Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

[Beantown]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

I have read that it healed very quickly and he is ahead of schedule. I never really believe that, as it seems that almost every athlete ever is ahead of schedule in terms of injury rehabilitation. Snepp, can you shed more light on this?

Either way, I see no way as to how he will ever be the same though.

Yeah, someone reminded me last night about Liriano. I, personally, had completely forgotten about him.

Here's to hoping he recovers fully. He was incredibly fun to watch pitch and could be a great pitcher in this league if he does heal.

[snepp]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

I haven't read a single scouting report that puts Cabrera as anything more than a 10-15 homerun per year hitter with average range.

There's one gigantic difference in that Hunter/Melky comparison. Hunter has superior athletic ability, that isn't something you learn or develop through experience. Shame that Hunter never took being a "hitter" seriously rather than spending his entire career as a hacker, but that's another subject altogether.

[snepp]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

I have read that it healed very quickly and he is ahead of schedule. I never really believe that, as it seems that almost every athlete ever is ahead of schedule in terms of injury rehabilitation. Snepp, can you shed more light on this?

Either way, I see no way as to how he will ever be the same though.

Everything I've seen either has him right on schedule or ahead. We won't know for sure until he's completely healthy, but I don't see any reason why he can't come back as good as he was.

I don't know if I've posted this link here before, but it really has some nice info in it.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/fantasy/article/player-highlight-francisco-liriano/

[bergie56]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

Everything I've seen either has him right on schedule or ahead. We won't know for sure until he's completely healthy, but I don't see any reason why he can't come back as good as he was.

I don't know if I've posted this link here before, but it really has some nice info in it.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/fa...cisco-liriano/

Interesting article, and I am definitely guilty of believing some of those things. If he returns to his potential, then I would feel a little better about not having Johan.

[CMH]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

He could turn out to be very similar hitter to Torri Hunter for all we know.

Hard to argue especially since Hunter was not a good minor league player. His defense saved his career.

Cabrera is already a better hitter than Hunter. I'm not talking power or anything like that. Just a better contact guy.

But that's not always enough. So we'll see.

[ehh]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

I haven't read a single scouting report that puts Cabrera as anything more than a 10-15 homerun per year hitter with average range.

That's fine if that's what you chose to base your opinion on, but a majority of scouting reports are insanely in accurate in hindsight.

[snepp]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

Of course, the opinion of a completely unbiased fanbase is going to be much more accurate.

Why even have scouts, scouting reports, or statistical history when we can just ask the fans?

[/oozing sarcasm]

[ehh]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

Why even have scouts, scouting reports, or statistical history when we can just ask the fans?
[/oozing sarcasm]

Since we do have all of that, and have past versions of it archived, why don't you go back and look at how wrong so many scouting reports of young players have been over the years?

Are you suggesting that every scouting report ever written has been accurate?

My god they're all 100% accurate, there's never been such thing as a bust or a diamond in the rough!

[eXperiment63]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

Of course there have, but to sit there and proclaim that Melky will be a diamond in the rough is absurd. He has had two years in the bigs, and has put up mediocre numbers. He has NEVER put up great numbers in his minor league career either. There is NO evidence to suggest he will be anything more than he is already at the plate.

[snepp]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

Fine, you win, Melky could become the next great superstar. Happy?

Now, are you willing to admit that it's far more likely that Melky ends up being nothing more than the mediocre-to-average ball player that he's been in the past?


(My *insert diety of choice* I feel like a d-bag arguing over Melky ****ing Cabrera, what a waste of time.)

[ehh]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

Of course there have, but to sit there and proclaim that Melky will be a diamond in the rough is absurd. He has had two years in the bigs, and has put up mediocre numbers. He has NEVER put up great numbers in his minor league career either. There is NO evidence to suggest he will be anything more than he is already at the plate.

Well that's the whole point of a diamond in the rough, slick. You don't see it coming. And as for your last sentence, uh, how about age and experience? 22-year old players never get better?

Fine, you win, Melky could become the next great superstar. Happy?

A) Not a great superstar, but perhaps an All-Star. Why wouldn't you? His first three seasons in the big leagues before he turned 25, Bernie Williams hit .238, .280 and .268. He had 3, 5 and 12 HR's. Everyone said he was an awful defensive player and would never have decent power and would be an average player. I think Bernie was just a tad above average. Could Melky be a 4th outfielder his whole career too, absolutely! Pardon me that I'm not closed-minded enough to only see one foreseeable outcome for a player's future.

B) I'm not even talking directly about Melky Cabrera, any player who wasn't a stud or "can't miss" player coming out of HS or college. If we had this conversation 9 years ago about Torri Hunter and I said he could turn into an All-Star with 25 HR+ power you would laugh at me and call me crazy.

[ryanm1058123]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

The Yankees do not have the best pitching in the minors, especially without counting Joba and Hughes. In fact, Baseball America says the Red Sox, with Buchholz among others, have the best pitching. I'm surprised they are ranked ahead of the Rays, but Buchholz is ranked as the best pitching prospect in baseball, ahead of Joba and Hughes.

It is also laughable to say that the Yankees could package something better than anything the Red Sox could offer. If the Sox offered Ellsbury and Buchholz, this trade would have been done a long time ago. But don't want to part with either one (though there are reports that they have put Ellsbury on the table).

And saying Peter Gammons isn't a good source? GM's constantly say Gammons has better sources than any other reporter in the league. In Moneyball, Billy Beane said he ONLY speaks to Gammons, because unlike most reporters Gammons sources are actually reliable.

lol. this thread is wrong on so many levels. the only people that say red sox pitching is better than the yankees pitching are guys like jim callis. same with buchholz and hughes. yankees are superior when it comes to pitching. even rotoworld, the notorius red sox homers that they are, admit the yankees have unparalled depth in the pitching department. You do realize that Joba + Hughes would get any player in the MLB, basically?

I can count on 1 hand how Gammons has been right over the past couple years and I'd have a few fingers left over.

[Briman123]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

oops.

[Briman123]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

lol. this thread is wrong on so many levels. the only people that say red sox pitching is better than the yankees pitching are guys like jim callis. same with buchholz and hughes. yankees are superior when it comes to pitching. even rotoworld, the notorius red sox homers that they are, admit the yankees have unparalled depth in the pitching department. You do realize that Joba + Hughes would get any player in the MLB, basically?

I can count on 1 hand how Gammons has been right over the past couple years and I'd have a few fingers left over.

Lol how in the world is Yankees pitching outright better? Hughes is slightly overrated he's made out to be the next Roger Clemens. Joba has proven he was decent last year. But I mean Lester isn't too bad for a 3rd guy in the rotation and Clay Bucholz is just as good as Hughes if not better.

[ryanm1058123]

Re: Don't be surprised if Johan Santana is a Yankee before the season gets underway.

Lol how in the world is Yankees pitching outright better? Hughes is slightly overrated he's made out to be the next Roger Clemens. Joba has proven he was decent last year. But I mean Lester isn't too bad for a 3rd guy in the rotation and Clay Bucholz is just as good as Hughes if not better.

lol. peter gammons is that you?

yeah a 0.28 ERA = decent, right?


Hughes has been rated better than Buchholz just about everywhere other than probably Jim Callis (I wonder why)