It's Girardi......

[Sandman42]

Re: It's Girardi......

How is Clint Hurdle a better manager than Torre. This is the first year he has success and he's been known to make very questionable and dumb decision, like wasting his relievers too early in the game or not pinch hitting for his pitcher, then removing him at the start of the next inning.

Also you think Ozzie Guillen is a good manager? The same guy that wants to make Paul Konerko and Jim Thome start bunting next season.

[SPTO]

Re: It's Girardi......

I don't know how anyone can call Torre overrated. Sure, he overuses his only good bullpen guys at times but when you have such dreck as Kyle Farnsworth and Luis Vizcaino then you have to over use the capable guys.

Torre may not have won a championship in the last few years but I think he did a pretty good job considering the mega talent that he has on the team. I mean earlier this year we thought the Yanks were dead but they came back to life and made it to the playoffs.

Also keep in mind he won WS championships with teams that didn't have all that talent but had good solid guys with intangibles.

[mjb2124]

Re: It's Girardi......

Managers are only as good as his players. They take too much credit for wins, and too much criticism for losses.

That's my opinion as well.

[ehh]

Re: It's Girardi......

Managers are only as good as his players. They take too much credit for wins, and too much criticism for losses.

Definitely.

As for Phil Jackson, I disagree with that completely because Jordan wasn't winning a damn thing before Phil and the same thing with Shaq and Kobe.

Basketball coaches are much more important than baseball managers. The triangle offense and learning to get MJ to be unselfish and getting Shaq and Kobe to coexist and put the team's needs first - no one else could do that.

Plus the Bulls were pretty damn good during MJ's brief absence after his first retirement. Phil may be a tad overrated, but not the most overrated ever. If you're argument is about having boatloads of talent, then Red Auerbach is easily the most overrated basketball coach.

As for Torre, I definitely agree that he is overrated as a manager. People say that he won with guys like O'Neill, Tino and Brosious and not with guys like A-Rod, Giambi, etc. We all know that pitching wins championships and the Yankees pitching staff has been a disaster since the end of the '03 season, and it was already heading downhill that year. He won when he had great pitching, he lost when he had poor pitching. Simple as that.

The real kicker will be to see how he fares in LA. The NL West is arguably the worst division in baseball and more of a small ball offensive style. That was never Torre's strength IMO. If he fails to get the Dodgers to the playoffs for a few years I think his legacy will take a much greater hit even to Torre supporters.

[ehh]

Re: It's Girardi......

Some more news on the managerial staff.....

OE GIRARDI READY TO TAKE YANKEE REINS
SAYS YES TO YANKS; MATTINGLY 'EXTREMELY DISAPPOINTED'
By GEORGE KING
Joe Girardi
Joe Girardi
PrintEmailDigg ItRedditPermalinkStory Bottom

October 29, 2007 -- After a late dalliance with the Dodgers that led to nothing, Joe Girardi will succeed Joe Torre as Yankees manager with an announcement scheduled for today.

It was not clear which side initiated contact between the Dodgers and Girardi yesterday, but at 5:30 last night the Yankees knew Girardi was talking to the NL club. However, by nightfall the Yankees were sure Girardi would accept the job today since he requested which coaches from Torre's staff he wanted to remain.

Knowing that Torre is the Dodgers' leading candidate to take over for Grady Little, something that could happen quickly since the Dodgers are working on a buyout with Little, the Yankees and Girardi moved swiftly to keep hitting coach Kevin Long, who is expected to sign a rare three-year deal for close to $1 million. The Yankees are also keen on retaining field coordinator Rob Thomson as Girardi's third base or bench coach. Tony Pena, who interviewed for the job Girardi was offered yesterday, also will remain.

Third base coach Larry Bowa is a candidate to stay or he could travel to L.A. with Torre, who may ask Don Mattingly to join him. Several people in the Yankees' universe believe Torre will be named Dodgers manager, possibly as soon as today.

Before Girardi and the Dodgers chatted, Hank Steinbrenner said, "We will announce (Girardi) (today)."

Since the Yankees informed Mattingly yesterday they were offering Girardi the job, it was apparent they didn't believe Girardi would jilt them and bolt for L.A.

