Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

[Husker_OS]

Because by 2015, Bonds will be 2nd on the all-time list. If A-Rod can get to 50 HRs this season(which is a fair assumption), he'll be sitting at 514 at the age of 32. After that, he'll need to average 36 HRs over the next 8 seasons to get to 800 HRs. That's more than enough to take over the HR record.

So really, the Bonds arguments will rendered meaningless in less than 10 years.


Thoughts?

[SlimKibbles]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Maybe, but it's 2007 and Bonds is likely going to break Aaron's record this year. I think A-Rod can do it eventually but we'll talk about it as time goes on.

[Blzer]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Yeah, so why the big fuss, guys? Just let him have it.

Besides, it's not only that somebody will pass him (I mean of course somebody will pass him), but that he may even be the next person to have books written about his potential steroid use. Pujols, Rodriguez, me... it's only fair that that can happen, and very may.

This is one reason I care more about a milestone (3,000 hits) than a record (755). Because I know that someday Bonds will become 2nd, and that doesn't do much. Instead, he'll now be on an achievement list should he get 3,000 hits.


One more thing. Penis. That is all.

[Sandman42]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

It's a big deal because he used steroids to help him break the most prestigious record in all of sports.

[TheMatrix31]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Until someone shows me that using steroids SPECIFICALLY causes someone to hit more home runs, I won't buy into that argument.

Bonds is on a TEAR right now. You guys honestly think he's doing steriods or whatever still? With this much of the public eye on him? He hit homers before steroids, and he'll hit homers after steroids.

If I'm pissed he used steroids, I'm pissed because it's illegal and someone who is that bad *** doesn't need to use it anyway. And he's proved it.

[wang_chi7]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Until someone shows me that using steroids SPECIFICALLY causes someone to hit more home runs, I won't buy into that argument.

Bonds is on a TEAR right now. You guys honestly think he's doing steriods or whatever still? With this much of the public eye on him? He hit homers before steroids, and he'll hit homers after steroids.

If I'm pissed he used steroids, I'm pissed because it's illegal and someone who is that bad *** doesn't need to use it anyway. And he's proved it.

Bonds went from a great all around, but mostly contact hitter with some power to a guy who could crush the ball over the fence over 100 times in a season if he was actually pitched to.

What proof do you need? No it doesn't help you hit the ball, but when the ball is hit, it goes further if you have bigger muscles (all else-flexibility a strong base, etc. being equal.) Bonds probably would have reached 600+ without the juice but got greedy and lost credibility. Even if he's off it now (which is quite possible), if he didn't stop working out a bunch then he would still have much of that muscle mass that he illegally built up.

Yes he hit homers before steroids, but his slugging percentage went from the .500 and .600 hundreds range to +.800 from 2001-2004 all while exiting his (traditional) prime age at the same time. Want to know how many +50 HR seasons he had last century? Zero, his highest was 46 in 1993 and he had only 2 other +40 HR seasons. One more thing, he hasn't reached the batting champion level of AB's needed since 1998 and still managed to hit that much more out.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/b/bondsba01.shtml

[TheMatrix31]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

It doesn't matter. The guy still consistently hit over 35 homers a season.

People act like he was Ronnie Belliard, then all of a sudden turned into a home run machine. The guy has ALWAYS been an amazing hitter. It could also be that the reason his numbers "went up" was because pitching started to suck. Also, the move from Candlestick to Pac Bell could have had an impact as well. Right field in Candlestick was 328 and right field in Pac Bell is 309. Bonds' HR numbers "spiked" in 2000, the first year they went to the new ball-park. I don't want to sound like I'm making excuses, but these reasons are just as valid as "steroid" use being the reason for increased power totals, because it has never been proven that it has a DIRECT effect. Call me naive, call me what you will, but I won't buy it until it's proven.

Besides, don't people know that most of the players who have been caught for performance-enhancers have been pitchers? Steroids are used as a recovery aid first.

