EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

[Kingslayer04]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Chris Weidman
Chin — 88 to 87, possibly even 86. Now knocked out 5 times in his last 6, this time with pretty much the first shot that landed if I saw correctly.

Jeremy Stephens
Body Strength — 88 to 87. It's now both Aldo and Yair that hurt him to the body, the two fights were in pretty close succession as well. This is fairly indicative of Stephens' issues in either defending the body or its durability. In any case, that's a weaker spot in his game that needs to be reflected. Edit: then again, 88 is not that high to begin with so actually this may not need a change.

Oh, and I don't know if Heart is the right stat for it but Jeremy did extremely well in surviving after he got hurt.
Heart - 89 to 90 or 91.

[1212headkick]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Chris Weidman
Chin — 88 to 87, possibly even 86. Now knocked out 5 times in his last 6, this time with pretty much the first shot that landed if I saw correctly.

Jeremy Stephens
Body Strength — 88 to 87. It's now both Aldo and Yair that hurt him to the body, the two fights were in pretty close succession as well. This is fairly indicative of Stephens' issues in either defending the body or its durability. In any case, that's a weaker spot in his game that needs to be reflected. Edit: then again, 88 is not that high to begin with so actually this may not need a change.

Oh, and I don't know if Heart is the right stat for it but Jeremy did extremely well in surviving after he got hurt.
Heart - 89 to 90 or 91.

Heart 93 most wouldnt of got up

[Kingslayer04]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Heart 93 most wouldnt of got up

Well we have to say that Yair wasn't extremely effective with his GnP, it was predominantly very fast. But it also had a lot of volume and a good number of those landed. Hammerfists too, I think. Good on the ref for not stopping it. And yeah, Stephens definitely has a lot of heart, 89 seems low for him.

[Kingslayer04]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Damn, I didn't intend to have that many double and triple posts....

Anyway: it should be a nightmare to play as Ben Askren in the next game. I hadn't seen more than 1 or 2 fights of his prior to him coming to the UFC because I felt it wouldn't tell me much because of the (potential) difference in quality. I watched whatever little I did to actually see him work and what he's about.

I do like Askren, I find him to be genuine, intelligent and a fun personality and I was excited to see this renowned grappler come to the UFC. Well, an accomplished grappler he is but he's a terrible MMA fighter and it's pretty much been proven that he'd been fighting bums. Very poor striking, which includes poor striking cardio, lack of athleticism, gassed (as did Maia) and got submitted by a proven elite MMA grappler in Maia... you've seen the fights, you don't need me to tell you.

So yeah, unless you manage to take things to the ground with him it should be hell playing as Askren, and doing that mustn't be a walk in the park either, as I don't think he's big or strong enough to consistently take or keep UFC level welterweights down. Even if he is, he'd get pieced up long before he manages to do it. I'm also not convinced he'd have any sort of edge on the ground against a Covington or Usman, equal at best, but they're way more athletic.

I'm saying all this because lots of people, myself included, were very excited about playing as him and wrestle****ing guys and all that, but the reality's different. So I hope he's properly rated and doesn't get mind-boggling buffs just to keep him "viable". He absolutely should have very good grappling stats and move ratings in the areas he's good at, but no more.

[Haz____]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Good Grappler has got to be so sad right now. He's finally gonna get Askren in a UFC game and he's gonna end up being terrible.

[1212headkick]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Askren deserves 75 striking and that's generous

[aholbert32]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Good Grappler has got to be so sad right now. He's finally gonna get Askren in a UFC game and he's gonna end up being terrible.

Alot of that depends on the mechanics. Stat wise he's going to have great wrestling and great takedowns. His striking will be **** but it was always going to be **** because he isnt a good striker.

If there are new grappling mechanics, it could make him really viable on the ground.

[Haz____]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Alot of that depends on the mechanics. Stat wise he's going to have great wrestling and great takedowns. His striking will be **** but it was always going to be **** because he isnt a good striker.

