Did We Get Bamboozled?

[seanbarkley]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

IMO they did a great job. They hyped us all and helped to get a lot of sales (which is their main goal). If they have lost any credibility in this forums with what happened this year is a different story.

[Gosens6]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

IMO they did a great job. They hyped us all and helped to get a lot of sales (which is their main goal). If they have lost any credibility in this forums with what happened this year is a different story.

No doubt about it, they're good at what they do, but they need to stay on Twitter and away from here. Last year with the "Biggest announcement in the history of 2K", which turned out to be music and some flashy menus from Jay-Z

And this year with they're groundbreaking, gamechanging modes that will make us forget about anything else we've ever played. Okay guys, give me a break.

Next year when LD2K comes here hyping 2K15, I won't even give what he says a second look. I know it will all be marketing B.S. that won't live up to expectations. They have plenty of fans on Twitter who will keep falling for it, but I'm tired of being patronized by these guys.

[seanbarkley]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

No doubt about it, they're good at what they do, but they need to stay on Twitter and away from here. Last year with the "Biggest announcement in the history of 2K", which turned out to be music and some flashy menus from Jay-Z

And this year with they're groundbreaking, gamechanging modes that will make us forget about anything else we've ever played. Okay guys, give me a break.

Next year when LD2K comes here hyping 2K15, I won't even give what he says a second look. I know it will all be marketing B.S. that won't live up to expectations. They have plenty of fans on Twitter who will keep falling for it, but I'm tired of being patronized by these guys.

That's the point, there're are a lot of casual fans of the game who don't even know what OS is and I'm quite sure they don't care about the majority of the issues we complain; and IMO they did a great job hyping that target customers.

In my case, I've just been listening to what devs (Beluba, Leftos...) post here for quite a long time.

[spankdatazz22]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

No doubt about it, they're good at what they do, but they need to stay on Twitter and away from here. Last year with the "Biggest announcement in the history of 2K", which turned out to be music and some flashy menus from Jay-Z

And this year with they're groundbreaking, gamechanging modes that will make us forget about anything else we've ever played. Okay guys, give me a break.

If I recall correctly, it was neither Ronnie or LD2K that made the "Biggest announcement in the history of 2K" comment. It was one single marketing or admin guy that made the comment, and the comment was extrapolated out/blown out of proportion on OS as though it were some official announcement from 2K as a company. (while you didn't directly attribute the comment to either of them, you're grouping it together in a way that makes it sound like they made it)

They need to "stay away from here"? It's your responsibility as a consumer to make informed choices. Would some blame an advertising company for making too good a commercial if it persuaded you to buy a product? If Ronnie and LD2K were indeed intentionally misleading you time and time again as you say, at some point it's on you not to listen instead of blaming them. No one's forcing you guys to run out and buy these games (or systems) at midnight on release or launch night, be first-adopters, then complain they don't work perfectly. I'm reading on another board how the PS4 and the XB1 are unable to play 3D blurays out of the box. I think it was reasonable for consumers to expect that capability built in since it's in the PS3 and many off the shelf bluray players. But I don't think there was some malicious attempt by Microsoft and Sony to misguide the public. While 3D may not matter to most, it matters to a lot of people.

It's unfortunate you're disappointed, but as I've said before - I'll never understand the contempt that gets shown by some relative to what the game's overall quality has been over the years. This game's been out less than a month and some seem completely unwilling to give them a chance to fix anything, let alone address an issue unless they're being spoken to directly from 2K. I've read many say they see potential in the game modes. Yet this game has to be held to some ridiculously unattainable standard by some, so the expectation seems to be near-perfection. All the while I see many of those same people showing extreme patience for the competition in hopes that they'll provide a legitimate alternative. Regardless of how many times they don't deliver.

Yet you're the ones that feel you should be listened to above all others? In many ways, this is the most flighty constituency of all.

[Gosens6]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

If I recall correctly, it was neither Ronnie or LD2K that made the "Biggest announcement in the history of 2K" comment. It was one single marketing or admin guy that made the comment, and the comment was extrapolated out/blown out of proportion on OS as though it were some official announcement from 2K as a company. (while you didn't directly attribute the comment to either of them, you're grouping it together in a way that makes it sound like they made it)

They need to "stay away from here"? It's your responsibility as a consumer to make informed choices. Would some blame an advertising company for making too good a commercial if it persuaded you to buy a product? If Ronnie and LD2K were indeed intentionally misleading you time and time again as you say, at some point it's on you not to listen instead of blaming them. No one's forcing you guys to run out and buy these games (or systems) at midnight on release or launch night, be first-adopters, then complain they don't work perfectly. I'm reading on another board how the PS4 and the XB1 are unable to play 3D blurays out of the box. I think it was reasonable for consumers to expect that capability built in since it's in the PS3 and many off the shelf bluray players. But I don't think there was some malicious attempt by Microsoft and Sony to misguide the public. While 3D may not matter to most, it matters to a lot of people.

