2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

[AC]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I'd be interested in dealing for Hardy. What do you think it would take to get him? Boggs+C? Any suggestions for that power hitting outfielder who could come off the bench?

A prospect SP, B POT. Low B, specifically. Who are you willing to give?

.247 AVG/ .329 OBP/ .352 SLG

Strop 2.70 ERA/ 63.1 IP/ .209 AVG/ 2 HR/ 7.82 K/9

I'll find someone for Venters.

Give them Gould + C prospect for Utley.

Strop's still not worth that but that's better than I had assumed

[mockme]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

A prospect SP, B POT. Low B, specifically. Who are you willing to give?

Seth Maness and Tyrell Jenkins are the only B-rated prospects I have. Maness is more major league ready and has seen time with the big league club both in real life and in my franchise, while Jenkins is more highly rated. One of those two would be fine, as the pitching staff overall is pretty good.

About that power bat, I was thinking Josh Willingham. On the chart his value is set as a Low B. Could that be replaced by two Mid/High C's? The Twins are pretty much out of it so a couple of prospects should be fine, no?

[AC]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Seth Maness and Tyrell Jenkins are the only B-rated prospects I have. Maness is more major league ready and has seen time with the big league club both in real life and in my franchise, while Jenkins is more highly rated. One of those two would be fine, as the pitching staff overall is pretty good.

About that power bat, I was thinking Josh Willingham. On the chart his value is set as a Low B. Could that be replaced by two Mid/High C's? The Twins are pretty much out of it so a couple of prospects should be fine, no?

Maness is a good fit.

Two high C's and a mid C for willingham if you don't want to give the B.

[mockme]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Maness is a good fit.

Two high C's and a mid C for willingham if you don't want to give the B.

Sounds good to me. Thanks a lot for your help!

[cookingood]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I'm having trouble finding anything with the search tool but I know David Price has been discussed in this thread multiple times. Sorry for bringing him up again. I'm playing with the Rays and I want to get a good catcher and some other pieces for David Price.

[mgcst5]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I'm having trouble finding anything with the search tool but I know David Price has been discussed in this thread multiple times. Sorry for bringing him up again. I'm playing with the Rays and I want to get a good catcher and some other pieces for David Price.

That depends. Are you looking for a major league ready catcher or a prospect?

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Pretty great debate going on here.

If I may chime in.

All initial reports on Olt's defense have been very positive. He isn't expected to be a game changer but he won't hurt you out there. A site that I have come to trust is Baseballprospectnation, while some will question the validity of there reports (as with any site) I tend to agree with a lot of there opinions http://baseballprospectnation.com/20...t-mike-olt-3b/
and they happen to label his glove as a plus.

Additionally, his bat, while not spectacular, definitely plays, especially in a hitters park (Philly would be a good desitination and Texas is even better) He is projected around 25 Homeruns in a neutral environment.

His age is far from irrelevant but and at 24 he probably doesn't have an immensely high ceiling but that shouldn't hurt his value too much considering he still profiles pretty well at 3rd.

Concerning Pap, AC is right, as a reliever (and an expensive one) he doesn't offer as much value, not nonexistent, but not as much as Olt.

One more thing relating to Olt's age, as previously said his ceiling isn't super high but not every "top" prospect needs to be a star. There is an incredible amount of value coming from the support players that put up stats in the middle tier of good players, for example Zobrist has been second in the league in WAR over the last several years, I am not a strong supporter of Sabermetrics for reasons I don't feel like getting into, but it definitely shows how a support player can provide a ton of value instead of a star.

If you disagree please do so respectfully because I am just trying to be a part of this debate.

Nice post. Even though I disagree with the ultimate conclusion (that Papelbon is not worth Olt), you made a compelling case. I like Zobrist a lot too, not a lot of people know he's the MLB leader in WAR over the past, what, 3-5 years or something? He's a switch hitter and plays basically all positions other than catcher so that all helps too.

