Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

[Chairman7w]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

OMG@!!11!@!! Just lost an absolute BATTLE 91-88.

I (Denver) had a 10 pt lead with 7mins to go but JUST couldn't hold San Anton down. San Antonio finished on FIRE, shooting 63% inthe 4th!!! I vomited all over myself in the 4th, haplessly throwing up a miserable 32.1%.

Carmelo led the way with 27, but lost his touch in the 4th, going 4-11.

You-know-who (Bonner) was quiet for three quarters (only 2 pts) but then exploded for 10 pts in the 4th, laughing in glee as my lead disappeared.

Parker also came on strong, scoring 10 in the 4th. Duncan was his usual robot-like self, going 20 pts/10 rebs.

DVR / SA

Pts 88 91
FGP 41.6 47.1
REB 49 48
*** 7 20 (there's why I lost - pass the ball dummy!)
BLK 4 3 (for all you "There's too many blocks!" guys)
STL 1 1 (for all you "There's too many steals!" guys)

Props to whoever that was several pages back who posted their strategies (loose on parker, loose on jefferson, etc), those strategies worked great, except in the 4th quarter, where I played like crap.

Gonna do this again tomorrow, can't wait.

[tcain80]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

When people post that they had games in which there were several runs by each team and therefore it must be scripted, I'm curious how real NBA games play out? Don't NBA games consist of several runs as well?

It's how these runs come about, that's the difference. Watching the cpu hit a fadeaway over a double team while your best shooter is missing wide open shots is just frustrating.

[therizing02]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Well I tried to play a couple more games tonight but I just couldn't finish. They were that bad.

The spinning move from the wings into the lane for the finger rolls by Duncan and Bonner when the CPU was on their run. The 5 shots in a row I was scripted to miss under my basket for the CPU to get an outlet and Bonner to warp through 3 defenders for an easy lay up and the worst of the night was Ginobili's 15 ft. catch and shoot jumper he hit while facing the scorers table all in one motion.

The animations on this level for the last two games I played were embarrassing and ridiculous.

Back to PRO.

[donkey33]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

I've had no trouble with the game so far. Won my first two games on superstar, win on all star on a regular basis and tonight just got it handed to me by the Spurs on all star, lol.

Couldn't get anything going at all early on but settled into it later in the first. They got out to a 10 point lead off an 18-10 run. I just couldn't keep Parker out of the paint and Duncan was abusing Kenyon.

Switched to a zone and that stemmed the flow but other than the 18-10 run in the 1st quarter, I never saw another one all game. The biggest from memory may have been a team going on a 6 point stretch.

As I said, couldn't get anything going in the first. Put it all on Melo's shoulders and he responded. Carried the team all night with a few nice shots from JR but could never get closer than 6 points. If that 18-10 spurt didn't get them out there, this would have been close all game.

Parker was the player of the game. His ability to get into the paint was causing me grief. He had 26 and 13 dimes. Duncan had 16 and 13, Dice 11, Jefferson 17 and Manu 14. Bonner had 13.

For us, Melo had 45, 6 and 5, Billups had 16 and 6, JR 21 and the bigs 5 points combined.

Den (me) @ SA (cpu)
98 - 107 (points)
49.4% - 52.7% (field goal %)
44/89 - 48/91 (fg/fga)
38.5% - 41.7% (three %)
5/13 - 5/12 (3p/3pa)
83.3% - 75.0% (free throw %)
5/6 - 6/8 (ft/fta)
39 - 41 (rebounds)
21 - 26 (assists)
2 - 5 (blocks)
3 - 3 (steals)
14 - 12 (turnovers)
7 - 8 (fouls)
4 - 4 (off rebounds)
35 - 37 (def rebounds)
5 - 8 (fast break points)
0 - 8 (second chance points)

The points in the paint are not listed but they pounded it in there. I remember seeing the half time tally and it was something like 25 in the paint of 51 total.

