust just yet.

On a side note, anyone else have feedback on my trade from page 327?

Don't think your package gets it done. Vizcaino has elite closer value, and that means Kopech won't cut it. If they were to get that package I believe they would keep their players. It doesn't make sense to package your 2 best trade assets together unless you get blown away. Benintendi is likely a bit of an overpay for Teheran on his own, but Vizcaino has substantially more value than Kopech. Look at what top end closers have gotten on the trade market recently. With the team control it would get a good package of prospects for just Vizcaino.


I think it would make more sense for the Braves to not package those two together.

[Tmizzle]

Re: MLB 16 Trade Discussion Thread

Don't mean to sound like a jerk, but not sure what you're getting at here?

I think any team would give up their top two prospects for Sale. Not exactly what I was getting into.

I was more getting into how I at least feel about the Red Sox prospects. I would deal Espinoza + Benintendi + Kopech for Sale.

I was stating that example as people don't want to give up top talent talent to get top talent back. People talking about Blake and Owens who are hyped players and ony have B potential. I was stating I would easily offer both Nick Gordon and Tyler Jay who are both top 5 prospects in my system with A potential to start and then add onto it.