Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

[Dankoz]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

It seems to be impossible to fight from outside after patch

[Thetruth9012]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Well yeah

But it’s much better than the current phonebooth meta

I essentially discovered a wave dash

Did i miss it?

How yo do it?

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[Thetruth9012]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Thats a good question. This is more of a skills vs. realism question. From a realism perspective, I agree completely.

From a skills persepctive, I have a question. Should an average player like me be able to easily circle completely out against a higher skilled pressure fighter simply because I have Edgar and he has someone with slighty lower (2-3 points) footwork? Or should a pressure fighter some additional tools to cut off the cage? Do you think pressure fighters currently have enough tools that even if 180 circling was added, the player would still be able to occasionally cut off the cage?

FYI, glad to see you back man. We need more people like you who can have a spirited discussion without getting personal.

Isn't it is how it works now with certain grapplers?

The average players can be very succesful on the ground using khabib and other guys...

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[bmlimo]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

I think the answer is a resounding yes

An average fighter can knock a better player silly using Connor or out grapple a better fighting using Khabib. Why is having the movement ratings more impactful an issue?

And yeah i decided to try the patch and discovered a way to create distance. That got me into playing again. Im honestly a bit scared to post a video of it because Im worried it’ll get nerfed. At this point im convinced the majority want rock em sock em robots gameplay.

This is great... the solution of all the spam/exploit in this game is in the footwork...but I played like 5 matches after the patch and didn’t saw that, did I miss something?

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Just had a dude sent me a hate message cuz I was “running” against Rumble lmao

I knocked him down twice, rocked him several times, and finished him on the ground.

But he could never pin me against the cage for long

[1212headkick]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

This is going way down the rabbit hole here. I dont know about karate, but boxing you circle both directions. Generally you want to circle away from opponents power hand. But whatever

true but generally most fighters are right handed so we were saying the same thing i only go the other way for lefties

[aholbert32]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

I think the answer is a resounding yes

An average fighter can knock a better player silly using Connor or out grapple a better fighting using Khabib. Why is having the movement ratings more impactful an issue?

And yeah i decided to try the patch and discovered a way to create distance. That got me into playing again. Im honestly a bit scared to post a video of it because Im worried it’ll get nerfed. At this point im convinced the majority want rock em sock em robots gameplay.

Here is the problem:

There are many high level players who hate that. They hate that an "average" player can take a guy like Cormier, time a takedown and lay on top of them solely because he has a higher top game rating.

The Conor example isnt perfect because there is no technique that someone can use with Conor thats pretty much guaranteed to get you a rock or KD. Also there is a balance because Conor's stamina is average and therefore there are ways to face someone using him and still get a win.

Let me be clear. I'm not making these arguments. I'm actually in favor of a bigger difference in the skills of each fighter when it comes to stats. I'm an offline player so I really dont give a **** about balance.

With that said, I recognize that balance is important when it comes to online and especially ranked online. So I'm just telling you the counter arguments that I've heard and I anticipate will come when it comes to something like 180 circling with the press of one button combination.

They will argue that the new meta will become runners. That everyone will choose Edgar, Wonderboy and others with high footwork and use the easier circling to run and pot shot. That it will discourage inside fighters and make it impossible to cut off the cage. ****, I have seen a few guys argue that its already to difficult to cut off the cage.

So thats what you are working against and if you want to convince the devs, there either needs to be a middle ground or a long thought through argument that an addition like this wont change the meta in a negative way.(I'm just saying 180....the devs have already indicated that they are open to some movement changes)

[1212headkick]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Here is the problem:

There are many high level players who hate that. They hate that an "average" player can take a guy like Cormier, time a takedown and lay on top of them solely because he has a higher top game rating.

The Conor example isnt perfect because there is no technique that someone can use with Conor thats pretty much guaranteed to get you a rock or KD. Also there is a balance because Conor's stamina is average and therefore there are ways to face someone using him and still get a win.

Let me be clear. I'm not making these arguments. I'm actually in favor of a bigger difference in the skills of each fighter when it comes to stats. I'm an offline player so I really dont give a **** about balance.

