2017 Offseason Thread

[3304Life]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

How many times have y'all seen Curry snatch for steals, miss and give up a bucket? His lack of defense and bad decisions helped lose them the Finals in 2016, I can think of a few instances where his bad defending cost them.

I think Kyrie gets a bad rep. When he's locked in he's just as good a defender as Curry, he just only happens to lock in for 10 games a year, maximum. But Curry is not a good defender, he plays for a very good defensive team and is hidden, like Tony Parker for those really good defensive Spurs teams.


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[49UNCFan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

Just because the Warriors have better defenders than Steph doesn't make Steph a bad defender.

Stop it. Steph cant guard guards off the dribble that's his weakness.
Off ball hes decent on ball he cant guard guards with a handle thats why they put Klay on the PG

https://youtu.be/DZsEiNmODWw

[49UNCFan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

you do realize Kyrie is as bad as IT2 on defense?

No he's not I've watched him when it matters and he holds his on man to man. He's not a lockdown defender but he's not horrible.

[BleacherBum2310]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

I'm not saying Steph is Beverley/Avery/CP3 all wrapped into one he's sound and solid and can be picked on also but in regards to Kyrie it's not really close.

[ojandpizza]

2017 Offseason Thread

I don't really care which of the two is better defensively because it doesn't really matter to me which average to below average is better than the other. Neither have shown to be so bad that they are a liability and neither is so much better than the other that it even justifies an argument.

But the whole why does Kyrie guard Steph and Steph not guard Kyrie, I can't even believe that needs explaining. Klay is one of the best defenders in the league and always guards the other teams best guard whether it's a point guard or shooting guard. Cleveland would do the same thing if they had an elite defender at SG. Has nothing to do with Kyrie being better than Steph.


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[49UNCFan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

I'm not saying Steph is Beverley/Avery/CP3 all wrapped into one he's sound and solid and can be picked on also but in regards to Kyrie it's not really close.

Okay you all are just taking up for Steph. Steph guards the weakest link on offense while Kyrie guards usually the best guard but Steph is a better defender smh no he is hidden on a good defensive team

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[DieHardYankee26]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

Steph guards the weakest link on offense because the Warriors don't want what happens to Kyrie when he tries to guard the best player to happen to Steph.

[49UNCFan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

Steph guards the weakest link on offense because the Warriors don't want what happens to Kyrie when he tries to guard the best player to happen to Steph.

Thank you. So if Kyrie is bad and they will do the same to Steph that means Steph is bad also.

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[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

No he can't. That's just a way to hide Steph Currys defense. You don't see cp3, Westbrook, Lillard, or Wall guarding the SG do you?

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You certainly do with Lillard and CP3.

You see it with Wall but it depends on the matchups.

[3304Life]

2017 Offseason Thread

By the way, I just thought I'd look into this a little because I saw somebody talk about how stats show Curry to be a good defender. The stats show that he has an identical defensive rating with lower defensive win shares and a worse DBPM than James Harden, whose defense is panned year after year. I'm not using stats as part of my argument because I've seen with my own eyes Curry's defensive liabilities.

Using Harden is also a fairer example for certain stats, they were drafted the same year.

[49UNCFan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

You certainly do with Lillard and CP3.

You see it with Wall but it depends on the matchups.

Everybody does it to an extent to keep they're star rested but even Westbrook and other guards complain about curry not guarding them

[wwharton]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

Lol, The whole 'people dont know basketball' take would hit a lot harder had you not tried to tell us LeBron doesnt make his teams better 2 pages back...something else advanced stats support...unless those only apply to the players your a fan of...

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To defend King, he never said LeBron doesn't make his teams better, he said he's made a lot of people worse because of his style of play. It was discussed to death back when he was recruiting Mo Williams and his 20ppg and Jamison with his 20ppg along with other players.

I'd love to see the stats of whoever posted all the names of players who had "their best" shooting years with Lebron. Without looking I raise a serious eyebrow to Korver and Deron Williams, if not others... but that's not really the point. James has made A LOT of players better just by being on the floor. But this idea that he doesn't hurt some players games is just false, and I really agree with King's statement that people seem to be arguing against it because of the shock factor of criticizing anything James does well. The truth is having someone like Kyrie is one of the best things that could happen for LBJ. His strengths WELL outweigh his weaknesses, but Kyrie helps balance some of those weaknesses out. Yet he really gets zero credit. It's not that hard (for me) to believe he feels some kind of way about not getting credit he feels he deserves.

Steph is a good off ball defender, on ball he's not good. Steph never guards the best guard on the team whether Klay is in or not.

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Your logic is... horrible. There are a million reasons he may or may not be assigned to guard different players. If his role was to be a lock down defender you'd have a point, but the (side track) discussion is just about being a better defender than Kyrie... a pretty low bar.

Thank you. So if Kyrie is bad and they will do the same to Steph that means Steph is bad also.

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Um... nope. Seriously man, this isn't about caping for Curry. Though I believe he's a better defender than Irving, there are arguments to be made otherwise. Who they usually guard on random other teams is so far from one of them.

[wwharton]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

By the way, I just thought I'd look into this a little because I saw somebody talk about how stats show Curry to be a good defender. The stats show that he has an identical defensive rating with lower defensive win shares and a worse DBPM than James Harden, whose defense is panned year after year. I'm not using stats as part of my argument because I've seen with my own eyes Curry's defensive liabilities.

Using Harden is also a fairer example for certain stats, they were drafted the same year.

This is an example of a better argument...

... but if you're going to dig up stats for comparison why would you pick Harden instead of Kyrie?

Everybody does it to an extent to keep they're star rested but even Westbrook and other guards complain about curry not guarding them

You literally just said you don't see it with those players.

[49UNCFan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

Explain this https://youtu.be/DZsEiNmODWw

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[49UNCFan]

Re: 2017 Offseason Thread

I don't want any stats the eye test what really matters

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