Michael Jordan - The Legend

**Leon** · 06-11-2004, 12:31 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
HMcCoy said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Air23 said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
poster said:
Great post McCoy, I often wonder why no one gives Wilt props like Babe Ruth gets props. And Jordan was amazing no doubt, but Kobe has done more at his age than Jordan. If Kobe played in the mid 80's with no defense he would easily have shot over 50% without a doubt. Defense didnt come into play until the bad boys, and then phil taught the bulls defense to win. Both are great but by the time he's done Kobe could have a career as eventful no matter what people think.

<hr /></blockquote>

You do realise that 1) Kobe has had Shaq on his team, and 2) defenses in the 80's were WAY better than they are today and players were were WAY more skilled and just as athletic as they are today, right?

I like Kobe (he's one of my favorite players today), but answer this: put Kobe on MJ's Bulls teams with the same opposition MJ faced (way more better teams than today and that is a fact)--do you think Kobe's team would be as successful as MJ's?

<hr /></blockquote>

80's defense sucked. Flat the F out. Most teams were still perimeter oriented with non-athletic but very skilled shooters. Team ball movement was emphasized, and Jerry West himself said that in his day coaches rarely doubled, everyone was responsible for his own man. Well in comes MJ, a guy who represented the new standard in athleticism.

Single coverage?

Craig Ehlo defending him?

Grimy ball (Riley Knick-style that is league norm, now) not invented yet?

MJ was a kid in a candy store. LeBron at 18 is a physical freak with quicks and an F'n 44 inch vertical! Imagine him in that era.

....

.....

Do you think that every body in the league was just that much better scoring the ball, dum dums?. Even the Bad Boys gave up 100+.

When Pat took over the Knicks, he realized defense was the key for THAT teams success, they didn't have the open-floor guys he had in L.A. He realized that if we grind, grab, push, smother, we can win. But damn, that takes alot of energy don't it? So on offense we SLOOOOOOOOW the rock, and run the offense through the post. Hello new NBA. Riley begat at least 15 current head coaches that subscribe to that philosophy. Larry Brown, Van Gundy, Carlisle, etc...nobody outside of N.J runs like the 80's. MJ pundits don't wanna' touch that.

<hr /></blockquote>

So what if they gave up 100+? The lesson there is POINT DIFFERENTIAL. The '88-'89 Pistons scored 106.6 and gave up 100.8, a margin of 6 points. Here's another 80's team with good defense, the '85-'86 Celtics. They scored 114.1 and gave up 104.7, a margin of 9 points. Here's another, the '82-'83 Sixers. They scored 112.1 and gave up 104.4, a margin of 8 points. The last one, the '86-'87 Lakers. They scored 117.8 and gave up 108.5, a margin of 9 points. So clearly, 80's defense didn't suck.

Also, let's not get started on Lebron being all dominant if he was in that era.

**Dynasty4Kobe** · 06-11-2004, 12:33 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Sarah said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
studman said:
and exactly how many of those 40 pt games did the Lakers win?

the Lakers could be a lot better if Kobe wouldn't force so much, look at the game tonight. he could've just settled down, rebounded, played D, got others involved. that would've freed him up, but NO. Kobe has to pout and Jackson as to take him out the game. c'mon.

these Kobe to MJ comparisons need to stop, cuz every game Kobe's play shows why he isn't in MJ's class. He's too selfish and not nearly as smart as Jordan was on the court.

and yes, today's defenses are so great that a 40 yr old Jordan can still avg 20+ a game.... Great D on a 40 yr. old. Kobe will be droppin' 20ppg at 40 too, right???

<hr /></blockquote>

Kobe couldn't be effective during the game because he didn't have the ball. He was the only one showing any kind of intensity on defense. He had Lindsey Hunter guarding him, now tell me, would Hunter be able to guard Kobe Bryant. And during that stretch where Kobe didn't get the ball, how well did the Lakers do?

<hr /></blockquote>

Oh man, is Kobe really that big that you did not see Shaq also has the same problem? It's Shaq's team you know. He is the captain.

<hr /></blockquote>

I know, Shaq's the captain of the boat and the offense runs through him. He got the ball during that stretch and the couldn't convert because of the interior defense. When Shaq can't make it go, then Kobe has to take over, and the fact that he didn't get the ball hurt the Lakers. I know Shaq is dominant and is great and all that good stuff, but Shaq gets no rings without Kobe.

Kobe needs Shaq, Shaq needs Kobe.

