Suction, Control, and Animations

[mrprice33]

I don't think dumbed down is the right description. Dumbing down refers to removing complexity or difficulty. If anything, they've gone the opposite route when it comes to gameplay.

Visually, Sig shots, arena authenticity, refs not moving, the sliding on the court. These re all things that we've seen that are plain as day. I know the demo will give us a chance to try out their bread and butter feature (controls) but what the videos have shown is not sim.

Sent from my HTC EVO 4G using Tapatalk.

[jr2424]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

I don't think dumbed down is the right description. Dumbing down refers to removing complexity or difficulty. If anything, they've gone the opposite route when it comes to gameplay.



Sent from my HTC EVO 4G using Tapatalk.

You are 100 percent right that if the gameplay is what they say it is (which we won't know until the demo drops) then dumbed down is not right for the gameplay. But I wasn't really saying dumbed down for the gameplay because we don't know that yet. It's the things I talked about from the videos. Not the gameplay because that wouldn't be fair. But I think commenting about what we've seen is fair and if you think what we've seen in those videos is SIM then we have different definitions.

[mrprice33]

It's not 100% authentic, no.

You are 100 percent right that if the gameplay is what they say it is (which we won't know until the demo drops) then dumbed down is not right for the gameplay. But I wasn't really saying dumbed down for the gameplay because we don't know that yet. It's the things I talked about from the videos. Not the gameplay because that wouldn't be fair. But I think commenting about what we've seen is fair and if you think what we've seen in those videos is SIM then we have different definitions.

Sent from my HTC EVO 4G using Tapatalk.

[rEAnimator]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

Visually, Sig shots, arena authenticity, refs not moving, the sliding on the court. These re all things that we've seen that are plain as day. I know the demo will give us a chance to try out their bread and butter feature (controls) but what the videos have shown is not sim.

I've seen this a few times and I don't know where it started, but we have sig shots in the game this year.

People have even been discussing them, and which ones have changed.

[jr2424]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

I think my use of dumbed down was wrong. Let me say it's not as detailed. I think if this was an NFL situation (exclusive rights) then EA can do this and all we can do is complain but we'd be held hostage if we really wanted a new NBA game. But when you see all the things the competition has done this year on top of selling 2 million last year, you have to outdo them to beat them. And from what I've seen from both games, you would think the other company was the one trying to win back fans. I always root for Live/Elite because I played their game for so many years. But I don't believe in loyalty when it comes to consumerism. Like rEAnimator said, "People will vote with their money." So true.

[23]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

I think I should restate what im saying.. because in no way am I trying to offend anyone.. but in the interest of the sport, its time to move past the generic basketball whether its considered a sim or not.

The reason people arent buying the games as much is because of the same issues that have been stated over and over by the more longtime players, but there seems to be only deaf ears those things are falling on.

The controls are not the reason this game was doing bad enough to have a name change ,because the truth is it already had a pretty simplified control scheme sans live 06 on the xbox 1, although that doesnt mean people are rejecting an improvement, this is still not the reason for the low sales

There is a saying that the little foxes destroy the vine, and there you have things that might seem significant to you such as customizations to season, an actual meaningful upgrade to dynasty, more real life tv presentation, player individual representations, signature packages, realistic movement, and so on.

As much as some of these things just werent the top priority, its for sure the things people have been all but saying in frustration for years, but hey what do I know.. I just play.

[jr2424]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

I've seen this a few times and I don't know where it started, but we have sig shots in the game this year.

People have even been discussing them, and which ones have changed.

Maybe it's the videos I've seen but it's been tough to see the sig shots. I know I will get a better look at them once the demo drops. But the other issues are still there. And no in-game injuries? I hope I'm not attacking or coming off as being unfair. I do appreciate that you guys come on here and discuss this with us. That is not easy, especially when so much of it is negative. I am still looking forward to the demo and I hope I am totally wrong on the issues I've discussed.

[convince]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

I've seen this a few times and I don't know where it started, but we have sig shots in the game this year.

People have even been discussing them, and which ones have changed.

So what about the other things mentioned?

[COACH WEBB]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

I've seen this a few times and I don't know where it started, but we have sig shots in the game this year.

People have even been discussing them, and which ones have changed.

Well, this is good.

[rEAnimator]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

So what about the other things mentioned?

What were they? Sliding, refs not moving and authentic arenas?

I don't know anything about arenas in the game. I'm not sure what's not authentic about them and why that would be the case. Could be licensing, could be resourcing, I have no idea and would prefer to stick to gameplay as that's my area.

The refs moved when I left for vacation. So unless something was changed to improve performance I would expect them to move in the final product.

But I'll check it out when I get back so I'm up to speed.

