The worst pick up players.

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  • wwharton
    *ll St*r
    • Aug 2002
    • 26949

    #946
    Re: The worst pick up players.

    Originally posted by ojandpizza
    Excessive whining about fouls really gets under my skin at times as well.

    It's not so much a problem where I play now, but used to we always played offense calls fouls. And I would pretty much only call a foul if they knocked me down, or a slap to the arm was so loud you could hear it. Most of the reason was because I felt like I could score through the foul, "And 1" didn't count, so if you called a foul and made the shot the basket didn't count.

    It just angered me to see players calling fouls on the slightest contact. If you ripped them but grazed their hand, or fouls on jump shots if you barely touched their follow through, or guys that go into the lane twisting and maneuvering themselves any way possible to avoid contact only to throw the ball a foot over the rim and then call a foul. When I would leave with bruises and scratches having not called anything.

    Even during offense calls fouls ruling if I fouled someone and knew I fouled them but maybe they didn't call it because they got a decent shot off, I would give the ball back. And I wasn't the only honest one that played, but there was just too much of the bulk of players who regulated this gym that didn't want to play by common basketball rules.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I'll play a bit of devil's advocate... I hate when a team decides they're going to foul EVERY SINGLE TIME the ball goes in the paint. Drive, pass to a post man, rebound... if you're on offense, have the ball and are in the paint you get hacked.

    Either the offense starts calling everything (then fouling team starts to complain about all the calls) or they call nothing, making it a whole lot harder to score and fouling team eventually wins. It's such a sleezy, lazy way to play. I'm definitely too old to deal with that crap. If I see guys I know play like that I'll just leave the gym and do something else productive.

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    • ojandpizza
      Hall Of Fame
      • Apr 2011
      • 29807

      #947
      The worst pick up players.

      I actually played a couple months ago and we had a big lead, just half court games to 24 by 2's&3's win by 4 points. Like I said we had a big lead and it was defense calls fouls. It got to the point where they were fouling us to keep us from scoring. Which normally doesn't bother me too bad, you're about to lose so if your man beats you foul to avoid an unguarded lay up or something. But this was different, my man started wrapping me up any time I touched the ball, forcing us to check up. Two foot behind the 3point line, wrap me up and call foul.. Now that **** was annoying.

      I also hate when teams start fouling to avoid losing and if you beat them off the dribble they might barely graze your arm or grab your shirt and call foul.. But before they were about to lose it would take a lot more contact than that for them to fess up to the foul. Those games really annoy me.


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      Last edited by ojandpizza; 03-15-2016, 05:32 PM.

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      • jfsolo
        Live Action, please?
        • May 2003
        • 12965

        #948
        Re: The worst pick up players.

        Originally posted by ojandpizza
        I actually played a couple months ago and we had a big lead, just half court games to 24 by 2's&3's win by 4 points. Like I said we had a big lead and it was defense calls fouls. It got to the point where they were fouling us to keep us from scoring. Which normally doesn't bother me too bad, you're about to lose so if your man beats you foul to avoid an unguarded lay up or something. But this was different, my man started wrapping me up any time I touched the ball, forcing us to check up. Two foot behind the 3point line, wrap me up and call foul.. Now that **** was annoying.

        I also hate when teams start fouling to avoid losing and if you beat them off the dribble they might barely graze your arm or grab your shirt and call foul..
        But before they were about to lose it would take a lot more contact than that for them to fess up to the foul. Those games really annoy me.


        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
        I couldn't play at a place where this kind of stuff happened. It's pick up ball, play the game. I would just bounce.
        Jordan Mychal Lemos
        @crypticjordan

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        • P-Dub
          Pro
          • Jun 2007
          • 596

          #949
          Re: The worst pick up players.

          Originally posted by ojandpizza
          ...But this was different, my man started wrapping me up any time I touched the ball, forcing us to check up. Two foot behind the 3point line, wrap me up and call foul.. Now that **** was annoying.
          Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
          I hate to sound like I would be escalating a situation, but when he starts wrapping you up multiple times, that's when you protect the ball by any means. He's cheesing so don't call the foul, just let him stop playing defense because he's expecting the call, then do your best to finish the play with the short time that he took himself out of the play.

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          • Chairman7w
            MVP
            • Mar 2006
            • 1490

            #950
            Re: The worst pick up players.

            F&^%$k that man. That's a bunch of bull. That would grind my gears big time.