So right now none of my right handed batters can actually hit for any power. David Wright is doing OK.. but i need another right handed power bat.So any suggestions on a Right Handed Power Bat, and middle infielder that is all defense that i can use at the end of the game?

Power bats that are available has been discussed a lot recently: Willingham, Soriano, Justin Maxwell, Kyle Blanks are some guys to look into.

All-glove IFs: John McDonald, Darwin Barney, Brendan Ryan, Brandon Crawford are some starter names.

Hey, you guys, before I go ahead with that JPA for Grimm + Soto trade, does anyone think Ryan Hanigan is a realistic target about 3 weeks into the season?

I think it's quite possible. It would depend a little on their record but not much. If you send JPA, it would be perfectly fine for them to use Mesoraco and Arencibia together.

I'm having trouble finding anything with the search tool but I know David Price has been discussed in this thread multiple times. Sorry for bringing him up again. I'm playing with the Rays and I want to get a good catcher and some other pieces for David Price.

It's ok. Price trades are fun to think about.

Some teams that might have interest in trading for Price: Texas, Yankees, Red Sox, Orioles, Dodgers, Rockies, Cardinals, Nationals.

I don't see him moving in the division so scratch Boston/O's/NYY.

Maybe the only teams with a really good, available catcher on the list would be Wilson Ramos of the Nats and Wilin Rosario of the Rockies. Molina is not available. A.J. Ellis is a meh/good catcher on the Dodgers.

If you want a C prospect, maybe add the D'Backs (Trahan) and the Phillies (Valle or Joseph). Alfaro in Texas would be a nice catch.

So maybe look at the Rockies, D'Backs, Nats, and Rangers a bit.

[mgcst5]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Nice post. Even though I disagree with the ultimate conclusion (that Papelbon is not worth Olt), you made a compelling case. I like Zobrist a lot too, not a lot of people know he's the MLB leader in WAR over the past, what, 3-5 years or something? He's a switch hitter and plays basically all positions other than catcher so that all helps too.

I appreciate that man, and I can get the high value for Pap I just don't trust closers. Very few have long sustained success like Rivera, especially lately. Too me they kinda seem like kickers in football, not super noticeable unless they do some thing unreal or F**K up. Also like kickers, good, or at least solid, ones are easier to find than people think. The article below supports my point.

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2013-05-19/sports/39376642_1_closers-pitcher-nba-finals

I am not saying that Paps isnt really valuable but I think his high price tag brings his value down significantly and I dont see him being heaps and bounds better than Joe Nathan and definitely not better than Feliz when healthy. But thats just my opinion.

If you need more support to that closers are kinda easy to find just look at the Rays bullpen the past several years. Pretty much put together with ducktape and spit but they always seem to find someone to be a decent closer (Ex. Rodney, Soriano, even Farnsworth was solid)

Speaking of the Rays:

I was thinking about the Price trade. An idea I had was Profar, Olt (haha he wont go away), Perez, and Soto. That way OP gets a catcher that is solid in the game (I edited him down but hes still better than Molina) and a great haul of prospects.

Edit: or if he is looking for a prospect just drop Perez and add Arfalo and maybe a mid-high C

[nowitsourtime]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

If Seattle is contention, Montero or Zunino could be a great option at C to get back in a Price trade

[WaitTilNextYear]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

I appreciate that man, and I can get the high value for Pap I just don't trust closers. Very few have long sustained success like Rivera, especially lately. Too me they kinda seem like kickers in football, not super noticeable unless they do some thing unreal or F**K up. Also like kickers, good, or at least solid, ones are easier to find than people think. The article below supports my point.

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2013-05-19/sports/39376642_1_closers-pitcher-nba-finals

I am not saying that Paps isnt really valuable but I think his high price tag brings his value down significantly and I dont see him being heaps and bounds better than Joe Nathan and definitely not better than Feliz when healthy. But thats just my opinion.