1st
23 (den) - 24 (sa)
11/22 - 12/24

2nd
19 - 27
9/23 - 12/23

3rd
26 - 29
13/25 - 13/22

4th
30 - 27
11/19 - 11/22

Wasn't without it's glitches (fouls, etc) that are always mentioned but thoroughly enjoyable and to test runs, I never felt they were scripted and still don't. Bar that one in the first quarter, it was a real slug all game.

[eDotd]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

I didn't get involved in the other thread since I really wasn't seeing what people were talking about, but I figure I'd participate in this little activity we have going on here.

Final score was 97-95, Spurs, close game throughout. Spurs shooting 64% from the line and Melo balling his *** off kept me in the game. 14 offensive rebounds and 14 second chance points kept them in the game. No Matt Bonner miracles or anything like that.

I was able to hold TP to just 11 points with just 1 layup. Didn't matter though, SA's attack was a balanced one. They offered up a healthy dose of scoring in the paint and although I was able to hold my own (Birdman was all over the place) it ended up being to much. I could've got Nene involved a bit more but with the way Melo was shooting I wanted to keep it in his hands.

There were definitely runs. I think I started every quarter except the 3rd with a 6-0/8-2 run. They closed within 5 several times but after calling a timeout to regroup and get back into my offense I was able to hold them off.

There was one instance where the spurs tied it in the 3rd but after a timeout I came out with a quick screen for Billups on the inbound as he proceeded to hit a 3. That, another three by Billups with the shot clock winding down, and a three in transition with Melo after a block on TP put me back on top by 9. Timeout spurs..

This is how most of my games play out. Runs, runs and more runs. Little runs, big runs, runs that get stopped in their tracks because of unforced turnovers that lead to complete momentum swings, or just good old timeouts to get your head together.

Anyway, complete recap via screens:

[staffan]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

When people post that they had games in which there were several runs by each team and therefore it must be scripted, I'm curious how real NBA games play out? Don't NBA games consist of several runs as well?

Nono...in NBA the teams do NOT try to score!

[bls]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Wow Momentous, major difference from my game to yours in the way Mcdyess played. How did you have your D set to play him?

[Da_Czar]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Nice job to everyone who contributed. I just updated my game on page 5 for who ever wants to see.

For those having those impossible runs by the cpu who are participating in this experiment don't be afraid to elaborate on those and be sure to note time and place in my video where you see what you describe happening so it gives us all a point of reference as to what your calling impossible runs.

In my game in that first qtr Ginobli hit some tuff tuff shots and duncan had that deep 2. Up to half time it did not continue but that was a hell of a stretch to get them back in the game.

Was that a legitimate run by stars or is that comeback logic ?

[PuntNL]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Nice job to everyone who contributed. I just updated my game on page 5 for who ever wants to see.

For those having those impossible runs by the cpu who are participating in this experiment don't be afraid to elaborate on those and be sure to note time and place in my video where you see what you describe happening so it gives us all a point of reference as to what your calling impossible runs.

In my game in that first qtr Ginobli hit some tuff tuff shots and duncan had that deep 2. Up to half time it did not continue but that was a hell of a stretch to get them back in the game.

Was that a legitimate run by stars or is that comeback logic ?

No Comeback AI was stated by the devs on these forums, but couldnt it be the problem of dynamic DNA and the game being driven by percentages? You keep a team / player on low percentages by good defense, which makes the % in that game being a lot lower than their average percentages. Maybe this could lead to them making difficult shots later in the game to get to a level of the average percentages. Thats how this game is driven, so maybe that needs more finetuning in the next year, because now in certain situations it seems to lead to some kind of unintended comeback logic.

[Bootzilla]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Don't want to clutter the thread but, I tried to get a game in before I went out of town. I realized in the 3rd that I didn't change my sliders to everything default so, I kinda blew the experiment right there. There is some good insight on how guys are playing. What's strange is that I play better against good and balanced teams (Spurs, Celtics) than I do vs the Griz or Thunder. Wing players like Durant, Gay, and Mayo are a lot tougher to deal with.

Honestly, what would be great would be the following sliders. Human defensive awareness. User help defense effectiveness. User closeout effectiveness. Slight bumps in those categories would work wonders for me.

Has anyone gotten a big lead and just maintained it throughout a game?