            Originally posted by ojandpizza
            I actually played a couple months ago and we had a big lead, just half court games to 24 by 2's&3's win by 4 points. Like I said we had a big lead and it was defense calls fouls. It got to the point where they were fouling us to keep us from scoring. Which normally doesn't bother me too bad, you're about to lose so if your man beats you foul to avoid an unguarded lay up or something. But this was different, my man started wrapping me up any time I touched the ball, forcing us to check up. Two foot behind the 3point line, wrap me up and call foul.. Now that **** was annoying.

            I also hate when teams start fouling to avoid losing and if you beat them off the dribble they might barely graze your arm or grab your shirt and call foul.. But before they were about to lose it would take a lot more contact than that for them to fess up to the foul. Those games really annoy me.


            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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            • ojandpizza
              Hall Of Fame
              • Apr 2011
              • 29807

              #951
              Re: The worst pick up players.

              Originally posted by P-Dub
              I hate to sound like I would be escalating a situation, but when he starts wrapping you up multiple times, that's when you protect the ball by any means. He's cheesing so don't call the foul, just let him stop playing defense because he's expecting the call, then do your best to finish the play with the short time that he took himself out of the play.

              Well it was defense calls fouls, so there wasn't much I could do about it. Even trying to dribble away from him he would grab arm, shirt, something "foul".


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              • ojandpizza
                Hall Of Fame
                • Apr 2011
                • 29807

                #952
                Re: The worst pick up players.

                Originally posted by jfsolo
                I couldn't play at a place where this kind of stuff happened. It's pick up ball, play the game. I would just bounce.

                It's pretty much the only place I play at now. But that was a one time occurrence from a guy who rarely shows there anyways. So sometimes it's great ball, but that night it was horrible.


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                • ggsimmonds
                  Hall Of Fame
                  • Jan 2009
                  • 11235

                  #953
                  Re: The worst pick up players.

                  On the issue of calling fouls, if you hit my elbow on a jump shot I'm calling it. Everytime.

                  But on layups you damn near had to physically assault me for me to call it.

                  Sometimes I enjoyed clowning around though. When we ran we ran for hours. It was never super competitive at the start so we were all laid back the first game (it was pretty much just a warmup game). There were times I would bring a whistle with me and keep it on a rope under my shirt. In the middle of the game when no one was paying attention I would blow it and call something like offensive 3 seconds in the key.
                  Spoiler


                  I miss those days because you could show up at the court 11:00 AM and run 3v3 (5v5 starting about 2) and there would be a steady rotation of new guys to keep it going until 8ish. More than once I played for 6 straight hours (maybe a 2 or 3 game rest). Man the next day I ached so bad I honestly could not bend down to tie my shoe lol

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                  • KG
                    Welcome Back
                    • Sep 2005
                    • 17583

                    #954
                    Re: The worst pick up players.

                    Originally posted by ojandpizza
                    Well it was defense calls fouls, so there wasn't much I could do about it. Even trying to dribble away from him he would grab arm, shirt, something "foul".


                    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                    Defense calls fouls?

                    Wow, never heard of that. It's always call your own foul unless you know you fouled someone and call it for them.
                    Twitter Instagram - kgx2thez

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                    • VDusen04
                      Hall Of Fame
                      • Aug 2003
                      • 13033

                      #955
                      Re: The worst pick up players.

                      Originally posted by KG
                      Defense calls fouls?

                      Wow, never heard of that. It's always call your own foul unless you know you fouled someone and call it for them.
                      I've played both ways. I think what it comes down to—whether it's call your own fouls, or defense calls, or anything in-between—is integrity and honesty.

                      If you've got a good group of people, it's not going to matter what the foul system is. And actually, if there's a bad seed among you, it's still not going to matter what the foul system is. The guy who calls too many fouls when it's "offense calls" is most often the same guy who'd foul the crap out of you then not call it on himself when it's "defense calls".

                      Same goes for the "And-1 or no And-1" debate. I'm still not sure I've ever heard a good enough reason for not counting And-1's in a pick-up game. If a dude drives, gets destroyed, calls a foul while in mid-shot (the moment the foul occurs) and still makes the bucket, he should be rewarded for scoring while being fouled.

                      If there's a chode who wants to take advantage of the And-1 system by just calling a foul on every single play (meaning either he'll score the bucket and play-on or the ball's going to be checked up) then he's most often the same guy who's going to abuse the "No And-1" system by just waiting to see if his shot goes in before he decides whether to call a foul.

