The Dwight Howard Thread

[Nathan_OS]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

LOL. Looks like the whole team hates Dwight right about now.

That isn't really something new though.

[Porschebenz2001]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

LOL. Looks like the whole team hates Dwight right about now.

That isn't really something new though.

But if you watch ESPN or TNT clearly the locker room is split 50 50 on this. Ya know half for the loyal winning coach. The other half for the guy who up untill a few weeks ago had a list of teams he would rather be with. Seems reasonable.

[DonkeyJote]

But if you watch ESPN or TNT clearly the locker room is split 50 50 on this. Ya know half for the loyal winning coach. The other half for the guy who up untill a few weeks ago had a list of teams he would rather be with. Seems reasonable.

It is if you think about it. If you want to win, Dwight is 10x more important than SVG. Moreso in the NBA than any other sport, the players matter so much more than the coaches.

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[King_B_Mack]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

It is if you think about it. If you want to win, Dwight is 10x more important than SVG. Moreso in the NBA than any other sport, the players matter so much more than the coaches.

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I would say that's the other way around. Unless you can name me another team that's won something with some no name coach? How about we look at the coaches to win titles since 1985.

1 Rick Carlisle
11 Phil Jackson
1 Doc Rivers
4 Greg Popovich
4 Pat Riley
1 Larry Brown
2 Rudy Tomjanovich
2 Chuck Daley
1 KC Jones

Not too many nobodies on that list and keep in mind that covers 27 years. Even if I extended it to 30, you still only add ONE name to that list.

[Drewski]

I'd take those LBJ Mike Brown teams over the D12 SVG teams, if only because Lebron is a better overall player. Alas, I just don't think very highly of Mike Brown's offense and the defense has slipped considerably for the Lakers. But the lockout changed a great deal for coaching staffs so it is what it is. Blaming the condensed season and lack of training camp time, whether justified or not, is the scapegoat for things like that.

Think SVG is underrated as a coach and that Dwight owes him a great deal of credit. No biggie.

Anyway, Dwight has shown just how damaged-goods Orlando is. Clearly the way Shaq left them has left its mark, letting Dwight run wild pushed SVG far enough for him to just out and say it. Apparently he's known this all season, why wait till now to drop it. Curious timing. Wonder what's going on over there.

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[BlueNGold]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

The only way this could get any better was if they replaced Stan with Jeff Van Gundy.

[Porschebenz2001]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-04-05/sports/os-charles-barkley-stan-van-gundy_1_stan-van-gundy-dwight-howard-charles-barkley

At least Shaq wasn't a hypocrite about it last night. He actually supported a guy trying to get his coach fired. I know it's the same guy Shaq had fired years ago, and they hate each other but wow. Lol @ Kenny's blatant set up for the lambasting of Stan Van btw.

[Porschebenz2001]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

It is if you think about it. If you want to win, Dwight is 10x more important than SVG. Moreso in the NBA than any other sport, the players matter so much more than the coaches.

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I don't think so. In MLB, the manager pretty much does nothing but manage the pitching. It's almost all up to the players there.

The Magic will show how important a good basketball coach in the NBA is next year.

[Dice]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

I would say that's the other way around. Unless you can name me another team that's won something with some no name coach? How about we look at the coaches to win titles since 1985.

1 Rick Carlisle
11 Phil Jackson
1 Doc Rivers
4 Greg Popovich
4 Pat Riley
1 Larry Brown
2 Rudy Tomjanovich
2 Chuck Daley
1 KC Jones

Not too many nobodies on that list and keep in mind that covers 27 years. Even if I extended it to 30, you still only add ONE name to that list.

That's an interesting list there. So far, KC Jones, Rick Carlisle Rudy T and Doc Rivers are the only non-HOF coaches on that list.

However, I agree that Howard maybe more valuable to the Magic than SVG. Right now, I can find more people that can do what SVG can does(and maybe better) than I can for what Dwight Howard does. And consensus of knowledgeable basketball fans knows that Howard is the best center in the league right now so you'll be hard pressed to find anyone better that does what he does.

As far as this situation goes, I think they need to rip this team to shreds in the off-season. Fire SVG and trade Dwight Howard just for the sake of sanity next year.

[Colts18]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

I know they are professionals and have jobs to do but I don't see how Dwight can look at anybody in that organization in the face without feeling as though he is a horrible teammate. So disrespectful how he has treated them this year. They all seriously seem like a woman just waiting for any day before their man breaks up with them. I feel for them. Especially his best friend Jameer.

[DonkeyJote]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

I would say that's the other way around. Unless you can name me another team that's won something with some no name coach? How about we look at the coaches to win titles since 1985.