**Dynasty4Kobe** · 06-11-2004, 12:33 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Sarah said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
studman said:
and exactly how many of those 40 pt games did the Lakers win?

the Lakers could be a lot better if Kobe wouldn't force so much, look at the game tonight. he could've just settled down, rebounded, played D, got others involved. that would've freed him up, but NO. Kobe has to pout and Jackson as to take him out the game. c'mon.

these Kobe to MJ comparisons need to stop, cuz every game Kobe's play shows why he isn't in MJ's class. He's too selfish and not nearly as smart as Jordan was on the court.

and yes, today's defenses are so great that a 40 yr old Jordan can still avg 20+ a game.... Great D on a 40 yr. old. Kobe will be droppin' 20ppg at 40 too, right???

<hr /></blockquote>

Kobe couldn't be effective during the game because he didn't have the ball. He was the only one showing any kind of intensity on defense. He had Lindsey Hunter guarding him, now tell me, would Hunter be able to guard Kobe Bryant. And during that stretch where Kobe didn't get the ball, how well did the Lakers do?

<hr /></blockquote>

Oh man, is Kobe really that big that you did not see Shaq also has the same problem? It's Shaq's team you know. He is the captain.

<hr /></blockquote>

I know, Shaq's the captain of the boat and the offense runs through him. He got the ball during that stretch and the couldn't convert because of the interior defense. When Shaq can't make it go, then Kobe has to take over, and the fact that he didn't get the ball hurt the Lakers. I know Shaq is dominant and is great and all that good stuff, but Shaq gets no rings without Kobe.

Kobe needs Shaq, Shaq needs Kobe.

**Dynasty4Kobe** · 06-11-2004, 12:33 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Sarah said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
studman said:
and exactly how many of those 40 pt games did the Lakers win?

the Lakers could be a lot better if Kobe wouldn't force so much, look at the game tonight. he could've just settled down, rebounded, played D, got others involved. that would've freed him up, but NO. Kobe has to pout and Jackson as to take him out the game. c'mon.

these Kobe to MJ comparisons need to stop, cuz every game Kobe's play shows why he isn't in MJ's class. He's too selfish and not nearly as smart as Jordan was on the court.

and yes, today's defenses are so great that a 40 yr old Jordan can still avg 20+ a game.... Great D on a 40 yr. old. Kobe will be droppin' 20ppg at 40 too, right???

<hr /></blockquote>

Kobe couldn't be effective during the game because he didn't have the ball. He was the only one showing any kind of intensity on defense. He had Lindsey Hunter guarding him, now tell me, would Hunter be able to guard Kobe Bryant. And during that stretch where Kobe didn't get the ball, how well did the Lakers do?

<hr /></blockquote>

Oh man, is Kobe really that big that you did not see Shaq also has the same problem? It's Shaq's team you know. He is the captain.

<hr /></blockquote>

I know, Shaq's the captain of the boat and the offense runs through him. He got the ball during that stretch and the couldn't convert because of the interior defense. When Shaq can't make it go, then Kobe has to take over, and the fact that he didn't get the ball hurt the Lakers. I know Shaq is dominant and is great and all that good stuff, but Shaq gets no rings without Kobe.

Kobe needs Shaq, Shaq needs Kobe.

**immortal** · 06-11-2004, 12:45 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

I think the smartest post I have read in this topic was from Sarah. WHat made MJ so good was his ability to make his teammates better. When MJ was having a poor offensive night, he got his teammates involved. Kobe cries as he did tonight. And when was the last time MJ had 1 point in a half in a Finals game?
And to all of you people pointing out this 40 pt. game string that Kobe put together, I have a few arguments about it:
1. The Lakers ran EVERY SINGLE F'IN SHOT AROUND KOBE IN ORDER FOR HIM TO TIE THE RECORD, AND HE STILL HAD A HARD TIME DOING IT! Jordan did NOT play for 40 points. He just DID it!!!!!! It wasn't planned as it was with Kobe. Jordan did it in the middle of regular games, not games designed for his to score.
2. What was the Lakers record during Kobe's wonderful string?
3. WHat was Kobe's shooting percentage during his wonderful string?

This is ridiculous! And Greg Anthony GETS PAID BY THE NBA TO MAKE MJ COMPARISONS, PEOPLE! The NBA WANTS a MJ II. The NBA NEEDS an MJ II! And they are willing to do anything do get it. Anyone with a brain would see this. The NBA tells their analysts to compare everyone to MJ so it will continue to tweak people's interests. Saying Kobe is a better scorer than Jordan at the age of 25 is ABSURD! Just check the numbers. Kobe's highest ppg average for a season is 30.0. Jordan's was 37.1! Kobe's highest fg %? 46.8%. Jordan's? 53.8%!!!

