Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

Ksig,

Did you read my write up yet, and did you get any games in last night?

[ksig24]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

H&V, I did read your post and I will re-read it right now. I got hooked on the classic pitching because of this thread and specifically your post on pg 5.

So what are your thoughts? Are you going to help me out and figure this thing out or am I headed back to meter?

I'm on all day!

And no I wasnt fortunate enough to get any games in last night.

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

H&V, I did read your post and I will re-read it right now. I got hooked on the classic pitching because of this thread and specifically your post on pg 5.

So what are your thoughts? Are you going to help me out and figure this thing out or am I headed back to meter?

I'm on all day!

And no I wasnt fortunate enough to get any games in last night.

Thus far, albeit Friday, it's dead at work and I have about the next 4-5 hours free.

I can give you pointers, but Legend difficulty level will over ride some of my advice to a degree. So keep this in mind.

If I understand it correctly, you generally use a custom roster; playing mostly minor leagues (which is awesome. Would LOVE to see your edits). What I will say is that unless you were generous in your re-rates, and applied them to the control and BB /9 ratings - leaving ratings decreases generally meant to simulate progression at a minimum - you WILL have a hard time throwing strikes realistically.

Especially on Legend.

Out of the box, I strongly believe that AA/AAA are not intended to be interacted with under the hopes that stats will be accurate.

For this, and this reason only, I feel regressed ratings to be a glaring example of how the minor league player ratings system is flawed. Sure, players progress into themselves. But they currently are NOT themselves (if that makes sense?).

Statistically, AA and AAA is flawed without major edits if your intent is to play these games out.

How are you handling this?

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

I also just want to say that I think I over emphasized my opinion on lightly tapping X. I generally press X about 1/3 to vibration about 55% of the time. I get to or around max effort (3/3) about 25% of the time, and lightly tap X (essentially 0/3 to vibration) 20% of the time.

A few other notes:

1. Consistency will be your strike frequency slider. I have seen no noticable impact on CPU batting average upon raising this slider one click. H/9 are identical. Strike percentage is approximately 3-4% better.

2. I cannot over state how important overall and pitch confidence is. Go with what is working often. Build up what isn't in safe situations or use them as suprises (again, in safe situations).

3. Effort variation is crucial for strikeouts, as well as wasting pitches. Note: When I waste, I HARDLY EVER use max effort.

4. If a walk is the worst possible outcome, I throw it down broadway (essentially) 3-0 and 3-1.

[ILiveForThis]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

I, also, can be a help if is needed. I may not have as good as tips as Heroes, but I can do my darnedest.

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

Nice.

Let's help this scout out!!!

@Iliveforthis- Is your Cooperstown set on Legend difficulty?

@Ksig- Could you possibly post on here while playing a game of knockout or playing a simulated game simultaneously. I want you to have that "Aha!" moment before I leave here today. If you're near your PS3, we can give you tips live.

[ksig24]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

Thus far, albeit Friday, it's dead at work and I have about the next 4-5 hours free.

I can give you pointers, but Legend difficulty level will over ride some of my advice to a degree. So keep this in mind.

If I understand it correctly, you generally use a custom roster; playing mostly minor leagues (which is awesome. Would LOVE to see your edits). What I will say is that unless you were generous in your re-rates, and applied them to the control and BB /9 ratings - leaving ratings decreases generally meant to simulate progression at a minimum - you WILL have a hard time throwing strikes realistically.

Especially on Legend.

Out of the box, I strongly believe that AA/AAA are not intended to be interacted with under the hopes that stats will be accurate.

For this, and this reason only, I feel regressed ratings to be a glaring example of how the minor league player ratings system is flawed. Sure, players progress into themselves. But they currently are NOT themselves (if that makes sense?).

Statistically, AA and AAA is flawed without major edits if your intent is to play these games out.

How are you handling this?

To be honest I didnt know that I was playing on Legend. I think that the old sliders I was using was a combination of All-Star and HOF which worked well for me. I just love the feel of the Cooperstown set, minus pitching.

I certainly do use a custom roster and most always play Minor League games trying to figure out exactly what does what and how to properly emulate it in game play as well as simulation...which I must add that I rarely sim.

My edits and re-rates are not generous at all, but they used to be because I thought that SCEA had some magic ingredient that they were holding out on us about, but come to realize that the engines are far from perfected. I used to have 70's, and 80's rankings galore, but not any longer especially with the progression factors. I am also in colaboration with Scott and his rating system using ZIPS projections.

I threw a game with Bauer the other night and couldnt hit the broad side of a barn with him and ended up getting shelled.

"Sure, players progress into themselves. But they currently are NOT themselves (if that makes sense?)." This makes perfect sense!