If you need more support to that closers are kinda easy to find just look at the Rays bullpen the past several years. Pretty much put together with ducktape and spit but they always seem to find someone to be a decent closer (Ex. Rodney, Soriano, even Farnsworth was solid)

I'm not debating that Olt will have a higher career WAR than Papelbon will have from here on out. Given how that formula works, something catastrophic would have to happen for Olt not to. What I'm more implying is that we shouldn't be so persuaded by one stat like WAR.

My main point is for a team like Texas that is a postseason threat each year, adding that one key late inning piece (such as Papelbon) that could've got them by Oakland last year and can hold down leads in tight games that are more important than WAR can really measure would be of value.

And when we're discussing WAR to begin with for a contender, it's flawed. How many contending teams really are trotting out replacement level players? So, when we talk about "WAR" for a team like Texas, it's really wins-above-Moreland or wins-above-Berkman that are more relevant.

The main thing I'd ask is, would having Olt as a bench bat or marginal starter at 1B for the next 3-4 years be more valuable to Texas than adding a closer that could help them win a key playoff game perhaps (a playoff win is worth a lot more than a regular season win, something else WAR fails to acknowledge) while their window to win now is wide open?

Fact is people are saying relievers aren't valuable because they have low WAR because they don't pitch enough innings. BUT who among us would be happy heading into postseason baseball if our team had a fairly weak closer? To me, that means relievers have some value that is not accounted for properly. I think Nathan is ok, but remember in the original post this whole debate came from, there were several injuries to Texas' pen.

Speaking of the Rays:

I was thinking about the Price trade. An idea I had was Profar, Olt (haha he wont go away), Perez, and Soto. That way OP gets a catcher that is solid in the game (I edited him down but hes still better than Molina) and a great haul of prospects.

Edit: or if he is looking for a prospect just drop Perez and add Arfalo and maybe a mid-high C

I don't think he was specific, but I shied away from Texas precisely because I thought Soto and A.J. would be unappealing to someone looking specifically for a catcher. I do agree that Texas is a natural trading partner for Price.

Responses in bold.

[mgcst5]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Responses in bold.

I don't disagree that WAR is an overated statistic, especially in this situation, and I didn't see the part about the injuries to the Pen, I just think that it is a slight overpayment to send Olt, who currently is a bench bat, but long term projects to be a solid starter, for a closer. This has nothing to do with WAR but more with postion value in my opinion. A closer is definitely useful and I do think that Olt should be traded but I just dont think the two match up for that particular trade. I would think that a more realistic option would be a couple of the high risk/high reward guys that Texas has in the lower minors. If Philly is selling Paps they are probably starting the rebuild and while Olt would be a great block I just think that value wise (not talking about WAR but the indescribable value that is tied to each and every prospect) Texas wouldn't be getting a fair deal. If Philly offered to eat some of the salary (which I know you cant do in this game) it would probably even it up. I respect your opinion on the matter because I think WAR, as with a lot of Sabermetrics, are a flawed statistic. I just wouldn't take that trade unless Feliz, Soria, and Nathan injuries were long-term/career ending and the team was otherwise ideally suited to compete for a title (which despite there success IRL i don't think they particularly are as they are missing a few pieces I think are really important.) But that is just my opinion.

[geisterhome]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Hey guys, I'm looking to trade for a power hitter for my Royals. Nobody like Stanton or so, I don't want to give up my entire farm system. Any suggestions who that could be and what a fair trade could look like?

If the Jays are out of it Bautista or Encarnacion? I saw an article on MLBTR earlier that said they felt like they could be moved this year if the Jays are out of it. Josh Willingham is another name that comes to mind, idk how you feel about trading within the division though...

Seth Smith of the A's comes to mind. Jesus Guzman of the Padres has some pop as well

Josh Willingham? Mark Trumbo? Lucas Duda?

What about someone like Nelson Cruz? Any chance you guys think the Rangers would give him up this year - at least looking at the spreadsheet it certainly wouldn't gut the farm to acquire him.

