Pirate Fans (Please Read)

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  • griffy97
    *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
    • May 2003
    • 364

    #121
    Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

    An accurate assessment of the Bonifay years indeed. We could take this one further:

    Remember Larry Doughty? The guy was GM from mid-88 until 1991. I remember how many gaffes he made during that time. The one in particular was in August of 1990. He was "confused" about the waiver rule and ended up being pigeon-holed into dealing three outfield prospects (Wes Chamberlain being one; not that he ever panned out) to the Cubs for Carmelo Martinez. Remember, we also gave up Moises Alou in the Zane Smith deal that same month. Of course, when you're trying to win a title, you make those types of deals. But, knowing the growing economic imbalance of the game was coming AND knowing we weren't going to be able to re-sign Bonilla, Bonds, etc.it would've been nice to have Moises Alou in LF from 93 on. Doughty also gave Mike LaValliere a hefty contract extension, who Ted Simmons (or was it Bonifay) basically outright released a year or so later.

    That's another thing the Bucs have done for years: given these guaranteed multi-year deals to mid-line players that underproduce and hamstring the organization. That's why Kevin Young is still with us. Where Dave Littlefield has shown his best logic is not falling into that same trap. Lofton, Sanders, Stairs, Suppan, DiMico, etc. all signed one-year deals as stop-gaps. He also forced the injury settlement issue with Pat Meares. He has allowed an club option for Pokey Reese for 2004 (which there is no way they'll exercise).

    I do believe the future is brighter with Littlefield in charge. It's gonna take time, but I like his vision for the franchise.

    Comment

    • LetsGoBucs
      Let's Go Nuggets!
      • Feb 2003
      • 1289

      #122
      Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

      I agree 100%. The Zane Smith deal I can understand because Smith did alot to get the Bucs to the playoffs. So I'm ok with that one. But what you said about the big contracts is right. KY and Kendall did not do anything to deserve the deals they got. This is a problem with baseball (and all sports for that matter) in general. Somebody has one good year and teams line up to throw money at the guy. Maybe someday teams will learn...
      MLB: Pittsburgh Pirates, Colorado Rockies
      NFL: Pittsburgh Steelers
      NHL: Pittsburgh Penguins
      NBA: Denver Nuggets, Orlando Magic
      NCAA: Penn State Nittany Lions, Boston College Eagles

      Comment

      • LetsGoBucs
        Let's Go Nuggets!
        • Feb 2003
        • 1289

        #123
        Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

        I agree 100%. The Zane Smith deal I can understand because Smith did alot to get the Bucs to the playoffs. So I'm ok with that one. But what you said about the big contracts is right. KY and Kendall did not do anything to deserve the deals they got. This is a problem with baseball (and all sports for that matter) in general. Somebody has one good year and teams line up to throw money at the guy. Maybe someday teams will learn...
        MLB: Pittsburgh Pirates, Colorado Rockies
        NFL: Pittsburgh Steelers
        NHL: Pittsburgh Penguins
        NBA: Denver Nuggets, Orlando Magic
        NCAA: Penn State Nittany Lions, Boston College Eagles

        Comment

        • LetsGoBucs
          Let's Go Nuggets!
          • Feb 2003
          • 1289

          #124
          Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

          I agree 100%. The Zane Smith deal I can understand because Smith did alot to get the Bucs to the playoffs. So I'm ok with that one. But what you said about the big contracts is right. KY and Kendall did not do anything to deserve the deals they got. This is a problem with baseball (and all sports for that matter) in general. Somebody has one good year and teams line up to throw money at the guy. Maybe someday teams will learn...
          MLB: Pittsburgh Pirates, Colorado Rockies
          NFL: Pittsburgh Steelers
          NHL: Pittsburgh Penguins
          NBA: Denver Nuggets, Orlando Magic
          NCAA: Penn State Nittany Lions, Boston College Eagles

          Comment

          • griffy97
            *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
            • May 2003
            • 364

            #125
            Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

            </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
            I agree 100%. The Zane Smith deal I can understand because Smith did alot to get the Bucs to the playoffs. So I'm ok with that one. But what you said about the big contracts is right. KY and Kendall did not do anything to deserve the deals they got. This is a problem with baseball (and all sports for that matter) in general. Somebody has one good year and teams line up to throw money at the guy. Maybe someday teams will learn...

            <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

            Zane Smith was also known as a Met killer in those days.

            It's just that the Pirates had to see this coming. When Ted Simmons took over in 1992, the first thing he did was trade 20-game winner John Smiley to Minnesota for Denny Neagle and Midre Cummings. (To answer an earlier post, I believe Neagle only pitched briefly at AAA before coming up full-time in 93.) Simmons had the right idea, it was just too little too late. In some fairness to Cam Bonifay, the club he inherited in mid-93 was pretty well stripped down.

            Comment

            • griffy97
              *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
              • May 2003
              • 364

              #126
              Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

              </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
              I agree 100%. The Zane Smith deal I can understand because Smith did alot to get the Bucs to the playoffs. So I'm ok with that one. But what you said about the big contracts is right. KY and Kendall did not do anything to deserve the deals they got. This is a problem with baseball (and all sports for that matter) in general. Somebody has one good year and teams line up to throw money at the guy. Maybe someday teams will learn...

              <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

              Zane Smith was also known as a Met killer in those days.

              It's just that the Pirates had to see this coming. When Ted Simmons took over in 1992, the first thing he did was trade 20-game winner John Smiley to Minnesota for Denny Neagle and Midre Cummings. (To answer an earlier post, I believe Neagle only pitched briefly at AAA before coming up full-time in 93.) Simmons had the right idea, it was just too little too late. In some fairness to Cam Bonifay, the club he inherited in mid-93 was pretty well stripped down.