As long as someone shows me PHYSICAL proof that steroids make it easier to hit a home run, I won't diminish his hitting 740 home runs (so far).

[ZM Punk]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

The one thing that bothers me is that the same people who celebrated Sosa and Mcgwire are the same ones that are ready to crucify Barry Bonds. The media as a whole has a vandetta against Barry Bonds and will do everything in their power to demean his record.

[Chip Douglass]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

As long as someone shows me PHYSICAL proof that steroids make it easier to hit a home run, I won't diminish his hitting 740 home runs (so far).

Steroids increase muscle mass, which increases strength, which also increases bat speed, all of the following factors on home runs.

In some ways, I do agree about its supposed effects, as it takes freakish eye-hand-coordination, solid contact, and a good degree of excellent hitting mechanics to drive the ball.

[Blzer]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Steroids increase muscle mass, which increases strength, which also increases bat speed, all of the following factors on home runs.

In some ways, I do agree, as it takes freakish eye-hand-coordination, solid contact, and a good degree of excellent hitting mechanics to drive the ball.

The thing of it is, 99% of it is that, if not 99.9%. I've given examples of what steroids do in the past, and it's basically the extra drive that they give a ball if you didn't already give it its maximum drive. Steroids may in fact decrease bat speed, if you know how to swing correctly. Players that benefit most from steroids would be those that extend their arms on every swing and use their arms to swing. Bonds uses legs, just as any good hitter would.

I'll have to dig deep back to find that example of what "drive" on a ball is, but hopefully it will make sense.

[NYJets]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Yes I am sure you are the expert on the effect steroids have on baseball players. Please, educate us.

[BAMJ6]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

The one thing that bothers me is that the same people who celebrated Sosa and Mcgwire are the same ones that are ready to crucify Barry Bonds. The media as a whole has a vandetta against Barry Bonds and will do everything in their power to demean his record.

Because Big Mac and Sosa were more endearing athletes and not black, while Bonds is a black *******. They can't stomach those kinds of people setting baseball records,

[Sandman42]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

The one thing that bothers me is that the same people who celebrated Sosa and Mcgwire are the same ones that are ready to crucify Barry Bonds. The media as a whole has a vandetta against Barry Bonds and will do everything in their power to demean his record.

That's because people didn't know Sosa and McGwire were on roids in 98. Do you see the media love either one of them now? McGwire might miss out on the HOF because he took steroids.

[Blzer]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Okay, well here was this post I had, dated December of 2004:

http://forums.operationsports.com/vB...0&postcount=44


Here's the portion I'm talking about:

If you don't understand what I mean by push, I mean this. Take a baseball bat and a basketball, toss up the basketball and hit it. You'll notice a HUGE stop action in your swing, making your swing speed not constant from its initial velocity. But, if you became strong enough that you could swing and hit that basketball without any stop whatsoever, then that doesn't mean that you have quicker bat speed, that means that you have a stronger push through the ball. However, like I said in an earlier post, once you reach that spot where the basketball has no effect on your swing, strengthening yourself even more won't exert more force into the ball and make it go farther, it will remain a constant, because your momentum is already giving it the maximum (just like water freezing). You may be stronger, but now the only thing that will make it go farther is more bat speed. Likewise, the water may get colder, but once it's frozen, it's frozen. There's nothing more to conclude after going below 32* F.

What I meant by this post is that Bonds more than likely already has that maximum drive through a baseball. If he didn't, he already has the bat speed. He never really got a quicker bat since his years of alleged steroid usage.

[Sandman42]

Re: Not sure why the big fuss over Bonds..

Because Big Mac and Sosa were more endearing athletes and not black, while Bonds is a black *******. They can't stomach those kinds of people setting baseball records,

You forget to mention that the person whose record he is about to break is black. How about the fact that no one wants to see a cheater break the record? I would say that is a much greater factor.