It's unfortunate you're disappointed, but as I've said before - I'll never understand the contempt that gets shown by some relative to what the game's overall quality has been over the years. This game's been out less than a month and some seem completely unwilling to give them a chance to fix anything, let alone address an issue unless they're being spoken to directly from 2K. I've read many say they see potential in the game modes. Yet this game has to be held to some ridiculously unattainable standard by some, so the expectation seems to be near-perfection. All the while I see many of those same people showing extreme patience for the competition in hopes that they'll provide a legitimate alternative. Regardless of how many times they don't deliver.

Yet you're the ones that feel you should be listened to above all others? In many ways, this is the most flighty constituency of all.

Actually, I specifically remember on Twitter last year, and on here, LD2K made the claim that what they had in store for 2K13 would be the biggest thing in the history of their series, I'm not gonna go back and read all his post history, but he did, I know that for a fact.

Second, the way they hyped these new modes, the way they told us they would be revolutionary, and make us forget about any other game modes as we know it, was a crock, and they know it was a crock. Not only do these modes have all the same problems as last gen, they have brand new problems that make them nearly unplayable. Give them a chance to fix them? That's exactly what we've been doing by holding out for a patch, and guess what, some of the problems we've listed for MyGM mode are being fixed in a patch because we brought our ideas to Leftos.

Do we expect perfection? No. You wanna know what we do expect? For the modes they advertised to work properly, for them to just start being honest with what they're presenting to us. Last year it was the Jay-Z announcement, this year it was Crew for CG, and MyGM for NG. Both very underwhelming, both very overhyped, but hey, I guess that's they're job and I guess we're wrong in expecting what they promised to deliver.

And the comment about you saying it's my fault I let them mislead me, I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH YOU. They got me, and they got me good, along with a few others. But honestly, the reason I say the marketing guys should stay away from these forums is because I'm not sure how many people will fall for their tactics again. They're superstars on Twitter, they eat that **** up over there, but here, I don't think we'll allow LD2K to overhype and oversell things anymore. It's been 3 games in a row now where we've been fooled, and it's mainly all our fault. We wanted to believe what they said, we wanted to think they would deliver on everything they promised, but they didn't.

What's funny is, I'm actually enjoying the game, I just don't think it's right how they over advertise things and don't deliver. You make a lot of good points, but I think you're seeing it as us hating 2K, hating the game and wanting it to fail. It's the exact opposite, I love 2K sports, I just hate their business practices sometimes.

[Vni]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

IMO they did a great job. They hyped us all and helped to get a lot of sales (which is their main goal). If they have lost any credibility in this forums with what happened this year is a different story.

Yeah I agree. They just deserve to be call out for what they are though. Leftos, Beluba that's different.

What I don't like is that on this board there are quite a few mature and valuable people who geniunly likes the game and tryes to improve it by giving their ideas and how they view the game. Theses people deserve better information about the game than the one we get. We're adult, I turn 30 the 15th. I've stopped giving them credit a while ago but I find the way they come in here and use their status to promote the game, the way they do it, really disrespectfull.

[LorenzoDC]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

If I recall correctly, it was neither Ronnie or LD2K that made the "Biggest announcement in the history of 2K" comment. It was one single marketing or admin guy that made the comment, and the comment was extrapolated out/blown out of proportion on OS as though it were some official announcement from 2K as a company. (while you didn't directly attribute the comment to either of them, you're grouping it together in a way that makes it sound like they made it)

They need to "stay away from here"? It's your responsibility as a consumer to make informed choices. Would some blame an advertising company for making too good a commercial if it persuaded you to buy a product? If Ronnie and LD2K were indeed intentionally misleading you time and time again as you say, at some point it's on you not to listen instead of blaming them. No one's forcing you guys to run out and buy these games (or systems) at midnight on release or launch night, be first-adopters, then complain they don't work perfectly. I'm reading on another board how the PS4 and the XB1 are unable to play 3D blurays out of the box. I think it was reasonable for consumers to expect that capability built in since it's in the PS3 and many off the shelf bluray players. But I don't think there was some malicious attempt by Microsoft and Sony to misguide the public. While 3D may not matter to most, it matters to a lot of people.

