Hyperbole in ratings...

[trandoanhung1991]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

I think this depends on context. If you are talking about playing a single game, then yes perhaps you do not need to go much lower in ratings.

But, if you are talking about MYLEAGUE or a career mode then the rating scales need to utilize more of the spectrum. I have played 2k for many years, mainly association/MYLEAGUE, as long as the rating scale is in effect (and the odds of a video game going away from the rating scale is extremely rare) the results of your career mode will not replicate real life as accurately as it could.

I was excited this year when it was announced the rating scale would be based upon the history of the nba. Turns out, that was really not true. Yes they made Jordan a 99 and rated the star players around that, but there was no change in the rest of the league. Do you think a player like Lou Williams who was initially rated an 80, is an 80 on an a time scale? Of course not. That's the rating they would have given him 2k15 and 2k14.

Ratings are the core of the results of the games. As long as we have this (imo) small gap in ratings between stars and everyone else, the game will not work right.

There are too many 80s and 70s, period. As you progress further and further in (unless you are using very well done custom roster and draft classes) this only gets worse. You see less teams winning 60 games and less teams losing 60 games. The teams get very very close.

Yes, tendencies and playbooks will effect the sim stats, but the cpu decisions and the results are primarily based on overall ratings of the players.

I've mentioned many times on here about how I've seen the Sixers win the championship year 3 with embiid Noel okafor and 2 lottery picks starting, all having ratings in the low 80's. One problem of course is the auto generated classes spitting out way too highly rated players. But unless those two drafted lottery picks were LeBron and Anthony Davis, the sixers are not winning the nba championship in 2017-2018.

Does anyone really think this years Miami Heat team is going to win the championship this year? That is a team right now in 2k made up of all 80s. And in 2k that's all you need. The game doesn't differentiate between star players and all-stars enough.

That's why the ratings need to be adjusted, less 80's and 70's.

Well, last year's GSW was a team made up of 80s and 70s IIRC. They won.

[Real2KInsider]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

There are too many 80s and 70s, period. As you progress further and further in (unless you are using very well done custom roster and draft classes) this only gets worse. You see less teams winning 60 games and less teams losing 60 games. The teams get very very close.

This has more to do with randomized generic player generation than 2K's rating system.

A quick sim:

WEST
62 Warriors (Lost in C.Finals): Curry 95, Klay 85, Green 85, Barnes 80, Iguodala 80
60 Thunder (Won Finals): Durant 92, Westbrook 91, Ibaka 80, Kanter 80
51 Spurs (Lost in 2nd): Kawhi 91, Duncan 86, Aldridge 84, Parker 84, Ginobili 81
50 Pelicans: Davis 91, Tyreke 82
46 Suns (Lost in 2nd): Bledsoe 86, Knight 83
45 Rockets: Harden 89, Howard 83
43 Clippers: Griffin 90, Paul 88, Jordan 83
38 Wolves: 81 Towns, 81 Wiggins, 80 Rubio

EAST
59 Cavs (Lost in Finals): LeBron 94, Kyrie 87, Love 85
54 Heat (Lost in C.Finals): 86 Wade, 85 Bosh, 83 Whiteside
46 Pacers (Lost in 2nd): 91 George
43 Celtics (Lost in 2nd): Isaiah 84
41 Pistons: 87 Drummond, 83 Jackson
41 Hawks: 84 Millsap, 83 Teague, 83 Horford
39 Knicks: 86 Melo, 80 Porzingis
39 Raptors: 87 Lowry, 85 DeRozan, 81 Valanciunas

Not seeing any issues here in terms of team ranking, the teams with the highest rated players are supposed to win more.

[Comduklakis]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

more often than not the teams with the highest rated players do win. However there continues to be too much parity. Rarely (despite your sim) do you see a team win 60 and even more rarely do you see a team win less than 20. Even this year's sixers consistently break 20 wins in the sims I have done. Almost every non-playoff team is between 30 and 37 wins. This has been an issue for years on 2k. Top seeds often win 52 or 53 games. Again, the reason IMO is that superstars don't dominate like they can or should. IRL no other major team sport allows one individual to impact performance like basketball. This should be better reflected in the 2k

[wodi]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

I'm talking more about 2, 3 years down the line. Year 1 usually works out well. I guarantee you'll start to see less teams winning 60 and less teams winning only 20.

[wodi]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

Well, last year's GSW was a team made up of 80s and 70s IIRC. They won.

They had the mvp who is in the 90's.

The 04 Pistons is a better example for your argument.

Regardless, my point is more about the impact star players have, In real life it is tremendous. A leBron led team will pretty much never not make the playoffs. In this game, I would argue depth matters more and that is because of the way the 80's and upper 70 players are rated.

[wodi]

Hyperbole in ratings...

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1451595681.876299.jpg

Someone posted this picture of their team in a MYLEAGUE.

This should never happen. 10 players 77+!?!?!?!

This is a big part of the issue. There are wayyyyyyyy too many mid to upper 70's.

I'm very curious to know if you added up the overall ratings for all active nba players year one and compared that total to the total 3 years down the line. I'd bet anything the total jumps significantly.

[Comduklakis]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

Absolutely. I simmed into a third year of a franchise for the Pistons. Dinwiddie and Hilliard never played yet Hilliard is a 74 in year 3 and Dinwiddie a 77.

[Real2KInsider]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

[ATTACH]113492[/ATTACH]

Someone posted this picture of their team in a MYLEAGUE.

This should never happen. 10 players 77+!?!?!?!

This is a big part of the issue. There are wayyyyyyyy too many mid to upper 70's.

I'm very curious to know if you added up the overall ratings for all active nba players year one and compared that total to the total 3 years down the line. I'd bet anything the total jumps significantly.

