The LeBron James Thread

[Cebby]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Magic was DRAFTED by the Lakers, man. You can't be that thick.

So what?

He could have pulled the Kobe and refused to play on a team with Kareem and then demanded the Lakers traded the #1 pick of Worthy so that he could win a ring on his own. Or he could have pulled the Elway and have refused to play on the Lakers at all and demand a trade to the last place Jazz. Magic only led the team in scoring 3 times and finished third several times.

Magic just didn't have the heart to win one on his own as the alpha male and had to resort to playing with the then-GOAT and another #1 pick with several other All Defense and All Stars.

Secondly, Miami is not his team, it is D-wades team, he is the alpha male of Miami he has the ring. What about that don't you understand?

It didn't look like that last night.

[capp34]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Magic was DRAFTED by the Lakers, man. You can't be that thick.

Secondly, Miami is not his team, it is D-wades team, he is the alpha male of Miami he has the ring. What about that don't you understand?

In your opinion what does Lebron need to do to make it his team since being the best player on it is not enough.

[NovaStar]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

But look at what you're stating here - let's put the LBJ hate aside for a second:

Much of this argument can be used with other players at some point in their career if we were to go back in the past. I HATE using Kobe as an example, but his is a great one - the first championships weren't with it being "his" team, and when he had the chance to be "the man" he needed Gasol to do it.

All legendary players had some sort of assistance from a possible HOF player. Heck, some couldn't even win without having supporting cast. There's a scary trend with most of these "legendary teams" - one megastar, another just below but still amazing star, and supporting players like a good 3 point shooter. Add a hustle rebounder or lockdown defender... and you have a squad.

Isn't LBJ's legacy now, currently, undefinable, given that you have no idea what he will do? I know exactly what you're thinking... I think he took the easy way out too. But to label his career in terms of championships... I just never agreed with that. I don't think Karl Malone and John Stockton are any less of the amazing players they were because they didn't win a chip. That's what I read when I look at your comment about LBJ.

Good points, Pared. Here is what I am saying, and you pretty much alluded to it. You have to try! The great ones, alpha's, leaders, whatever label you want to put on them are willing to try to win the ring with it all on their shoulders while in their prime. If at the end of their athletic superiority/prime they still don't have a ring it is understood by most, when they attempt to join with other established stars to get it. It was not held against Peyton, Drexler, Barkley, Malone, KG, Ray Allen, etc...why? because they did take on the challenge of attempting to get it while in their individual primes as alpha males. The only problem was they were not getting through Jordan.

LBJ had a legacy he was trying to create while with the Cavs, remember Jordan went through far greater criticism than lebron, and like you said, Kobe also went through it, but niether quit in their primes to join another alpha in his prime. Didn't kobe resign with the Lakers before they got Pau? And even if Kobe would have left the lakers, I can promise you he was not going to a team with another superstar/alpha.

Again, Pared. Heavy is the head that wears the crown. It is not easy becoming a champion, that is why those that get it are held is such a high regard, it is the pressure of being considered great and not producing a ring that makes many players feel unfulfilled about their careers. But for the ones that can shoulder the burden and succeed at getting the ring, they become champions no other label sits higher.

So where is lebron's legacy now? He does not have one (other than failure in Clvnd). He has tied his whole career now to winning a ring with this Miami team or bust, why? because he did not try with the Cavs in his prime. If he does not win a ring, many will not afford him the same understanding that those that came before him got, deservedly so. Why? because he is attempting to do through the back door (relieve pressure off of himself by joining wade) what he could'nt do through the front (win it with the burden on his shoulders with a team built around him).

[NovaStar]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

In your opinion what does Lebron need to do to make it his team since being the best player on it is not enough.

It is quite debatable if he is the best player on the team. But for the sake of argument, there is no one thing that he can do. Let's say D-wade goes down with an injury that keeps him out for the year, and Lebron leads that team to the ring, then I would STFU and admit that lebron is one of the all time greats. Short of that, things will just have to play themselves out. You would have to apply the eye test and go by what you see. Miami would have to win the chip, then it will be clear who the man was or wasn't.

[NovaStar]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

So what?

He could have pulled the Kobe and refused to play on a team with Kareem and then demanded the Lakers traded the #1 pick of Worthy so that he could win a ring on his own. Or he could have pulled the Elway and have refused to play on the Lakers at all and demand a trade to the last place Jazz. Magic only led the team in scoring 3 times and finished third several times.

Magic just didn't have the heart to win one on his own as the alpha male and had to resort to playing with the then-GOAT and another #1 pick with several other All Defense and All Stars.

It didn't look like that last night.

Depends on how you look at things. If lebron avg 31 pts a game and the heat don't make the playoffs, that would be an **** fail! If on the other hand D-wade shakes off the rust (remember he did not play the preseason) and avgs 27 pts and lebron avg say 21pts but D-wade is the closer, it again is Dwade's team. Time will tell, right now that is D-Wades team.

Regarding, the whole magic, worthy thing. You are correct and I agree. Alot goes into becoming a champion, you have to be in the right situation with the right team at the right time. Those things are out of a players control.