[ksig24]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

I also just want to say that I think I over emphasized my opinion on lightly tapping X. I generally press X about 1/3 to vibration about 55% of the time. I get to or around max effort (3/3) about 25% of the time, and lightly tap X (essentially 0/3 to vibration) 20% of the time.

A few other notes:

1. Consistency will be your strike frequency slider. I have seen no noticable impact on CPU batting average upon raising this slider one click. H/9 are identical. Strike percentage is approximately 3-4% better.

2. I cannot over state how important overall and pitch confidence is. Go with what is working often. Build up what isn't in safe situations or use them as suprises (again, in safe situations).

3. Effort variation is crucial for strikeouts, as well as wasting pitches. Note: When I waste, I HARDLY EVER use max effort.

4. If a walk is the worst possible outcome, I throw it down broadway (essentially) 3-0 and 3-1.

I dont have a controller that vibrates. Its wireless....or is there a way to turn on vibration?

[ksig24]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

Nice.

Let's help this scout out!!!

@Iliveforthis- Is your Cooperstown set on Legend difficulty?

@Ksig- Could you possibly post on here while playing a game of knockout or playing a simulated game simultaneously. I want you to have that "Aha!" moment before I leave here today. If you're near your PS3, we can give you tips live.

That would be pretty sweet, but unfortunately I moved offices and no longer have the PS3 in mine.

What time zones are you guys on? I will play some tonight when I get home around 7 PST

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

I'm a little torn about this Legend thing. Here's a question that you need to give some serious consideration:

If you were able to throw more strikes, and more strikes ALONE, do you feel like the CPU hits the way you want them to?

If you are POSITIVE, raise Consistency a click.

If you think the CPU hits for too high an average, or flat out doesn't feel like baseball players, you HAVE to drop a level.

Is your controller the dual-shock or the axis something-or-other (sorry, the name escapes me at the moment)? If it says "dual shock", it vibrates. Remember, max effort is a one second count. Always, for all pitchers.

I live in VT, so I'm EST. It's 3:41 here, so I have until about 7PM. Perhaps I can catch you tomorrow (day off for me, minus a small commute for some leisure time).

[ksig24]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

I'm a little torn about this Legend thing. Here's a question that you need to give some serious consideration:

If you were able to throw more strikes, and more strikes ALONE, do you feel like the CPU hits the way you want them to?

If you are POSITIVE, raise Consistency a click.

If you think the CPU hits for too high an average, or flat out doesn't feel like baseball players, you HAVE to drop a level.

Is your controller the dual-shock or the axis something-or-other (sorry, the name escapes me at the moment)? If it says "dual shock", it vibrates. Remember, max effort is a one second count. Always, for all pitchers.

I live in VT, so I'm EST. It's 3:41 here, so I have until about 7PM. Perhaps I can catch you tomorrow (day off for me, minus a small commute for some leisure time).

I have the six-axis controller. Does it have a vibe feature?

I guess I dont really know if the hitters feel like hitters or not? On meter or pulse I can rack up k's on any level, but any level using classis I simply cannot throw many k's or hit my spots with regularity.

VT huh! The guy that cooked for us last night when to the NE Culinary Institue in Burlington, VT! Dinner was bomb!

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

I have the six-axis controller. Does it have a vibe feature?

No, it does not. No worries, though. Just count it out in your head. A decent 'one Mississippi' will do the trick.

I guess I dont really know if the hitters feel like hitters or not? On meter or pulse I can rack up k's on any level, but any level using classis I simply cannot throw many k's or hit my spots with regularity.

Have you tried Default All-Star?

Look, I've tested the crap out of this game using CPU vs. CPU. I'm 63 games into a Franchise where I'm playing every game and I can tell you to the best of my ability, that All-Star level using Classic pitching utilizes the player ratings and long term statistical trends that I tracked on CPU runs extremely accurately.

Based on my playstyle, only HR's were elevated (which I attribute to Yankee stadium more than anything), and that BB's were high (which I alleviated by raising Consistency to 6 just recently).

Any other level will directly place the Human or CPU in different sets of advantages and disadvantages thanks to how difficulty level correlates to CPU pattern recognition.

But...all of this is arbitrary because you play with minor leaguers. This is why I asked about your edits.

If BB/9 is, say, a 30 something for Manny Banuelos (for example), he will reflect an amplified decrease in strike percentage. In real life, he'll throw better than 55% strikes in the big leagues today (probably). With a decreased BB/9 made in an attempt for him to "reach his potential" in three years, he will NOT currently act like himself out there.

You need to consider this unless you boosted this rating (which I believe you should)...and Banuelos is JUST an example. Not even gonna attempt to scout to a scout.