With that said, I recognize that balance is important when it comes to online and especially ranked online. So I'm just telling you the counter arguments that I've heard and I anticipate will come when it comes to something like 180 circling with the press of one button combination.

They will argue that the new meta will become runners. That everyone will choose Edgar, Wonderboy and others with high footwork and use the easier circling to run and pot shot. That it will discourage inside fighters and make it impossible to cut off the cage. ****, I have seen a few guys argue that its already to difficult to cut off the cage.

So thats what you are working against and if you want to convince the devs, there either needs to be a middle ground or a long thought through argument that an addition like this wont change the meta in a negative way.(I'm just saying 180....the devs have already indicated that they are open to some movement changes)

im proposing two circle out animations both of which can be caught on tape. a basic 90 degree shuffling animation and an advanced 180 degree animation. pressure fighters negate this moving side to side. there should be high vulnerability when doing so. the skill behind it is timing. you have to know where to go and when for it to be effective. theres absoloutely nothing to stop constant forward pressure. ty 4 listening ❤

[Thetruth9012]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Here is the problem:

There are many high level players who hate that. They hate that an "average" player can take a guy like Cormier, time a takedown and lay on top of them solely because he has a higher top game rating.

The Conor example isnt perfect because there is no technique that someone can use with Conor thats pretty much guaranteed to get you a rock or KD. Also there is a balance because Conor's stamina is average and therefore there are ways to face someone using him and still get a win.

Let me be clear. I'm not making these arguments. I'm actually in favor of a bigger difference in the skills of each fighter when it comes to stats. I'm an offline player so I really dont give a **** about balance.

With that said, I recognize that balance is important when it comes to online and especially ranked online. So I'm just telling you the counter arguments that I've heard and I anticipate will come when it comes to something like 180 circling with the press of one button combination.

They will argue that the new meta will become runners. That everyone will choose Edgar, Wonderboy and others with high footwork and use the easier circling to run and pot shot. That it will discourage inside fighters and make it impossible to cut off the cage. ****, I have seen a few guys argue that its already to difficult to cut off the cage.

So thats what you are working against and if you want to convince the devs, there either needs to be a middle ground or a long thought through argument that an addition like this wont change the meta in a negative way.(I'm just saying 180....the devs have already indicated that they are open to some movement changes)

It cant work like that.
1 button press cant give you 180 circle out that's cheesse.

We should be able to do it but it need to require some skill from the user.

As of now

Pressure fighters dont need to do anything besides pressing LS forward and you cant escape it( Thats BS)

And counter fighters dont have the appropiate tools to deal with it(that's also BS)

In both situations it cant be that simple as it is now for pressure guys.

[1212headkick]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

It cant work like that.
1 button press cant give you 180 circle out that's cheesse.

We should be able to do it but it need to require some skill from the user.

As of now

Pressure fighters dont need to do anything besides pressing LS forward and you cant escape it( Thats BS)

And counter fighters dont have the appropiate tools to deal with it(that's also BS)
In both situations it cant be that simple as it is now for pressure guys.

it would be an advanced lunge that costs alot of stamina and high fight ending vulnerability. i can do it over and over but you only need to time my movement once. its basic realistic footwork seen in all combat sports

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Here is the problem:

There are many high level players who hate that. They hate that an "average" player can take a guy like Cormier, time a takedown and lay on top of them solely because he has a higher top game rating.

The Conor example isnt perfect because there is no technique that someone can use with Conor thats pretty much guaranteed to get you a rock or KD. Also there is a balance because Conor's stamina is average and therefore there are ways to face someone using him and still get a win.

Let me be clear. I'm not making these arguments. I'm actually in favor of a bigger difference in the skills of each fighter when it comes to stats. I'm an offline player so I really dont give a **** about balance.

With that said, I recognize that balance is important when it comes to online and especially ranked online. So I'm just telling you the counter arguments that I've heard and I anticipate will come when it comes to something like 180 circling with the press of one button combination.