Lebron and D-Wade are trying to control the situation, they feel if they get together the ring is inevitable, we will see.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Im going to cut Lebron some slack about the post game.


Hell, Karl Malone is arguably the best Power Forward, ever...and his game was running the floor, catching pick and roles, and either beating people off of the dribble or shooting a jumper from the high post.

Plus, you just dont show up after one off season with a polished post up game.

Being a good post up scorer takes a ton of work, footwork, understanding leverage, space, angles, learning how to seal off your defender, reading double teams, etc., and some people just flat out dont have the feel for it.

[RonnieG]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

But look at what you're stating here - let's put the LBJ hate aside for a second:

Much of this argument can be used with other players at some point in their career if we were to go back in the past. I HATE using Kobe as an example, but his is a great one - the first championships weren't with it being "his" team, and when he had the chance to be "the man" he needed Gasol to do it.

All legendary players had some sort of assistance from a possible HOF player. Heck, some couldn't even win without having supporting cast. There's a scary trend with most of these "legendary teams" - one megastar, another just below but still amazing star, and supporting players like a good 3 point shooter. Add a hustle rebounder or lockdown defender... and you have a squad.

Isn't LBJ's legacy now, currently, undefinable, given that you have no idea what he will do? I know exactly what you're thinking... I think he took the easy way out too. But to label his career in terms of championships... I just never agreed with that. I don't think Karl Malone and John Stockton are any less of the amazing players they were because they didn't win a chip. That's what I read when I look at your comment about LBJ.

Considering a lot of people will actually respect him less the more he wins, his legacy is already kind of pegged.

[aholbert32]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Magic just didn't have the heart to win one on his own as the alpha male and had to resort to playing with the then-GOAT and another #1 pick with several other All Defense and All Stars.

Magic was CLEARLY the Alpha Male on the 87 and 88 teams. Kareem was way passed his prime and Worthy was his number 2. Using that logic, Bird was never won one as an alpha Male either because he played with 3 other HOF.

[aholbert32]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Im going to cut Lebron some slack about the post game.


Hell, Karl Malone is arguably the best Power Forward, ever...and his game was running the floor, catching pick and roles, and either beating people off of the dribble or shooting a jumper from the high post.

Plus, you just dont show up after one off season with a polished post up game.

Being a good post up scorer takes a ton of work, footwork, understanding leverage, space, angles, learning how to seal off your defender, reading double teams, etc., and some people just flat out dont have the feel for it.

Karl had a turnaround fadeaway jumpshot from the post.

[Pared]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Considering a lot of people will actually respect him less the more he wins, his legacy is already kind of pegged.

Do you really think he cares?

[RonnieG]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Do you really think he cares?

Yeah, I do and the commercial pretty much proves it. If he doesnt care, there's no point in trying to rehab his image.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Yeah, I do and the commercial pretty much proves it. If he doesnt care, there's no point in trying to rehab his image.

That commercial had no intention of rehabbing his image.

It struck me more as a big "f you haters, I'm doin me no matter what you say".

How do you think it was trying to repair his image?

And no, he doesn't give a damn about what people think of his legacy, as long as he has jewelry history will judge him in a bright light. Especially if he continues to light up score boards and fill highlight tape. That's just how it goes in sports.

[Pared]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

Yeah, I do and the commercial pretty much proves it. If he doesnt care, there's no point in trying to rehab his image.

What part of the commercial catered to "rehabbing his image?"

I almost feel like some are reading into this what they want to rather than what I would say is a logical conclusion.

Lebron asking what should I do - while making fun of everything people say about him - correlates to him rehabbing his image?

It's smart marketing by Nike and it's keeping him in your minds - in the public eye... but nothing even remotely close to "rehabbing his image" IMHO.

[da ThRONe]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

That commercial had no intention of rehabbing his image.

It struck me more as a big "f you haters, I'm doin me no matter what you say".

How do you think it was trying to repair his image?

And no, he doesn't give a damn about what people think of his legacy, as long as he has jewelry history will judge him in a bright light. Especially if he continues to light up score boards and fill highlight tape. That's just how it goes in sports.

^This

And I agree with it. Personal feeling in sports are great ,but sometimes it goes to far. This LeBron situation is a prime example.

[RonnieG]

Re: The LeBron James Saga

What part of the commercial catered to "rehabbing his image?"

I almost feel like some are reading into this what they want to rather than what I would say is a logical conclusion.

Lebron asking what should I do - while making fun of everything people say about him - correlates to him rehabbing his image?

It's smart marketing by Nike and it's keeping him in your minds - in the public eye... but nothing even remotely close to "rehabbing his image" IMHO.

I agree that it wasnt successful at rehabbing his image. And even though this commercial really wasnt pitching shoes, it was pitching an athlete that they represent and sell. It was an attempt to frame discussion. In the end, I dont think it matters. I dont think people are going to see it and change their minds. But there would be no point to making the commercial if not to rebab his image by trying to soften people in some way.