1 Rick Carlisle
11 Phil Jackson
1 Doc Rivers
4 Greg Popovich
4 Pat Riley
1 Larry Brown
2 Rudy Tomjanovich
2 Chuck Daley
1 KC Jones

Not too many nobodies on that list and keep in mind that covers 27 years. Even if I extended it to 30, you still only add ONE name to that list.

And when was the last team to win without a superstar on their team? The Mavs have Dirk. The Lakers had Kobe, and before that Shaq, and before that Magic. The Spurs had Duncan, Manu, and Parker. The Bulls had Michael and Pippen. The Celtics had the big 3, and in the 80's they had Larry Bird. The Rockets had Hakeem, and the Pistons in 89 and 90 had Thomas. The only championship team in that same timespan that didn't have at least one hall of famer or future hall of famer is the 2004 Pistons.

[23]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

And when was the last team to win without a superstar on their team? The Mavs have Dirk. The Lakers had Kobe, and before that Shaq, and before that Magic. The Spurs had Duncan, Manu, and Parker. The Bulls had Michael and Pippen. The Celtics had the big 3, and in the 80's they had Larry Bird. The Rockets had Hakeem, and the Pistons in 89 and 90 had Thomas. The only championship team in that same timespan that didn't have at least one hall of famer or future hall of famer is the 2004 Pistons.

04 Pistons

[King_B_Mack]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

That's an interesting list there. So far, KC Jones, Rick Carlisle Rudy T and Doc Rivers are the only non-HOF coaches on that list.

However, I agree that Howard maybe more valuable to the Magic than SVG. Right now, I can find more people that can do what SVG can does(and maybe better) than I can for what Dwight Howard does. And consensus of knowledgeable basketball fans knows that Howard is the best center in the league right now so you'll be hard pressed to find anyone better that does what he does.

As far as this situation goes, I think they need to rip this team to shreds in the off-season. Fire SVG and trade Dwight Howard just for the sake of sanity next year.

Oh don't get me wrong Dice, I'm not arguing that Stan Van is more important to the Magic than Dwight because he's not. I was merely taking issue to the idea that NBA coaches are the least important because the players matter more than them. If anything it's equal importance.

And when was the last team to win without a superstar on their team? The Mavs have Dirk. The Lakers had Kobe, and before that Shaq, and before that Magic. The Spurs had Duncan, Manu, and Parker. The Bulls had Michael and Pippen. The Celtics had the big 3, and in the 80's they had Larry Bird. The Rockets had Hakeem, and the Pistons in 89 and 90 had Thomas. The only championship team in that same timespan that didn't have at least one hall of famer or future hall of famer is the 2004 Pistons.

Like yourself and 23 already pointed out, the 04 Pistons and yeah that's only one team, but that's still more championships won than some scrub or random Joe Blow coaching a team has done. Shaq and Kobe hadn't won **** and probably wouldn't have won anything had Phil Jackson not come on the scene. Stan Van got the shaft in Miami, but that doesn't change the fact that Pat Riley showed up with virtually the same team a year later and won a title. You can try to give credit to the players all you want but the fact is for about 30 years now the same group of coaches have been winning titles. George Karl had superstars. How's that worked out for him? Jerry Sloan has had superstars how about him? Lenny Wilkens in Atlanta? Pat Riley in New York? If it's let's say a Vinny Del Negro led Heat team in the Finals against a Phil Jackson Laker or Greg Popovich led Spurs team, I'mma go with the other guys since Vinny is pretty much an idiot.

[DonkeyJote]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

First, in every professional sport, it's about the players, not the coaches. I'm not saying coaches don't matter, but Kobe makes the shots, not Phil Jackson. Phil couldn't coach a team full of scrubs and make them great. But a great team of players can be coached by a so-so coach and be very, very good *cough* Heat *cough*. There is not a single professional sport where the coach is more important, or even of equal importance, than the players. Imo, the Magic have a MUCH better chance of winning with Dwight Howard and a new coach than with SVG, and the current roster minus Dwight Howard.

And for the record, the only team on my list without a Hall of Fame player still had a lot of good players. Let's not act like they're a bunch of scrubs over there. Billups, Hamilton, the Wallaces, and even Prince proved to be a very good offensive player once he got him opportunity. They sent 4 guys to the All-Star game one year, didn't they?

[Sam Marlowe]

Re: The Dwight Howard Thread

I dont think anyone is arguing in favor of coaches being more important than players. The point thats being made (which is true) is that no amount of quality talent is going to assure a title without a damn good coaching staff. They are co-depndent.