And for all of you people saying that today's defense is so wonderful, if it was so great, HOW THE HELL DID A 40-YEAR OLD MJ average 20 ppg against them? And didn't the Wizards defeat the Lakers during the regular season that year, with Jordan, being guarded by Kobe, scoring 27 points? WHY IS A 40-YEAR OLD SCORING 27 POINTS AGAINST A 22-YEAR OLD??? If Jordan was in his prime right now, he would average just as high as he did back in the 80's.

And Luc, you know absolutely nothing about basketball so stop arguing please. Your defenses for your points are WEAK!

Oh, and just to mention, Kobe was stellar tonight. Scoring 11 points in an NBA Finals game! Fantastic! Truly someone who should be compared to the greatest player to ever lace up a pair of sneakers. I just wish the NBA analysts would stop trying to compare people to MJ. Let them play their own games and be themselves. No one will ever be what MJ was!

**immortal** · 06-11-2004, 12:45 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

I think the smartest post I have read in this topic was from Sarah. WHat made MJ so good was his ability to make his teammates better. When MJ was having a poor offensive night, he got his teammates involved. Kobe cries as he did tonight. And when was the last time MJ had 1 point in a half in a Finals game?
And to all of you people pointing out this 40 pt. game string that Kobe put together, I have a few arguments about it:
1. The Lakers ran EVERY SINGLE F'IN SHOT AROUND KOBE IN ORDER FOR HIM TO TIE THE RECORD, AND HE STILL HAD A HARD TIME DOING IT! Jordan did NOT play for 40 points. He just DID it!!!!!! It wasn't planned as it was with Kobe. Jordan did it in the middle of regular games, not games designed for his to score.
2. What was the Lakers record during Kobe's wonderful string?
3. WHat was Kobe's shooting percentage during his wonderful string?

This is ridiculous! And Greg Anthony GETS PAID BY THE NBA TO MAKE MJ COMPARISONS, PEOPLE! The NBA WANTS a MJ II. The NBA NEEDS an MJ II! And they are willing to do anything do get it. Anyone with a brain would see this. The NBA tells their analysts to compare everyone to MJ so it will continue to tweak people's interests. Saying Kobe is a better scorer than Jordan at the age of 25 is ABSURD! Just check the numbers. Kobe's highest ppg average for a season is 30.0. Jordan's was 37.1! Kobe's highest fg %? 46.8%. Jordan's? 53.8%!!!

And for all of you people saying that today's defense is so wonderful, if it was so great, HOW THE HELL DID A 40-YEAR OLD MJ average 20 ppg against them? And didn't the Wizards defeat the Lakers during the regular season that year, with Jordan, being guarded by Kobe, scoring 27 points? WHY IS A 40-YEAR OLD SCORING 27 POINTS AGAINST A 22-YEAR OLD??? If Jordan was in his prime right now, he would average just as high as he did back in the 80's.

And Luc, you know absolutely nothing about basketball so stop arguing please. Your defenses for your points are WEAK!

Oh, and just to mention, Kobe was stellar tonight. Scoring 11 points in an NBA Finals game! Fantastic! Truly someone who should be compared to the greatest player to ever lace up a pair of sneakers. I just wish the NBA analysts would stop trying to compare people to MJ. Let them play their own games and be themselves. No one will ever be what MJ was!

**immortal** · 06-11-2004, 12:45 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

I think the smartest post I have read in this topic was from Sarah. WHat made MJ so good was his ability to make his teammates better. When MJ was having a poor offensive night, he got his teammates involved. Kobe cries as he did tonight. And when was the last time MJ had 1 point in a half in a Finals game?
And to all of you people pointing out this 40 pt. game string that Kobe put together, I have a few arguments about it:
1. The Lakers ran EVERY SINGLE F'IN SHOT AROUND KOBE IN ORDER FOR HIM TO TIE THE RECORD, AND HE STILL HAD A HARD TIME DOING IT! Jordan did NOT play for 40 points. He just DID it!!!!!! It wasn't planned as it was with Kobe. Jordan did it in the middle of regular games, not games designed for his to score.
2. What was the Lakers record during Kobe's wonderful string?
3. WHat was Kobe's shooting percentage during his wonderful string?