It's unfortunate you're disappointed, but as I've said before - I'll never understand the contempt that gets shown by some relative to what the game's overall quality has been over the years. This game's been out less than a month and some seem completely unwilling to give them a chance to fix anything, let alone address an issue unless they're being spoken to directly from 2K. I've read many say they see potential in the game modes. Yet this game has to be held to some ridiculously unattainable standard by some, so the expectation seems to be near-perfection. All the while I see many of those same people showing extreme patience for the competition in hopes that they'll provide a legitimate alternative. Regardless of how many times they don't deliver.

Yet you're the ones that feel you should be listened to above all others? In many ways, this is the most flighty constituency of all.

The core of your argument is that, if a corporation or salesperson lies, no one should call them on it. Caveat emptor, let the buyer beware, full stop. You take that to such an extreme that to you there's no valid place for anyone to hold them accountable through speech or to call BS.

Most here don't agree with you. And on a larger scale, not holding businesses accountable when they lie or break trust with the public is a bad general practice. True, it's not like they're a bank that foreclosed on a house they didn't actually own title to (happens a lot), and they're not financially trading cop's and firemmen's pension funds away for money management fees (also a lot), but they are lying. People who bought it - literally and figuratively - have a right to call them on it.

[24ct]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

Little things such as LD2K saying "You'll See..."
When asked if they had a new CAP...may not be seen as a lie...
But things like this are unacceptable...

I understand his obligations but "You'll See" isn't 'No'
Which is the answer he should have given...if anything...

This is the example I used because this is what they've done with every issue we've asked about...

2K obviously finagled us into a Day1 purchase...
I'm sure they will fix what they can of these problems with a patch...
But for them to condone this marketing tactic/method of keep them guessing is deceitful.

They knew if they told us about any of these issues (no CAP/CAT/etc) they would lose sales and people wouldn't buy the game. Instead they didn't and now those people who wouldn't have purchased 2K14 won't purchase 2k15...

[Gosens6]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

Little things such as LD2K saying "You'll See..."
When asked if they had a new CAP...may not be seen as a lie...
But things like this are unacceptable...

I understand his obligations but "You'll See" isn't 'No'
Which is the answer he should have given...if anything...

This is the example I used because this is what they've done with every issue we've asked about...

2K obviously finagled us into a Day1 purchase...
I'm sure they will fix what they can of these problems with a patch...
But for them to condone this marketing tactic/method of keep them guessing is deceitful.

They knew if they told us about any of these issues (no CAP/CAT/etc) they would lose sales and people wouldn't buy the game. Instead they didn't and now those people who wouldn't have purchased 2K14 won't purchase 2k15...

They're at least losing a handful of day one sales from a few guys here. Not like it will make a difference to any of them, or put a dent in their pockets, but there's no way in hell I'll trust anything they tell me anymore and buy day one like I have every year.

[WarlordZMaster]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

Next year, no way will i buy on Day 1. I wont to see if the VC, microtransactions are at least toned down. Otherwise, 2K and my wallet are getting a divorce.

[apollooff320]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

You guys have to stop thinking casuals are stupid. I have friends that are casuals gamers and picked this game up because of the graphics. All of them are complaining about the same problems we are. You don't think a casual is going to see all the scripted problems in Mycareer? You don't think a casual is going to see he has to buy VC to unlock things in MyGM or that his players are pissed off? Just look at all the gaming forums that have a thread dedicated to this game complaining about the issues. A lot of ppl bought this game because of the pretty graphics.

The big question is how did gamer reviewers not run into these bugs and problems? are these game reviewers more casual then a casual gamer? is a thing even possible lol? Are they just playing quick games and then simming Mycareer and giving review ratings?

[spankdatazz22]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

The core of your argument is that, if a corporation or salesperson lies, no one should call them on it. Caveat emptor, let the buyer beware, full stop. You take that to such an extreme that to you there's no valid place for anyone to hold them accountable through speech or to call BS.

Most here don't agree with you. And on a larger scale, not holding businesses accountable when they lie or break trust with the public is a bad general practice. True, it's not like they're a bank that foreclosed on a house they didn't actually own title to (happens a lot), and they're not financially trading cop's and firemmen's pension funds away for money management fees (also a lot), but they are lying. People who bought it - literally and figuratively - have a right to call them on it.