              Comment

              • griffy97
                *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                • May 2003
                • 364

                #127
                Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                I agree 100%. The Zane Smith deal I can understand because Smith did alot to get the Bucs to the playoffs. So I'm ok with that one. But what you said about the big contracts is right. KY and Kendall did not do anything to deserve the deals they got. This is a problem with baseball (and all sports for that matter) in general. Somebody has one good year and teams line up to throw money at the guy. Maybe someday teams will learn...

                <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                Zane Smith was also known as a Met killer in those days.

                It's just that the Pirates had to see this coming. When Ted Simmons took over in 1992, the first thing he did was trade 20-game winner John Smiley to Minnesota for Denny Neagle and Midre Cummings. (To answer an earlier post, I believe Neagle only pitched briefly at AAA before coming up full-time in 93.) Simmons had the right idea, it was just too little too late. In some fairness to Cam Bonifay, the club he inherited in mid-93 was pretty well stripped down.

                Comment

                • LetsGoPitt
                  Cr*m*n*lly *nd*rr*t*d
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 5673

                  #128
                  Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                  The thing about Smiley was that he was going to be asking for a lot of money (his contract was up that year) that the Pirates could not afford. Plus, he never was as dominant again after that 20-win season.
                  “In my lifetime, we've gone from Eisenhower to George W. Bush. We've gone from John F. Kennedy to Al Gore. If this is evolution, I believe that in twelve years, we'll be voting for plants.” - Lewis Black

                  Comment

                  • LetsGoPitt
                    Cr*m*n*lly *nd*rr*t*d
                    • Jul 2002
                    • 5673

                    #129
                    Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                    The thing about Smiley was that he was going to be asking for a lot of money (his contract was up that year) that the Pirates could not afford. Plus, he never was as dominant again after that 20-win season.
                    “In my lifetime, we've gone from Eisenhower to George W. Bush. We've gone from John F. Kennedy to Al Gore. If this is evolution, I believe that in twelve years, we'll be voting for plants.” - Lewis Black

                    Comment

                    • LetsGoPitt
                      Cr*m*n*lly *nd*rr*t*d
                      • Jul 2002
                      • 5673

                      #130
                      Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                      The thing about Smiley was that he was going to be asking for a lot of money (his contract was up that year) that the Pirates could not afford. Plus, he never was as dominant again after that 20-win season.
                      “In my lifetime, we've gone from Eisenhower to George W. Bush. We've gone from John F. Kennedy to Al Gore. If this is evolution, I believe that in twelve years, we'll be voting for plants.” - Lewis Black

                      Comment

                      • griffy97
                        *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                        • May 2003
                        • 364

                        #131
                        Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                        The win streak stops at four. Bucs lose 5-2 today to the Expos.

                        Just hope it doesn't turn into another one of those "lose 8 out 9" streaks.

                        Just checked out LetsGoPitt's favorite reliever Brian Bohringer's line for today: 1 IP, 2 R, 2 ER, 1 BB, 0 SO, 1 HR. ERA for season: 9.00. Ouch!

                        Comment

                        • griffy97
                          *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                          • May 2003
                          • 364

                          #132
                          Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                          The win streak stops at four. Bucs lose 5-2 today to the Expos.

                          Just hope it doesn't turn into another one of those "lose 8 out 9" streaks.

                          Just checked out LetsGoPitt's favorite reliever Brian Bohringer's line for today: 1 IP, 2 R, 2 ER, 1 BB, 0 SO, 1 HR. ERA for season: 9.00. Ouch!

                          Comment

                          • griffy97
                            *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                            • May 2003
                            • 364

                            #133
                            Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                            The win streak stops at four. Bucs lose 5-2 today to the Expos.

                            Just hope it doesn't turn into another one of those "lose 8 out 9" streaks.

                            Just checked out LetsGoPitt's favorite reliever Brian Bohringer's line for today: 1 IP, 2 R, 2 ER, 1 BB, 0 SO, 1 HR. ERA for season: 9.00. Ouch!

                            Comment

                            • LetsGoPitt
                              Cr*m*n*lly *nd*rr*t*d
                              • Jul 2002
                              • 5673

                              #134
                              Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                              </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />

                              Just checked out LetsGoPitt's favorite reliever Brian Bohringer's line for today: 1 IP, 2 R, 2 ER, 1 BB, 0 SO, 1 HR. ERA for season: 9.00. Ouch!

                              <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">
                              I know...

                              All the guy throws are fastballs. Doesn't take a genius to figure him out. Also explains how Al Martin struck out the other game against him (right before he gave up a grand slam)
                              “In my lifetime, we've gone from Eisenhower to George W. Bush. We've gone from John F. Kennedy to Al Gore. If this is evolution, I believe that in twelve years, we'll be voting for plants.” - Lewis Black

                              Comment

                              • LetsGoPitt
                                Cr*m*n*lly *nd*rr*t*d
                                • Jul 2002
                                • 5673

                                #135
                                Re: Pirate Fans (Please Read)

                                </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />

                                Just checked out LetsGoPitt's favorite reliever Brian Bohringer's line for today: 1 IP, 2 R, 2 ER, 1 BB, 0 SO, 1 HR. ERA for season: 9.00. Ouch!

                                <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">
                                I know...

                                All the guy throws are fastballs. Doesn't take a genius to figure him out. Also explains how Al Martin struck out the other game against him (right before he gave up a grand slam)
                                “In my lifetime, we've gone from Eisenhower to George W. Bush. We've gone from John F. Kennedy to Al Gore. If this is evolution, I believe that in twelve years, we'll be voting for plants.” - Lewis Black

                                Comment

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