This is ridiculous! And Greg Anthony GETS PAID BY THE NBA TO MAKE MJ COMPARISONS, PEOPLE! The NBA WANTS a MJ II. The NBA NEEDS an MJ II! And they are willing to do anything do get it. Anyone with a brain would see this. The NBA tells their analysts to compare everyone to MJ so it will continue to tweak people's interests. Saying Kobe is a better scorer than Jordan at the age of 25 is ABSURD! Just check the numbers. Kobe's highest ppg average for a season is 30.0. Jordan's was 37.1! Kobe's highest fg %? 46.8%. Jordan's? 53.8%!!!

And for all of you people saying that today's defense is so wonderful, if it was so great, HOW THE HELL DID A 40-YEAR OLD MJ average 20 ppg against them? And didn't the Wizards defeat the Lakers during the regular season that year, with Jordan, being guarded by Kobe, scoring 27 points? WHY IS A 40-YEAR OLD SCORING 27 POINTS AGAINST A 22-YEAR OLD??? If Jordan was in his prime right now, he would average just as high as he did back in the 80's.

And Luc, you know absolutely nothing about basketball so stop arguing please. Your defenses for your points are WEAK!

Oh, and just to mention, Kobe was stellar tonight. Scoring 11 points in an NBA Finals game! Fantastic! Truly someone who should be compared to the greatest player to ever lace up a pair of sneakers. I just wish the NBA analysts would stop trying to compare people to MJ. Let them play their own games and be themselves. No one will ever be what MJ was!

23 · 06-11-2004, 12:49 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
I just wish the NBA analysts would stop trying to compare people to MJ. Let them play their own games and be themselves.

<hr /></blockquote>

Exactly

23 · 06-11-2004, 12:49 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
I just wish the NBA analysts would stop trying to compare people to MJ. Let them play their own games and be themselves.

<hr /></blockquote>

Exactly

23 · 06-11-2004, 12:49 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
I just wish the NBA analysts would stop trying to compare people to MJ. Let them play their own games and be themselves.

<hr /></blockquote>

Exactly

**Sarah** · 06-11-2004, 12:59 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Sarah said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
studman said:
and exactly how many of those 40 pt games did the Lakers win?

the Lakers could be a lot better if Kobe wouldn't force so much, look at the game tonight. he could've just settled down, rebounded, played D, got others involved. that would've freed him up, but NO. Kobe has to pout and Jackson as to take him out the game. c'mon.

these Kobe to MJ comparisons need to stop, cuz every game Kobe's play shows why he isn't in MJ's class. He's too selfish and not nearly as smart as Jordan was on the court.

and yes, today's defenses are so great that a 40 yr old Jordan can still avg 20+ a game.... Great D on a 40 yr. old. Kobe will be droppin' 20ppg at 40 too, right???

<hr /></blockquote>

Kobe couldn't be effective during the game because he didn't have the ball. He was the only one showing any kind of intensity on defense. He had Lindsey Hunter guarding him, now tell me, would Hunter be able to guard Kobe Bryant. And during that stretch where Kobe didn't get the ball, how well did the Lakers do?

<hr /></blockquote>

Oh man, is Kobe really that big that you did not see Shaq also has the same problem? It's Shaq's team you know. He is the captain.

<hr /></blockquote>

I know, Shaq's the captain of the boat and the offense runs through him. He got the ball during that stretch and the couldn't convert because of the interior defense. When Shaq can't make it go, then Kobe has to take over, and the fact that he didn't get the ball hurt the Lakers. I know Shaq is dominant and is great and all that good stuff, but Shaq gets no rings without Kobe.

Kobe needs Shaq, Shaq needs Kobe.

<hr /></blockquote>

Not exactly as a good PG like Jason Kidd for example can also be a very good compliment for Shaq. All I could say it's about time somebody throw some responsibility on those other Laker players who are just sitting there waiting for the eggs to hatch. Maybe it was also part of Phil Jackson's play to deprive Kobe the ball since it doesn't seem like he agree on Kobe's demand. In fact he bench him instead. I have a feeling that he wants Kobe to be more of a playmaker so it will be easier for Shaq and the rest of the Lakers to score. And eleiminate the 2 man game. For the most part once you pass the ball to Kobe you ain't getting it back.