If your re-rates are solid, and meant to be PLAYED, All-Star is your level. Trust me. At least to start.

VT huh! The guy that cooked for us last night when to the NE Culinary Institue in Burlington, VT! Dinner was bomb!

Nice! I take it your friend is a raging liberal than?

LOL! Just joking. But tell him I said that. If he spent time there, he'll know what I mean. I love Burlington...well, love it enough.

I live in Rutland. That may make him laugh too.

[ksig24]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

No, it does not. No worries, though. Just count it out in your head. A decent 'one Mississippi' will do the trick.



Have you tried Default All-Star?

Look, I've tested the crap out of this game using CPU vs. CPU. I'm 63 games into a Franchise where I'm playing every game and I can tell you to the best of my ability, that All-Star level using Classic pitching utilizes the player ratings and long term statistical trends that I tracked on CPU runs extremely accurately.

Based on my playstyle, only HR's were elevated (which I attribute to Yankee stadium more than anything), and that BB's were high (which I alleviated by raising Consistency to 6 just recently).

Any other level will directly place the Human or CPU in different sets of advantages and disadvantages thanks to how difficulty level correlates to CPU pattern recognition.

But...all of this is arbitrary because you play with minor leaguers. This is why I asked about your edits.

If BB/9 is, say, a 30 something for Manny Banuelos (for example), he will reflect an amplified decrease in strike percentage. In real life, he'll throw better than 55% strikes in the big leagues today (probably). With a decreased BB/9 made in an attempt for him to "reach his potential" in three years, he will NOT currently act like himself out there.

You need to consider this unless you boosted this rating (which I believe you should)...and Banuelos is JUST an example. Not even gonna attempt to scout to a scout.

If your re-rates are solid, and meant to be PLAYED, All-Star is your level. Trust me. At least to start.



Nice! I take it your friend is a raging liberal than?

LOL! Just joking. But tell him I said that. If he spent time there, he'll know what I mean. I love Burlington...well, love it enough.

I live in Rutland. That may make him laugh too.

I certainly dont discount anything you say when it comes to testing and that is why I summoned you. I compeltely hear what you are saying and have no qualms about heading back to AS difficulty. I was always rating my players higher in the past to play like their actual selves, but found that they generally were overrated when it came to progression. I, on the otherhand play every game that interests me on all levels including MLB so a full season for me is thousands of games once my rosters are right.

I honestly dont see how anyone in their right mind can actually play more than one season on 30 team full control mode. So maybe I will just make my own roster and play my own franchise.

I know that he is originally from California and comes from a little money so he definitely isnt a raging liberal, plus if he was he wouldnt be allowed on my property let alone make us dinner. **** he may have poisoned us!!!! HAHA

[Heroesandvillains]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

I certainly dont discount anything you say when it comes to testing and that is why I summoned you. I compeltely hear what you are saying and have no qualms about heading back to AS difficulty. I was always rating my players higher in the past to play like their actual selves, but found that they generally were overrated when it came to progression. I, on the otherhand play every game that interests me on all levels including MLB so a full season for me is thousands of games once my rosters are right.

I honestly dont see how anyone in their right mind can actually play more than one season on 30 team full control mode. So maybe I will just make my own roster and play my own franchise.

I know that he is originally from California and comes from a little money so he definitely isnt a raging liberal, plus if he was he wouldnt be allowed on my property let alone make us dinner. **** he may have poisoned us!!!! HAHA

I'm just curious if you think AS level will provide enough pop when you are playing in the minor leagues?

It wouldn't suprise me if it did. I was just curious because Default SCEA rosters DO NOT (thanks to a test from Nomo17K).

That said, you're rosters have literally nothing to do SCEA rosters, as I believe you use a ratings calculator. Hence, regressed ratings and power outages may not apply to you.

For instance, SCEA rosters RARELY have a player in AA with 50 plus in power. It just doesn't seem to happen (though to be fair, I've only skimmed through the teams). Does yours?

If so utilize my write-up and go with Default AS for now. I think you will be pleasantly suprised.

I made these slider adjustments, and yes...they matter if you're concerned with runs per game and share a similar play style to myself:

Human Consistency 6
Fielding Errors 6
SB Ability 4 (I believe this slider is reversed)
SB Frequency 8
Injuries 6 (sim at 5, though may be excessive for minor leaguers)

Try it out. But play more than a couple games. I need to see how your edits translate to gameplay. At MLB, for me, these changes are MONEY on AS.

[ksig24]

Re: Classic Pitching Questions and Discussion 2012

So you think that AS out of the box plays better than the hard work Authentic and I Live put into thier various sets?