They will argue that the new meta will become runners. That everyone will choose Edgar, Wonderboy and others with high footwork and use the easier circling to run and pot shot. That it will discourage inside fighters and make it impossible to cut off the cage. ****, I have seen a few guys argue that its already to difficult to cut off the cage.

So thats what you are working against and if you want to convince the devs, there either needs to be a middle ground or a long thought through argument that an addition like this wont change the meta in a negative way.(I'm just saying 180....the devs have already indicated that they are open to some movement changes)

Here’s what makes absolutely 0 sense about their argument

Every single arcade fighter has tiers where certain characters are objectively better than others especially at certain things. Dr. Doom in UMVC3 was objective better than Ryu. Same applies for Injustice, Mortal Kombat, Tekken etc.

In any other sports game Steph Curry or Tom Brady are objective better and easier to use due to ratings as well.

WhyTF are we trying to have complete balance? That ruins the game and gets rid of the chess match/ strategy of matchups. Lec already normalizes stats so that shouldnt be an issue. Strategy and exploiting strengths/weaknesses of ratings should be just as, if not more,important than stick skills.

I’ve actually been a high level Madden and 2k player at one point. One of the most important things is always knowing your and your opponents strengths and weaknesses. Getting rid of that ruins the game because then everyone plays the same.

[Thetruth9012]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

it would be an advanced lunge that costs alot of stamina and high fight ending vulnerability. i can do it over and over but you only need to time my movement once. its basic realistic footwork seen in all combat sports

https://forums.operationsports.com/f...d.php?t=928252

My idea was to press ls down or up 2 times.

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[FCB x Finlay]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Just have LB + LS to have complete sideways movement and back dash. Make the back dash tied to the oppenent but the sidesteps tied to the octogan position.

Add diagonal back lunges.

Add horse riding stance for certain fighters as a signiture movememt.

Increase the effiectiveness of both teeps and sidekicks to the body by increasing power, speed of animation and that slight sideways movement doesnt make sidekicks miss.

Increase damage of strikes from the striker having superuor foot postion.

The tools are already there to stop this, so absolutely no balancing required on the other end. Having a knowledge about pressure fighting is all thats required to work out what to do.

[aholbert32]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Here’s what makes absolutely 0 sense about their argument

Every single arcade fighter has tiers where certain characters are objectively better than others especially at certain things. Dr. Doom in UMVC3 was objective better than Ryu. Same applies for Injustice, Mortal Kombat, Tekken etc.

In any other sports game Steph Curry or Tom Brady are objective better and easier to use due to ratings as well.

WhyTF are we trying to have complete balance? That ruins the game and gets rid of the chess match/ strategy of matchups. Lec already normalizes stats so that shouldnt be an issue. Strategy and exploiting strengths/weaknesses of ratings should be just as, if not more,important than stick skills.

I’ve actually been a high level Madden and 2k player at one point. One of the most important things is always knowing your and your opponents strengths and weaknesses. Getting rid of that ruins the game because then everyone plays the same.

Man....you are preaching to the ****ing choir. I had a discussion the other day about a fighter who is past his prime. He is still active but he is clearly not as good as he used to be and is arguably a bad fighter. Now when we rated him, we gave him stats that are accurate to today. The counter argument was that we should still take into consideration his greatness from past years when we rate him and that we are doing his fans and him a disservice by rating him based on his performance today.

I couldnt believe it because this wouldnt be a conversation in any other sports game. In NBA 2K18, Dwayne Wade is rated as he is today (a older slightly above average guard). No one says "Wade was great in 2011...why isnt he rated partially based on that season" but for some reason thats considered reasonable when it comes to EA UFC. I've seen similar discussions on this board.

What I've learned this year is that there is a clear divide in this community and it makes developing this game tough. With something like movement, there are groups of people who want more freedom of movement and are OK if "running" is a possibility. There are others who love the phone booth meta. There is a potential middle ground but thats not always easy to find.

[AlexSavaliuc]

Re: Outside/point fighting or movement in general?

Make the advancing hooks shorter and this will fix all problems as they will allways miss if you walk back