Josh Willingham, Corey Hart, Chris Young, Ryan Ludwick, Alfonso Soriano, Matt Joyce are just some names to get you started

Thanks for all the input guys! Some very interesting names there. What do you think about Dan Uggla and Justin Morneau, any realistic if I would trade for one of them?

[emcee143]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Chris Young just went down in my franchise for 2 months right at the all star break. Reddick and Morneau have 13 and 14 hrs respectively but losing Chris Young hurts my outfield since Coco has been relegated to the bench since he's playing so bad, and I don't trust Michael Choice just yet.

Who is a good rental to go for? I was thinking Alex Rios since the White Sox are out of contention

[yankecrazy]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Trade #2
NYY Trades:
- SP Corey Black (High C)

KC Trades:
- RP Tim Collins (worth High C)

Went through with this trade (Kontos trade would happen later), Collins proceeded to K 4 in 1.2 IP. Awesome.

[AC]

Re: 2013 The Show Official Trade Discussion Thread

Thanks for all the input guys! Some very interesting names there. What do you think about Dan Uggla and Justin Morneau, any realistic if I would trade for one of them?

Morneau would be more realistic, and I actually really like the idea of Morneau. What team are you again?

Chris Young just went down in my franchise for 2 months right at the all star break. Reddick and Morneau have 13 and 14 hrs respectively but losing Chris Young hurts my outfield since Coco has been relegated to the bench since he's playing so bad, and I don't trust Michael Choice just yet.

Who is a good rental to go for? I was thinking Alex Rios since the White Sox are out of contention

Not a trade, but could you sign Grady Sizemore? Reed Johnson is a cost effective option as well.

You could always make a huge splash and go for Ellsbury or Granderson. More so Ellsbury, because he'll probably be traded regardless of if the Sox are in contention.

If I were you, I'd go for Ellsbury or Sizemore.

I'm having trouble finding anything with the search tool but I know David Price has been discussed in this thread multiple times. Sorry for bringing him up again. I'm playing with the Rays and I want to get a good catcher and some other pieces for David Price.

Nah, no big deal. To the Rangers for Alfaro + Profar + Olt + Grimm?

Nice post. Even though I disagree with the ultimate conclusion (that Papelbon is not worth Olt), you made a compelling case. I like Zobrist a lot too, not a lot of people know he's the MLB leader in WAR over the past, what, 3-5 years or something? He's a switch hitter and plays basically all positions other than catcher so that all helps too.

Not starting the Olt debate again unless you want to, but I just wanted to touch on the fact that Ben Zobrist is easily the most underrated player in baseball. He's probably one of the best and I hope the Jays go hard for him in 2014.

I think it's quite possible. It would depend a little on their record but not much. If you send JPA, it would be perfectly fine for them to use Mesoraco and Arencibia together.

Actually, since I don't think they'd platoon the two, and I really like the idea of Justin Grimm, how's this for a three way trade?

To the Rangers: J.P. Arencibia, Darren Oliver, Chris Heisey
To the Reds: Daniel Murphy, Anthony Alford, Geovanni Soto
To the Blue Jays: Ryan Hanigan, Justin Grimm

What do you think of that? The Rangers get the platoon advantage I talked about earlier while clearing out a spot for a top prospect (Kinsler to LF, Profar to 2B), a solid LOOGY who loves Texas so much that he's a whiny little bitch about it, and a nice bat off the bench.

The Reds get a solid LF to replace Heisey - hell, he's a significant upgrade on Heisey - to go along with a superb OF prospect in Alford and a very underrated back-up catcher to provide insurance / tutoring to Mesoraco.

The Blue Jays get pitch-framing, catcher-defense extraordinaire Ryan Hanigan, who I don't hate with a passion, who can kinda hit and will uplift my pitching staff (for whatever reason there IS a hidden game calling attribute, this was discussed last year and JPA has a good one too I think, Soto probably as well). I also get the young, almost ready depth pitcher I wanted in Justin Grimm.

Everyone okay with this?