2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

[AC]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Here's an ESPN article on the matter

Perez for Pap sounds good.

Oi, a concussion? That probably won't affect him as much long term but I had one over a year ago and my vision is still blurry, so this is understandable. (and no, it doesn't stop me from playing sports, I'm not worried about this injury, Josh Thole sustained a concussion last year and is putting up a 141 wRC+ in AAA, you could regress him to a .300 BABIP and he'd be hitting like .280)

[CameRoN0407]

Responses in bold, guys.

Read the article.


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[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I refuse to give up on this debate until WTNY sees the light lol.

Regardless of it Bard does the trade or not, I still consider it legit.

Now if you could convince me Papelbon was done as an effective pitcher and could not help the Rangers in high leverage situations in the playoffs the next couple of years, I might relent. But that's a fairly large if.

You are big on attributing dollar values to wins, so if Papelbon goes 2.0 WAR (best case) for the next 3 years hypothetically with Texas, that what $30M of value? But if the Rangers win 1 or 2 World Series in those years, how do you rationalize that marginal, additional value? Worth a mid B/high B/low A 1B/3B/RF with "bad eyes"? Sure, THAT's why he's striking out so much! LOL

You know the irony of this whole situation though, even though I disagree about Olt's real world value...I actually traded for Olt in my Astros 'chise and he's putting up a top-20 MVP candidate season. .315, 33 HR, 95 RBI. So, at least in my universe that'd be far more valuable than Papelbon! It's not reality though.

[bwoodring9]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Hopefully me not using 30 team control this year doesn't screw up my franchise.

[bwoodring9]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I've already seen Victor MArtinez, Al Alburquerque, and Doug Fister traded for Autin Hedges, MAx Fried, and Carson Kelly

[AC]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

It's not my narrative, bro. If you'd read scouting reports on him before making your opinion you'd see that. Several scouts question his future at 3B. Pretty simple narrative. He may be able to play there. He may not. I don't recall saying his defense was atrocious or anything.

I have read scouting reports, I've actually watched video on him, and...

Plus plus glove at 3B...hmmm...are we still talking about Mike Olt?

I've seen the words "fringe," "passable," and "average" tossed about in regard to his defense. Even the most optimistic projections grade him at a 60/80 on his defense. So maybe above average, but certainly not two plusses, probably not 1 plus either.

Yeah, because "fringe" and "are we talking about Mike Olt" are definitely positive reviews. And if you thought his defense was maybe above average, why the hell are you pushing Olt-to-1B?

I'm just saying, if Olt was going to be a major force, he'd be one by now. Papelbon was a key part of the Sox bullpen already at 24.

Okay, so how's that even slightly relevant, pray tell?

Travis d'Arnaud is 24? BUSTBUSTBUSTBUSTBUST

Don't you think the Rangers would have him on the DL if he was hurt? I mean seriously, why would they have one of their better prospects be grinding out AAA at bats with a bum set of eyes? That makes zero sense.

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/08/rangers-prospect-mike-olt-is-on-the-triple-a-disabled-list-with-vision-problems/

They had him on the DL, and he's coming back, and he's obviously getting readjusted.

As for the small sample, we'll see what happens as it grows.

lol that's an argument if we've ever seen one! Tell me, how do you think his .230 BABIP And 0.0% HR/FB will project long term? Sustainable?

But if he's as good as everyone says he is, he probably shouldn't even play a month or two this poorly.

Aaaaaaaaaaand we've reached complete ignorance. Willy Mays started his career 1-26. Jesus. It's baseball. There are slumps. Seriously?

[G3no_11]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Lol you were the one to bring up age discrimination, yet you are holding Olt's age against him.

He's 24.. it is perfectly ok for him to still be in AAA, especially when you are behind Beltre, Moreland, and Berkman. Just because he's still in AAA, doesn't mean he can't become a great player. You are just throwing things out there at this point.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Read the article.


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I dunno man. Thanks for the article, but it sounds fishy. If he had the type of concussion that screws with his eyes that bad, I SERIOUSLY DOUBT he would have tried to play through it or that his team/wife-girlfriend/teammates would have let him play through it. If it were that bad to affect his vision, he'd probably be stumbling around and have all kinds of other symptoms (nausea) that would be easier to diagnose--and it wouldn't be by eye doctors, it'd be by regular sports medicine/physicians.Those types of concussions are career-enders sometimes too.