                      Either way, the solution isn't changing the game, in my opinion, because there's no cure-all when it comes to a guy wanting to game the system. The solution is to deal with the guy gaming the system.

                      Speaking of And-1's, I'm sure I've said this, but I still don't understand the regions who insist that in order for an And-1 to count, a player must literally say "And-1" during his shot instead of just "Foul", "Got one", or any other universally accepted means of saying they were illegally hit. Then, to add to the madness, I've seen some rare cases where calling "And-1" then missing the shot after the foul means no foul occurred at all, and play just carries on (basically turning it into a guessing game when a player's fouled, in terms of them having to choose between saying "foul" and nullifying a possible basket or "And-1" and possibly nullifying a foul).

                      I'm guessing it's just another means of trying to stop people from over-calling fouls but again, the dudes who abuse the system will just morph and make late calls then. I find it incredibly silly, unless you're always playing with the worst people ever, to try to remove the reward for people scoring while being fouled if they happen to acknowledge the foul in the process. If I get fouled hard, I'm going to call it before I know whether I'm going to be able to make the shot. To turn it into a game of chance or guess-the-right-phrase is ridiculous to me.
                      Last edited by VDusen04; 03-16-2016, 09:37 AM.

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                      • Hassan Darkside
                        We Here
                        • Sep 2003
                        • 7561

                        #956
                        Re: The worst pick up players.

                        Originally posted by VDusen04
                        I've played both ways. I think what it comes down to—whether it's call your own fouls, or defense calls, or anything in-between—is integrity and honesty.

                        If you've got a good group of people, it's not going to matter what the foul system is. And actually, if there's a bad seed among you, it's still not going to matter what the foul system is. The guy who calls too many fouls when it's "offense calls" is most often the same guy who'd foul the crap out of you then not call it on himself when it's "defense calls".
                        We play offense calls but to your point, it comes down to integrity and honesty. If I hack a guy on D, even if it is offense calls, I'll call a foul. Most people I play with do that as well. Conversely, I rarely call fouls on offense and defense will sometimes make the call to bail me out.
                        Same goes for the "And-1 or no And-1" debate. I'm still not sure I've ever heard a good enough reason for not counting And-1's in a pick-up game. If a dude drives, gets destroyed, calls a foul while in mid-shot (the moment the foul occurs) and still makes the bucket, he should be rewarded for scoring while being fouled.

                        If there's a chode who wants to take advantage of the And-1 system by just calling a foul on every single play (meaning either he'll score the bucket and play-on or the ball's going to be checked up) then he's most often the same guy who's going to abuse the "No And-1" system by just waiting to see if his shot goes in before he decides whether to call a foul.

                        Either way, the solution isn't changing the game, in my opinion, because there's no cure-all when it comes to a guy wanting to game the system. The solution is to deal with the guy gaming the system.

                        Speaking of And-1's, I'm sure I've said this, but I still don't understand the regions who insist that in order for an And-1 to count, a player must literally say "And-1" during his shot instead of just "Foul", "Got one", or any other universally accepted means of saying they were illegally hit. Then, to add to the madness, I've seen some rare cases where calling "And-1" then missing the shot after the foul means no foul occurred at all, and play just carries on (basically turning it into a guessing game when a player's fouled, in terms of them having to choose between saying "foul" and nullifying a possible basket or "And-1" and possibly nullifying a foul).

                        I'm guessing it's just another means of trying to stop people from over-calling fouls but again, the dudes who abuse the system will just morph and make late calls then. I find it incredibly silly, unless you're always playing with the worst people ever, to try to remove the reward for people scoring while being fouled if they happen to acknowledge the foul in the process. If I get fouled hard, I'm going to call it before I know whether I'm going to be able to make the shot. To turn it into a game of chance or guess-the-right-phrase is ridiculous to me.
                        This is exactly how we play here and it didn't make sense to me since And-1 had always been synonymous with a foul call when I played pickup before. Just another case of different court, different rules. Calling And1 means nothing here, even if you get hit. It's a play on. If you do call foul or ball and make the shot while getting hit, the shot doesn't count and you get ball at the top of the key.