Doesn't matter what I think but I'd say most don't take everything said literally as some of you do. Should businesses be held accountable for statements? Of course. But to go so far as to call them liars...? I'm sorry but that's too extreme - to ME, which is part of the reason why I choose not to comment much on the board anymore. The level of contempt being shown by some - again relative to the overall quality of the game - makes no sense to me. And again for me I don't see where these statements, whether overstatements or not, are egregious enough to go so far as to call someone a liar. Perhaps I'm just cynical, but if I hear someone selling me something as being the best thing since sliced bread I don't take that literally as fact, and add some context to what's being said for my own good.

ESPECIALLY given the circumstances. This is a launch game that released less than two months after a major current gen upgrade of the game.

Some of you are very particular in what you want, what you want being said, and how you want it said to you. To my knowledge these guys aren't game developers, but they get blamed for presenting information a certain way. Perhaps I'm looking at it the wrong way, but these guys don't work for me - they work for 2K. It's their job as marketers to sell a product, or as a community liason to provide a connection between the community and the developers. I don't see where they're doing such a horrible job that they should be called liars. Not even close. Because certain features aren't what you want them to be and you feel they should've been saying "Well my bosses told me to sell you guys on the product but I prefer to get mad respect from the community and behave more as one of you...". As far as I can tell, they're doing their jobs. It's your job as a consumer to disseminate the information appropriately.

I don't think there was something that was completely broken and they purposely misguided people and said they functioned properly (like say, certain modes didn't work at all - and I mean TRULY broken, not OS's token tagging of something as "it's broken" because they don't like how it behaves).

[RangersCruz]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

You guys have to stop thinking casuals are stupid. I have friends that are casuals gamers and picked this game up because of the graphics. All of them are complaining about the same problems we are. You don't think a casual is going to see all the scripted problems in Mycareer? You don't think a casual is going to see he has to buy VC to unlock things in MyGM or that his players are pissed off?

I would think casuals are going to be more away from the VC thing then the hardcore 2k fans just my opinion though

[LorenzoDC]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

Doesn't matter what I think but I'd say most don't take everything said literally as some of you do. Should businesses be held accountable for statements? Of course. But to go so far as to call them liars...? I'm sorry but that's too extreme - to ME, which is part of the reason why I choose not to comment much on the board anymore. The level of contempt being shown by some - again relative to the overall quality of the game - makes no sense to me. And again for me I don't see where these statements, whether overstatements or not, are egregious enough to go so far as to call someone a liar. Perhaps I'm just cynical, but if I hear someone selling me something as being the best thing since sliced bread I don't take that literally as fact, and add some context to what's being said for my own good.

ESPECIALLY given the circumstances. This is a launch game that released less than two months after a major current gen upgrade of the game.

Some of you are very particular in what you want, what you want being said, and how you want it said to you. To my knowledge these guys aren't game developers, but they get blamed for presenting information a certain way. Perhaps I'm looking at it the wrong way, but these guys don't work for me - they work for 2K. It's their job as marketers to sell a product, or as a community liason to provide a connection between the community and the developers. I don't see where they're doing such a horrible job that they should be called liars. Not even close. Because certain features aren't what you want them to be and you feel they should've been saying "Well my bosses told me to sell you guys on the product but I prefer to get mad respect from the community and behave more as one of you...". As far as I can tell, they're doing their jobs. It's your job as a consumer to disseminate the information appropriately.

I don't think there was something that was completely broken and they purposely misguided people and said they functioned properly (like say, certain modes didn't work at all - and I mean TRULY broken, not OS's token tagging of something as "it's broken" because they don't like how it behaves).

Actually, I'm going to agree with you a little bit here. "Lying" may be too strong. When you get down to parsing language, it may be that they are just "deceiving," but they have done so knowingly, with intent. To me, as a consumer, that's enough to raise a stink about. Plus, raising said stink has the possibly low but not zero probability chance of forcing changes in corporate behavior and improvements to the game in the future.

That or they just fire and replace their public marketing faces and replace them with others whose personal credibility hasn't been trashed yet. Rinse, repeat.

[cthurt]

Re: Did We Get Bamboozled?

You guys have to stop thinking casuals are stupid. I have friends that are casuals gamers and picked this game up because of the graphics. All of them are complaining about the same problems we are. You don't think a casual is going to see all the scripted problems in Mycareer? You don't think a casual is going to see he has to buy VC to unlock things in MyGM or that his players are pissed off? Just look at all the gaming forums that have a thread dedicated to this game complaining about the issues. A lot of ppl bought this game because of the pretty graphics.

This is very true, I mean this game is so watered down and restricted its damn near impossible for anyone to fully enjoy it, and thats why I am still trying to understand what 2k was thinking in going in this new direction of gaming. I know a patch will come out and we can hope for the best but 2k never released a patch that fixed problems without creating new problems in the game.