[mockme]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Looking to add a right-handed bat with some pop to come off the bench for my Cardinals. Shane Robinson's got no power and Wigginton just isn't cutting it. Would also be nice if the player could play OF due to Beltran going down with injury for a couple of months. I called up Taveras, and he's raking, but he's a lefty and also in the starting line-up. I'm thinking Guzman from the Padres or Willingham. Would they be available and any suggestions for deals?

Also might be looking to add at shortstop and would like to ask for potential players there. Kozma's been productive enough, but I'm trying to think of a plan to upgrade there in case he slumps and I'm in the playoff hunt.

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Lol you were the one to bring up age discrimination, yet you are holding Olt's age against him.

He's 24.. it is perfectly ok for him to still be in AAA, especially when you are behind Beltre, Moreland, and Berkman. Just because he's still in AAA, doesn't mean he can't become a great player. You are just throwing things out there at this point.

Here's the thing. Most 24-year olds that are going to be great are already producing in the bigs.

My argument was performance-based. If he's not performing by 24 it's unlikely he will reach his ceiling.

However, the case against Papelbon was just he's old and washed up and expensive. I haven't seen anything to support his being ineffective. So, the argument against Papelbon is purely age-related. Not performance-related.

AC mentioned something about Papelbon "becoming more hittable" but hasn't produced anything to back that up yet.

It's true, players decline as they age, but many players (especially relievers where athleticism is not front and center) can have unique decline curves.

[AC]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I've already seen Victor MArtinez, Al Alburquerque, and Doug Fister traded for Autin Hedges, MAx Fried, and Carson Kelly

That's not the worst trade I've ever seen. It's just unfair.

Now if you could convince me Papelbon was done as an effective pitcher

He isn't, though, he's just really ****ing expensive to make a minimal impact on his team's success, it's not that hard.

You are big on attributing dollar values to wins, so if Papelbon goes 2.0 WAR (best case) for the next 3 years hypothetically with Texas, that what $30M of value? But if the Rangers win 1 or 2 World Series in those years, how do you rationalize that marginal, additional value?

Hahaha, you're expecting 2 wins per season from a reliever. It's pretty ridiculous to EXPECT that. By the way, should I link you to some nice aging curves?

Worth a mid B/high B/low A 1B/3B/RF with "bad eyes"? Sure, THAT's why he's striking out so much! LOL

Let's use the word "LOL" to distract from the fact that we have 0 idea of reliever value, positional values, the fact that strikeouts can exist while being successful (unless Mike Trout's 21.8 K% devalues his 2012)!

[CameRoN0407]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I dunno man. Thanks for the article, but it sounds fishy. If he had the type of concussion that screws with his eyes that bad, I SERIOUSLY DOUBT he would have tried to play through it or that his team/wife-girlfriend/teammates would have let him play through it. If it were that bad to affect his vision, he'd probably be stumbling around and have all kinds of other symptoms (nausea) that would be easier to diagnose--and it wouldn't be bye eye doctors, it'd be by regular sports medicine/physicians.Those types of concussions are career-enders sometimes too.

Fishy? It's ESPN, one of the most trusted sports websites. If your talking about Olt's story, why would someone, mind you, a TOP PROSPECT lie about an injury? He's practically got it made! He probably thought it was just a little thing that would come and go, but it was bigger. I don't think he's lying.

[bpayton97]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

What would be the best trade to get Giancarlo Stanton and David Price to the Rangers? I'm thinking Jurickson Profar and Mike Olt will be the two main pieces for these two trades to help out the Rangers current team.

[CameRoN0407]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

What would be the best trade to get Giancarlo Stanton and David Price to the Rangers? I'm thinking Jurickson Profar and Mike Olt will be the two main pieces for these two trades to help out the Rangers current team.

You will have to chose one. The Rangers cannot get both. Giancarlo trade is a few pages back (use the search function). I'll get back to you on Price later.

EDIT:
Price for Profar Olt and Buckel or Perez

[HozAndMoose]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Fishy? It's ESPN, one of the most trusted sports websites. If your talking about Olt's story, why would someone, mind you, a TOP PROSPECT lie about an injury? He's practically got it made! He probably thought it was just a little thing that would come and go, but it was bigger. I don't think he's lying.

Not really sure ESPN is one of the most trusted.