**Sarah** · 06-11-2004, 12:59 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Sarah said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
studman said:
and exactly how many of those 40 pt games did the Lakers win?

the Lakers could be a lot better if Kobe wouldn't force so much, look at the game tonight. he could've just settled down, rebounded, played D, got others involved. that would've freed him up, but NO. Kobe has to pout and Jackson as to take him out the game. c'mon.

these Kobe to MJ comparisons need to stop, cuz every game Kobe's play shows why he isn't in MJ's class. He's too selfish and not nearly as smart as Jordan was on the court.

and yes, today's defenses are so great that a 40 yr old Jordan can still avg 20+ a game.... Great D on a 40 yr. old. Kobe will be droppin' 20ppg at 40 too, right???

<hr /></blockquote>

Kobe couldn't be effective during the game because he didn't have the ball. He was the only one showing any kind of intensity on defense. He had Lindsey Hunter guarding him, now tell me, would Hunter be able to guard Kobe Bryant. And during that stretch where Kobe didn't get the ball, how well did the Lakers do?

<hr /></blockquote>

Oh man, is Kobe really that big that you did not see Shaq also has the same problem? It's Shaq's team you know. He is the captain.

<hr /></blockquote>

I know, Shaq's the captain of the boat and the offense runs through him. He got the ball during that stretch and the couldn't convert because of the interior defense. When Shaq can't make it go, then Kobe has to take over, and the fact that he didn't get the ball hurt the Lakers. I know Shaq is dominant and is great and all that good stuff, but Shaq gets no rings without Kobe.

Kobe needs Shaq, Shaq needs Kobe.

<hr /></blockquote>

Not exactly as a good PG like Jason Kidd for example can also be a very good compliment for Shaq. All I could say it's about time somebody throw some responsibility on those other Laker players who are just sitting there waiting for the eggs to hatch. Maybe it was also part of Phil Jackson's play to deprive Kobe the ball since it doesn't seem like he agree on Kobe's demand. In fact he bench him instead. I have a feeling that he wants Kobe to be more of a playmaker so it will be easier for Shaq and the rest of the Lakers to score. And eleiminate the 2 man game. For the most part once you pass the ball to Kobe you ain't getting it back.

**Sarah** · 06-11-2004, 12:59 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Sarah said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Dynasty4Kobe said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
studman said:
and exactly how many of those 40 pt games did the Lakers win?

the Lakers could be a lot better if Kobe wouldn't force so much, look at the game tonight. he could've just settled down, rebounded, played D, got others involved. that would've freed him up, but NO. Kobe has to pout and Jackson as to take him out the game. c'mon.

these Kobe to MJ comparisons need to stop, cuz every game Kobe's play shows why he isn't in MJ's class. He's too selfish and not nearly as smart as Jordan was on the court.

and yes, today's defenses are so great that a 40 yr old Jordan can still avg 20+ a game.... Great D on a 40 yr. old. Kobe will be droppin' 20ppg at 40 too, right???

<hr /></blockquote>

Kobe couldn't be effective during the game because he didn't have the ball. He was the only one showing any kind of intensity on defense. He had Lindsey Hunter guarding him, now tell me, would Hunter be able to guard Kobe Bryant. And during that stretch where Kobe didn't get the ball, how well did the Lakers do?

<hr /></blockquote>

Oh man, is Kobe really that big that you did not see Shaq also has the same problem? It's Shaq's team you know. He is the captain.

<hr /></blockquote>

I know, Shaq's the captain of the boat and the offense runs through him. He got the ball during that stretch and the couldn't convert because of the interior defense. When Shaq can't make it go, then Kobe has to take over, and the fact that he didn't get the ball hurt the Lakers. I know Shaq is dominant and is great and all that good stuff, but Shaq gets no rings without Kobe.

Kobe needs Shaq, Shaq needs Kobe.

<hr /></blockquote>

Not exactly as a good PG like Jason Kidd for example can also be a very good compliment for Shaq. All I could say it's about time somebody throw some responsibility on those other Laker players who are just sitting there waiting for the eggs to hatch. Maybe it was also part of Phil Jackson's play to deprive Kobe the ball since it doesn't seem like he agree on Kobe's demand. In fact he bench him instead. I have a feeling that he wants Kobe to be more of a playmaker so it will be easier for Shaq and the rest of the Lakers to score. And eleiminate the 2 man game. For the most part once you pass the ball to Kobe you ain't getting it back.