                        The worst thing is the debates about foul calls. I've been in games where the teams spent more time arguing over calls than actually playing. If it's offense calls fouls, you have to respect the call. Period. The only thing I've seen is that sometimes the arguments will go on long enough that there's eventually a "shoot for it" compromise, which is also dumb.
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                        • ojandpizza
                          Hall Of Fame
                          • Apr 2011
                          • 29807

                          #957
                          Re: The worst pick up players.

                          Yeah where I used to play and it was call your own fouls you didn't get points if you scored on a play where you called foul. Occasionally you might have the defender say go ahead and count the basket, or you miss a shot and the defender call foul for you, but those were more of a rarity than the norm.

                          Here with defense calling fouls if they foul you on a shot you get to count the basket if you score. Not many people here will ever foul and not call it. I guess when you play with the same people over and over its easy to have good clean games without issues on how fouls are called.


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                          • ojandpizza
                            Hall Of Fame
                            • Apr 2011
                            • 29807

                            #958
                            Re: The worst pick up players.

                            How do you guys feel about who has next game when you are playing?

                            At the gym I'm at now if there are 4 guys sitting out during the game those 4 guys all get to play next game.

                            At the gym I used to play at rather than those guys all being on the same team they would call the next game after each other. A few of them might play together but most of the time they would pick up off the losing team if they had good players. Or say "I already got 5" even if they didn't when someone else sitting out asked to run with them.

                            The result was you would have the game going on and the maybe 8 guys in line for games after that, when really 5 of them could have played the next game and the other 3 the one after.. This always meant that if you lost you might be sitting out for an hour, sometimes even longer, unless of course you were good enough that one of the teams in line wanted to pick you up.




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                            • VDusen04
                              Hall Of Fame
                              • Aug 2003
                              • 13033

                              #959
                              Re: The worst pick up players.

                              Originally posted by ojandpizza
                              How do you guys feel about who has next game when you are playing?

                              At the gym I'm at now if there are 4 guys sitting out during the game those 4 guys all get to play next game.

                              At the gym I used to play at rather than those guys all being on the same team they would call the next game after each other. A few of them might play together but most of the time they would pick up off the losing team if they had good players. Or say "I already got 5" even if they didn't when someone else sitting out asked to run with them.

                              The result was you would have the game going on and the maybe 8 guys in line for games after that, when really 5 of them could have played the next game and the other 3 the one after.. This always meant that if you lost you might be sitting out for an hour, sometimes even longer, unless of course you were good enough that one of the teams in line wanted to pick you up.
                              Most frequently, the courts I've played at have kept it simple. If there's four sitting, they're in for the next game (winners stay). If there's more than five sitting, they shoot for the chance to play (first five to hit out of that group plays). Anyone out of that group that doesn't hit is then automatically in the next game.

                              Generally speaking, the courts I've played at have been equal opportunity situations. If a dude showed up to play ball, he's got a right to play ball in an orderly fashion without having to find a clique that will accept him as being part of their five.

                              On rare occasions, if the incoming group is obviously going to get rocked by the winning team, we'll switch some players around for the sake of competition. But most times, even if there's a talent disparity, incoming squads usually have their opportunity for success.

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                              • ggsimmonds
                                Hall Of Fame
                                • Jan 2009
                                • 11235

                                #960
                                Re: The worst pick up players.

                                If there were guys sitting waiting on next game they had next if they wanted it. Many times though they would rather wait on the rest of their crew to show up before getting game.

                                That is fine, but we never waited. We've had dudes say his buddy will be here in 5 minutes so hold on, we said nope, next in line is up now.

                                Then we had some elitists who didn't want to play with dude if he didn't think the talent was there. That is wrong. If the man has been waiting for his run then it is his if he wants it. On the other hand, if you ain't up to snuff it may not be a pleasant game for you. We didn't treat anyone with kid gloves on some days. But we tried to never force the issue. If there were 5 guys in line but 4 of them didn't want the 5th and it seemed like it could be an issue, usually one from the winning team would go ahead and take a breather game and the 5th would join the winning squad. Maybe that is noble, but it added to the trash talk and that was great.

                                On calling fouls where I played, it was almost always offense calls. When there was disagreement and it slowed the game down, the 2 guys would check up and go 1v1. The offensive guy had one chance to get a bucket, and we were serious about the time. None of this dribbling display behind the line, make your move and try to score. We had the pathological foul callers, but this usually exposed them. You can't call phantom fouls when everyone's eyes are on you and watching for fouls.

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