If there are new grappling mechanics, it could make him really viable on the ground.

Even his wrestling hasn't been great in the UFC. He got knocked out cold on a takedown against Mas. Got tombstoned trying to takedown Robbie. Shot like 5 takedowns against Maia and got swept almost every time immediately.

He has had almost no success at all in the UFC. Even at the things hes supposed good at.


If all I knew about Askren was from watching his UFC fights, there's no way on earth I'd think "This guy is an elite wrestler".

[Kingslayer04]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Even his wrestling hasn't been great in the UFC. He got knocked out cold on a takedown against Mas. Got tombstoned trying to takedown Robbie. Shot like 5 takedowns against Maia and got swept almost every time immediately.

He has had almost no success at all in the UFC. Even at the things hes supposed good at.


If all I knew about Askren was from watching his UFC fights, there's no way on earth I'd think "This guy is an elite wrestler".

Yeah, his entries aren't great to say the least. Plus, taking down a BJJ guy who would love it if you take him down isn't the same as taking down someone hellbent on keeping it on the feet and/or has great TDD. Now, Maia also respected Ben's grappling and didn't look to take him down at any opportunity, but he's still a guy who wouldn't be (and wasn't) bothered by being on his back against Askren.

And yeah, Askren has failed to do any of the stuff that got him famous against:

— a past his prime Robbie Lawler
— someone who's never been considered one of the best in the division in Masvidal, whose rise so far amounts to 2 fights and one of them is nearly killing Askren
— one of the biggest grappling challenges one can face, but still a person who wouldn't give him the kind of trouble on the feet a guy like Masvidal would, meaning Askren can freely enter and battle Maia skill for skill. It was close, sure, but he got submitted in the end. He did also gas.

Clearly this isn't ONE or Bellator. I was about to say he can probably blanket a top 10-15 guy but looking at those guys at WW, I doubt even that is likely. Every fight starts on the feet has never been more apt for anybody else. He's got nothing but wrestling, nothing, and this is MMA. And again, his very entries are bad, so how can he even get his wrestling going?

Yeah, I do like him and I'd like to see more of him against lower ranked opposition, but I think he's a terrible MMA fighter, no matter how good a wrestler he is.

[aholbert32]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

Even his wrestling hasn't been great in the UFC. He got knocked out cold on a takedown against Mas. Got tombstoned trying to takedown Robbie. Shot like 5 takedowns against Maia and got swept almost every time immediately.

He has had almost no success at all in the UFC. Even at the things hes supposed good at.


If all I knew about Askren was from watching his UFC fights, there's no way on earth I'd think "This guy is an elite wrestler".

He was 4 for 7 against Maia on takedowns so it wasnt like he had zero success. Maia is the elite of the elite when it comes to grappling and Askren had decent success on the ground. His entries are and have always been absolute ****.

The problem with judging him strictly off of UFC fights is that with the exception of the Maia fight, we've seen less than a round of him fight. The Jorge fight was 5 seconds and the Lawler fight was less than a round (where he was 1 for 2 in takedowns).

So should we ignore his pedigree (olympian) and his pre UFC success (Dominant against lesser competition) simply because of these 3 fights? Honest question.

I'm leaning towards suggesting that he is top 3-4 when it comes to areas like takedowns and top control...behind folks like Colby and Usman but I'm open to suggestions.

[Kingslayer04]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

He was 4 for 7 against Maia on takedowns so it wasnt like he had zero success. Maia is the elite of the elite when it comes to grappling and Askren had decent success on the ground. His entries are and have always been absolute ****.

The problem with judging him strictly off of UFC fights is that with the exception of the Maia fight, we've seen less than a round of him fight. The Jorge fight was 5 seconds and the Lawler fight was less than a round (where he was 1 for 2 in takedowns).

So should we ignore his pedigree (olympian) and his pre UFC success (Dominant against lesser competition) simply because of these 3 fights? Honest question.