So what you're trying to say.... is that a young team with TWO first overall picks and other young players shouldn't see them develop?

RIGHT NOW
81 Wiggins (20)
81 Towns (20)
80 Rubio (25)
76 LaVine (20)
75 Dieng (25)
74 Muhammad (23)

He signed two quality free agents and drafted two players. The Wolves are a relatively easy team to rebuild with, and should rise quickly IRL. Why is this an issue?

[Real2KInsider]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

In this game, I would argue depth matters more and that is because of the way the 80's and upper 70 players are rated.

That is because injuries are a thing and never accounted for when people make these statements.

The Spurs are stupid deep and haven't had a 90-rated player in nearly a decade, yet they have continued to top the league ranks for a reason.

[tril]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

I like the parity with the mid level tiered players.
attributes on their own doesn't mean a thing. you have to take all the attributes into consideration
for example a player with an 80 for a mid range shooter may actually be worst than a player with a mid-range of 65.
that 80 mid range shooter might be less consistent than the shooter with the 65.
in addition that 80 mid range shooter might actually drop to lower rating when he's d'd up.
alot of attributes go into any one rating. especially the shooting ones.

once you learn a player's tendencies, that 65 rated player can actually be a better fit for a roster.

[janmagn]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

I like the parity with the mid level tiered players.
attributes on their own doesn't mean a thing. you have to take all the attributes into consideration
for example a player with an 80 for a mid range shooter may actually be worst than a player with a mid-range of 65.
that 80 mid range shooter might be less consistent than the shooter with the 65.
in addition that 80 mid range shooter might actually drop to lower rating when he's d'd up.
alot of attributes go into any one rating. especially the shooting ones.

once you learn a player's tendencies, that 65 rated player can actually be a better fit for a roster.

On top of that, you may like the worse shooter because of his smooth and easy release

Lähetetty minun LG-H440n laitteesta Tapatalkilla

[wodi]

Hyperbole in ratings...

So what you're trying to say.... is that a young team with TWO first overall picks and other young players shouldn't see them develop?

RIGHT NOW
81 Wiggins (20)
81 Towns (20)
80 Rubio (25)
76 LaVine (20)
75 Dieng (25)
74 Muhammad (23)

He signed two quality free agents and drafted two players. The Wolves are a relatively easy team to rebuild with, and should rise quickly IRL. Why is this an issue?

I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying if you look at the year one rosters, they aren't great but let's just for argument sake say they get the job done. As you progress seasons upon seasons the overall ratings as a whole should not go up and up. There isn't enough player regression. Every young player in real life in the league does not improve each and every year. Don't look at the names or ages on the wolves. The key is the overalls. Go through the opening rosters of any year for the entire existence of the 2k series. I guarantee you there is not a single team with 10 players rated 77 and above.

The issue is a general issue not a specific one to a specific team or players. Because of the overalls that the players start with and the way the game works young players progress always and as you move into a MYLEAGUE the league does not account for this and you see a ton of upper 70 and 80 rated players. This takes away the importance of star players.

You can tell me that they have progression and regression sliders at my disposal. This is true, but they do not work the way they should. If you increase the regression slider, every player in the league will regress, Kevin Durant, Anthony Davis, everyone.

The issue is the base rosters, there are too many 70s and 80s.

I play with the SIMworld custom roster and draft classes. Not just because they are extremely well done, but mainly just because they correct as best as they can these issues. They create the classes and the base roster to limit this type of over progression league wide year by year and so that the league isn't flooded with stars or at a dearth of stars.

This isn't an option for everyone, and it shouldn't have to be. The base rosters and progression and regression models out of he box need to be fixed.

I'm sorry if any wolves fan takes offense to me saying they should never have 10 77+ players on their team, but you're crazy if you're telling me that is realistic for any team in the league.

[Comduklakis]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

I like the parity with the mid level tiered players.
attributes on their own doesn't mean a thing. you have to take all the attributes into consideration
for example a player with an 80 for a mid range shooter may actually be worst than a player with a mid-range of 65.
that 80 mid range shooter might be less consistent than the shooter with the 65.
in addition that 80 mid range shooter might actually drop to lower rating when he's d'd up.
alot of attributes go into any one rating. especially the shooting ones.

once you learn a player's tendencies, that 65 rated player can actually be a better fit for a roster.

yes and no. Yes a lower rated player can somtimes be a better performer than a higher rated player. And certainly a lower rated player can be a better fit. The issue, as stated earlier in the thread, is that 2k uses overall as the basis for cpu rotations, free agent signings, trade value, and contract value. As a results, underlying ratings such as "awareness" and "IQ" are often inflated to raise the overall ratings for 3 and D types and other role players and specialists. The truth of the matter is that a player like Anthony Tolliver should be about as pedestrian and uncreative a passer as there is. He should shoot the three, be a passable rebounder, and play decent D with a slightly above average block. Beyond that all passes should be the safest, most uncreative possible. He should rarely even dribble, much less make any fancy moves. Reality is, that doesn't happen. Players who are specialists are able to play like players who have more varied skills. The only way to solve this is somehow have 2k figure out how to better recognize specific skills and team needs in creating player rotations, signing free agents, and making trades. I'm not holding my breath because that seems to me, with ZERO game programming knowledge, infinitely complicated.

[wodi]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

Right.... Let me add this has nothing to do with gameplay or playing online or exhibition games or anything. This is strictly about the way MYLEAGUE or mygm works as you progress seasons.

[wodi]

Re: Hyperbole in ratings...

. I'm not holding my breath because that seems to me, with ZERO game programming knowledge, infinitely complicated.

On the surface it seems that way, but what I bet the simple answer is that the programmers just don't look at any results or ratings season 2,3,4,5...... They test out the rosters year one, it works out and they don't touch it again or look at what happens in any subsequent year.