As for the sliding, that's obviously not ideal. I'd love to get rid of every bit of sliding in the game, but it's not a simple thing to do, and when you have a fixed amount of time you have to prioritize and we chose to prioritize the things that affect the way the game plays, make sure that the outcomes of the interactions between players and what makes a successful basket possible are as authentic as possible.

You'll always be able to point to something in the game that isn't exactly the same as real life and say it's not authentic.

But that doesn't mean we aren't making an authentic simulation game. It just means we didn't make it perfect. And perfection is a pretty tall order.

[jr2424]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

What were they? Sliding, refs not moving and authentic arenas?

I don't know anything about arenas in the game. I'm not sure what's not authentic about them and why that would be the case. Could be licensing, could be resourcing, I have no idea and would prefer to stick to gameplay as that's my area.

The refs moved when I left for vacation. So unless something was changed to improve performance I would expect them to move in the final product.

But I'll check it out when I get back so I'm up to speed.

As for the sliding, that's obviously not ideal. I'd love to get rid of every bit of sliding in the game, but it's not a simple thing to do, and when you have a fixed amount of time you have to prioritize and we chose to prioritize the things that affect the way the game plays, make sure that the outcomes of the interactions between players and what makes a successful basket possible are as authentic as possible.

You'll always be able to point to something in the game that isn't exactly the same as real life and say it's not authentic.

But that doesn't mean we aren't making an authentic simulation game. It just means we didn't make it perfect. And perfection is a pretty tall order.

Thank you for your frankness. I'm really looking forward to trying out the demo.

[convince]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

First, but not exclusively. It is still an NBA basketball sim game, but we want it to have the level of control and user influence a video game player expects in this day and age.

In no way does that warrant removing NBA from the title. That's just ridiculous.

Every single bit of effort that has gone into the AI is directly towards NBA authenticity and realism.

How about showing some CPU gameplay where a contrast in gameplay is evident. B/C all this user vs user gameplay give off the illusion that you aren't comfortable with showing it. Just give us Spurs vs. the suns.

What you're implying is an insult to the people who work on that part of the game.



The underlying force is sales, which can be analyzed using metacritic rating amongst other things.

If sales are up then more people like the game. It's a basketball game to its core so it has to be fun to play and represent the sport accurately to succeed.

Just because someone buys a game doesn't mean they like it. I'm sure just calculate initial sales, and not the units that are traded back in. I'm pretty sure you guys don't deduct sales numbers in that regard.
I don't know why people take offense to us wanting to increase sales and having sales determine the direction of the game.

It's the ultimate in democracy. Let the consumer decide what they want, and they vote through sales. It's how every company operates at its core, and how success is gauged.

On top of that, we tend to take influence from sites like these where the fans are more informed and vocal than the average fan. And we've done that this year. I could list numerous things in the game that were a direct result of community interaction. Some features and some changes. But all significant.

You should throw a bone and list few b/c based on some things posted the same things continue hinder the series.

But as to a disconnect with long time fans of the series...that's been there for a while. Many people who played Live back in the day aren't playing it anymore.

We want to win them back, keep our current fans, and win over new fans.

In order to accomplish that we've taken the direction of controls and physics, but have not given up on basketball authenticity in the least.

We've willing to sacrifice visuals yes, but that has nothing to do with basketball authenticity in my personal opinion.

Challenge me on that, and we can discuss it. I'm quite confident in my statement.

Just a few things i though i would comment on.

[fatleg3]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

What were they? Sliding, refs not moving and authentic arenas?

I don't know anything about arenas in the game. I'm not sure what's not authentic about them and why that would be the case. Could be licensing, could be resourcing, I have no idea and would prefer to stick to gameplay as that's my area.

The refs moved when I left for vacation. So unless something was changed to improve performance I would expect them to move in the final product.

But I'll check it out when I get back so I'm up to speed.

As for the sliding, that's obviously not ideal. I'd love to get rid of every bit of sliding in the game, but it's not a simple thing to do, and when you have a fixed amount of time you have to prioritize and we chose to prioritize the things that affect the way the game plays, make sure that the outcomes of the interactions between players and what makes a successful basket possible are as authentic as possible.

You'll always be able to point to something in the game that isn't exactly the same as real life and say it's not authentic.

But that doesn't mean we aren't making an authentic simulation game. It just means we didn't make it perfect. And perfection is a pretty tall order.

• There is so much talk about the suction and sliding as if was purpulsly left in the game.

• In the videos the refs movements are minimal but who cares. I surely dont look at the refs when i play the game

[Rocboyz101]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

If sales control the direction of the game..what if this sells bad? You guys are gonna change directions...again? Im just kinda curious here.

[bls]

Re: Suction, Control, and Animations

If sales control the direction of the game..what if this sells bad? You guys are gonna change directions...again? Im just kinda curious here.

Would like to know this as well?????????????????