I'm leaning towards suggesting that he is top 3-4 when it comes to areas like takedowns and top control...behind folks like Colby and Usman but I'm open to suggestions.

I don't think you should outright ignore his credentials, but unless he is magically put in top position, he's likely going to get decimated time and time again. Getting fights to the ground requires entries, and his are so slow, sloppy and telegraphed. Good luck taking anyone down with say, a LVL 2 entry + 83 for takedown offence. And that's without mentioning his 0 ability on the feet. 0. He can take a shot, I'll give him that. But he can do nothing else.

[tomitomitomi]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

So should we ignore his pedigree (olympian) and his pre UFC success (Dominant against lesser competition) simply because of these 3 fights? Honest question.

I mean hasn't this been the standard so far? I don't remember any specific instance from the top of my head but I swear "he hasn't proven it against the top competition" has been the number one argument against buffing some guys as much as some users here would like (90ish?).

[Haz____]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

He was 4 for 7 against Maia on takedowns so it wasnt like he had zero success. Maia is the elite of the elite when it comes to grappling and Askren had decent success on the ground. His entries are and have always been absolute ****.

The problem with judging him strictly off of UFC fights is that with the exception of the Maia fight, we've seen less than a round of him fight. The Jorge fight was 5 seconds and the Lawler fight was less than a round (where he was 1 for 2 in takedowns).

So should we ignore his pedigree (olympian) and his pre UFC success (Dominant against lesser competition) simply because of these 3 fights? Honest question.

I'm leaning towards suggesting that he is top 3-4 when it comes to areas like takedowns and top control...behind folks like Colby and Usman but I'm open to suggestions.

When it comes to guys like Gil Burns you always tell me over and over his credentials outside UFC don't matter untill he proves himself in UFC fights.


Realistically I do agree with you though. Maybe top 5 grappling. Somehwere around there. That div is stacked with grapplers though. You got guys like Colby, Usman, Maia, Nelson, Burns, GSP, at WW. Some really really good grapplers.

[aholbert32]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

I mean hasn't this been the standard so far? I don't remember any specific instance from the top of my head but I swear "he hasn't proven it against the top competition" has been the number one argument against buffing some guys as much as some users here would like (90ish?).

Not always. Example: Gokhan Saki.

We gave him really good striking stats simply because he is an elite level kickboxer even though he hasnt proven it against top competition in the UFC.

One way to look at it is the less UFC fights we have to go on, the more we have to rely on past accomplishments. We try to find a balance with that. If you have 5-6 UFC fights where you have fought for a decent amount of time, I dont have to rely as much on past accomplishments because I have plenty of data to go off on.

With Askren, I have about 13 minutes of UFC data which isnt alot.

Paulo Costa is an example. When we created his stats, we had 3 fights to go off of. I had to look at his pre UFC fights to help with giving him proper striking stats. Now many here thought I was wrong for giving him great power stats. I couldve been wrong if his follow up performances didnt show the stats were justified. Its an educated guess in situations like that.

[aholbert32]

Re: EA UFC Stat Change Request Discussion Thread

When it comes to guys like Gil Burns you always tell me over and over his credentials outside UFC don't matter untill he proves himself in UFC fights.


Realistically I do agree with you though. Maybe top 5 grappling. Somehwere around there. That div is stacked with grapplers though. You got guys like Colby, Usman, Maia, Nelson, Burns, GSP, at WW. Some really really good grapplers.

See I hate when people mischaracterize my arguments. The consistent argument I've had with you about Burns has had nothing to do with his prior accomplishments. It has always been about his striking...in particular his power.

You wanted us to significantly increase his power because he KOd Dan Moret and Jason Saggo. I disagreed because he Kod two guys who were low level UFC fighters.

Now Burns "credentials" are what got him a rating that is 5th in the division when it comes to Sub O. An argument could be made that it should be higher and had we continued to make changes through 2019, its possible that he would be.