When informed Girardi had gotten the job, Mattingly refused the Yankees' offer to remain as bench coach.

"Don was extremely disappointed to learn today that he wasn't the organization's choice to fill the managerial vacancy," Mattingly spokesman Ray Schulte said.

[davehughes14]

Re: It's Girardi......

Some more news on the managerial staff.....

Nopt sure how other people feel but I'm glad Pena is staying, and I hope Bowa does also.

[MassNole]

Re: It's Girardi......

You guys have a good one in Pena, he got a bum rap in Kansas City.

[Kashanova]

Re: It's Girardi......

anyone watching mike and the mad dog right now?

[NYJets]

Re: It's Girardi......

anyone watching mike and the mad dog right now?

I listened to a little before.

They were making fun of how long Cashman's answers to questions were. They'd turn the conference call off, count to 20, turn it back on, and he'd still be answering the same question. They did it a bunch of times.

Funny stuff.

[Hammerhunker]

Re: It's Girardi......

How is Clint Hurdle a better manager than Torre. This is the first year he has success and he's been known to make very questionable and dumb decision, like wasting his relievers too early in the game or not pinch hitting for his pitcher, then removing him at the start of the next inning.

I can chime in on Clint Hurdle. I love Hurdle, his demeanor is perfect for that team. As a game manager, of course he pulls boners occasionally, which are the moves that doesn't work, btw. His only drawback to me is his reliance on that freakin Fuentes The manager is as good as the chemistry of the team, his assistants, and his general manager.

Francona is a God right now Take away a walk, stolen base, basehit, a couple of Ortiz homeruns, and a bloody sock, this whole conversation would be about who is going to be taking over the Red Sox.

[imapotato]

Re: It's Girardi......

^^^
You obviously missed the best commercial on MLB TV.

Fuentes saving a cat...being a lifeguard in the team bath

I'd have faith in him too!

[NYJets]

Re: It's Girardi......

Lets see, when Torre has talent that pretty much any idiot could win with, he wins. When he has talent that is on par with other elite teams, he doesn't win. I am sure it is just one big coincidence though right? When they were winning titles the Yankees had an absurd talent level, so of course his decisions look great when he has the talent to execute.

What managers are better than Torre today? A whole helluva a lot.



He has turned multiple teams into champions, that makes sense.

I don't see how the world series teams were all teams that any idiot could win with. 96 Yankees wasn't the best team on paper. 2000 Yankees wasn't even close, they won less than 90 games, but won the world series.

Even the 98 Yankees only had 2 surefire hall of famers, and they won 114 games.


I think managers as a whole are really overrated, I don't understand why you are calling out Torre though. He's won 4 championships, and made the playoffs every year with the Yankees. Francona has had a lot of talent every year in Boston, but in 2005 he got swept in the first round, and 2006 finished 3rd. Torre never had a worse season than either of those in his time with the Yankees. Wedge and Hurdle have both had only 1 good year, and both have done questionable things in the past. Ozzie is a really bad manager.

I'm sure Torre couldn't go to the Royals, Devil Rays, Orioles, etc. next year and turn them into a winning organization, but no manager could. Seems like your holding Torre to a different standard.

[Hammerhunker]

Re: It's Girardi......

^^^
You obviously missed the best commercial on MLB TV.

Fuentes saving a cat...being a lifeguard in the team bath

I'd have faith in him too!

Yeah that commercial became obsolete after the week of June 22-29. It wasn't as if he was that impressive anyway. Every frickin outing it seemed like he would put a couple on and then just get out of it.

You might be on to something though. Maybe FSN had a stipulation that Fuentes had to be involved in X amount of innings because they sunk $7.24 into the making of that crappy commercial:wink:

...but we digress.

[NYJets]

Re: It's Girardi......

Looks like we'll need a new 3b coach, and a new bench coach. Pena will probably move to one of them, probably bench coach. I don't know who the new base coaches will be but there has been talk today about Girardi adding O'Neil to his staff.

[CMH]

Re: It's Girardi......

Oh, Paul O'Neill?

I think that would be great. I'm sure they've become kind of close working in the booth together.

I would love to see him back in pinstripes.