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Don't want to clutter the thread but, I tried to get a game in before I went out of town. I realized in the 3rd that I didn't change my sliders to everything default so, I kinda blew the experiment right there. There is some good insight on how guys are playing. What's strange is that I play better against good and balanced teams (Spurs, Celtics) than I do vs the Griz or Thunder. Wing players like Durant, Gay, and Mayo are a lot tougher to deal with.

Honestly, what would be great would be the following sliders. Human defensive awareness. User help defense effectiveness. User closeout effectiveness. Slight bumps in those categories would work wonders for me.

Has anyone gotten a big lead and just maintained it throughout a game?

My game, I was more or less in control from start to finish, I posted about it a couple of pages back.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Is it okay for those who participated, play again?

[Da_Czar]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

SA-95 DEN(me)-88

SA-29-19-22-25-95
DE-24-20-23-21-88

SA/DEN

FG%-47/43
3%-25/33
FTA/M-13-15/6-10
REB-43/40
AST-26/20
BLK-5/4
STL-4/0
TO-8/12
FBP-2/0
2CP-6/6

Denver

Melo-26p 6r 4a
Billups- 26p 5r 8a
Nene-11p 10r
Smith- 11p

San Antonio

Ginobili- 22p
Parker-18p 12a
Duncan- 16p 11r
Jefferson- 16p
McDyess- 9p 13r

SA Bench

Mason- 9p
Bonner- 3p 5r
Finley- 2p



Yes, SA closed the game with a 12-0 run that I didn't like very much, but that's somewhat believable considering they were at home.


The second half was tight the whole way. I actually led by 5 with 2 minutes left and was bracing myself for the "run". It happened but like I said it was somewhat believable. Mason was key hitting a 3 point shot and then he took advantage of a mistake on D on my part.

Rings I see you had 12 To's during the game. Did those occur during the runs they would make ?

[Da_Czar]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

Is it okay for those who participated, play again?

Sure try a different strategy if you like also. This has been very interesting. I am finding that most guys seem to be micro in their gameplans where I see now that I take a more macro approach.

Some people also see Dna as something that will even itself out as a reason for the runs they see. I can see that as a good theory now. While I always looked at dna as a safety blanket for my macro game strategy.

For instance if my strategy was to make bonner and mcdyess beat me. As the game goes on at a Micro level I don't care if they are making shots. My thing is they can't score enough on their own to beat me. So as the game goes on because they are using real world shooting percentages unless they are on a hot streak I know that eventually the worm will turn.

No matter how many amazing shots they might hit. I can depend on that and allow my gameplay to develop over the course of 48 minutes.

Others are seeing that if the cpu comes out cold then low and behold to make sure they are going to shoot their 48% it doesn't matter what kind of defense you play they are going to hit those shots.

on a micro level I can see that. For ME though on a macro level that is a gameplan issue by me as the coach. If I allow Duncan and Ginobli and Parker and Bonner and Mcdyess to get it going that's on me (in my mind about my playing this is not directed towards anyone at all just explaining my mindset)

So to apply this to the game I played. After studying the DNA they like to go inside. They are not really a jump shooting team. So I started off the game seeing who was hot... After I identified it was ginobli. We doubled him and tried to get the ball out of his hands. Then we wanted to make them hit circus shots in the paint all game long. Over the course of 48 minutes Dna will not allow them to do that.

So I'm not concerned with them hitting 3-4 circus shots. But I don't want to litter the game with a bunch of high percentage open shots to go along with that. We had some defensive break downs and gave up a layup here and there. But overall we forced them to play half court against a defense designed over the course of 48 mintues to make them make tuff shots all game long.

I believe SA finished the game with 78 points

[Bootzilla]

Re: Czar's game feels scripted group experiment

My game, I was more or less in control from start to finish, I posted about it a couple of pages back.

Yeah, I checked that out. I guess I would consider that more of a close game. You did maintain though out which is great. In close games when I'm up 6 points or so I can keep runs at bay. When I get up 12-14 points forget about it. I think I play a little too head up without many adjustments leaving it up to the cpu on auto.