**MartinDihigo** · 06-11-2004, 01:00 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
HMcCoy said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Air23 said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
poster said:
Great post McCoy, I often wonder why no one gives Wilt props like Babe Ruth gets props. And Jordan was amazing no doubt, but Kobe has done more at his age than Jordan. If Kobe played in the mid 80's with no defense he would easily have shot over 50% without a doubt. Defense didnt come into play until the bad boys, and then phil taught the bulls defense to win. Both are great but by the time he's done Kobe could have a career as eventful no matter what people think.

<hr /></blockquote>

You do realise that 1) Kobe has had Shaq on his team, and 2) defenses in the 80's were WAY better than they are today and players were were WAY more skilled and just as athletic as they are today, right?

I like Kobe (he's one of my favorite players today), but answer this: put Kobe on MJ's Bulls teams with the same opposition MJ faced (way more better teams than today and that is a fact)--do you think Kobe's team would be as successful as MJ's?

<hr /></blockquote>

80's defense sucked. Flat the F out. Most teams were still perimeter oriented with non-athletic but very skilled shooters. Team ball movement was emphasized, and Jerry West himself said that in his day coaches rarely doubled, everyone was responsible for his own man. Well in comes MJ, a guy who represented the new standard in athleticism.

Single coverage?

Craig Ehlo defending him?

Grimy ball (Riley Knick-style that is league norm, now) not invented yet?

MJ was a kid in a candy store. LeBron at 18 is a physical freak with quicks and an F'n 44 inch vertical! Imagine him in that era.

....

.....

Do you think that every body in the league was just that much better scoring the ball, dum dums?. Even the Bad Boys gave up 100+.

When Pat took over the Knicks, he realized defense was the key for THAT teams success, they didn't have the open-floor guys he had in L.A. He realized that if we grind, grab, push, smother, we can win. But damn, that takes alot of energy don't it? So on offense we SLOOOOOOOOW the rock, and run the offense through the post. Hello new NBA. Riley begat at least 15 current head coaches that subscribe to that philosophy. Larry Brown, Van Gundy, Carlisle, etc...nobody outside of N.J runs like the 80's. MJ pundits don't wanna' touch that.

<hr /></blockquote>

MJ dominated throughout his career. Some say he was a smarter into the 1990s

**MartinDihigo** · 06-11-2004, 01:00 AM

Re: Michael Jordan - The Legend

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
HMcCoy said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Air23 said:
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
poster said:
Great post McCoy, I often wonder why no one gives Wilt props like Babe Ruth gets props. And Jordan was amazing no doubt, but Kobe has done more at his age than Jordan. If Kobe played in the mid 80's with no defense he would easily have shot over 50% without a doubt. Defense didnt come into play until the bad boys, and then phil taught the bulls defense to win. Both are great but by the time he's done Kobe could have a career as eventful no matter what people think.

<hr /></blockquote>

You do realise that 1) Kobe has had Shaq on his team, and 2) defenses in the 80's were WAY better than they are today and players were were WAY more skilled and just as athletic as they are today, right?

I like Kobe (he's one of my favorite players today), but answer this: put Kobe on MJ's Bulls teams with the same opposition MJ faced (way more better teams than today and that is a fact)--do you think Kobe's team would be as successful as MJ's?

<hr /></blockquote>

80's defense sucked. Flat the F out. Most teams were still perimeter oriented with non-athletic but very skilled shooters. Team ball movement was emphasized, and Jerry West himself said that in his day coaches rarely doubled, everyone was responsible for his own man. Well in comes MJ, a guy who represented the new standard in athleticism.

Single coverage?

Craig Ehlo defending him?

Grimy ball (Riley Knick-style that is league norm, now) not invented yet?

MJ was a kid in a candy store. LeBron at 18 is a physical freak with quicks and an F'n 44 inch vertical! Imagine him in that era.

....

.....

Do you think that every body in the league was just that much better scoring the ball, dum dums?. Even the Bad Boys gave up 100+.

When Pat took over the Knicks, he realized defense was the key for THAT teams success, they didn't have the open-floor guys he had in L.A. He realized that if we grind, grab, push, smother, we can win. But damn, that takes alot of energy don't it? So on offense we SLOOOOOOOOW the rock, and run the offense through the post. Hello new NBA. Riley begat at least 15 current head coaches that subscribe to that philosophy. Larry Brown, Van Gundy, Carlisle, etc...nobody outside of N.J runs like the 80's. MJ pundits don't wanna' touch that.

<hr /></blockquote>

MJ dominated throughout his career. Some say he was a smarter into the 1990s

Michael Jordan - The Legend

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