UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

[BlueNGold]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

Are you talking about the moment at the end of the 1st round? Was there ANOTHER hit from a knee besides that? If so, when was it?

Honestly, it did look like he was faking it at the end of the first round from the replays, as the knee looked like it grazed Koscheck and didn't hit him flush. But, it's very possible that there was an eye gouge moments before that that actually hurt Koscheck. (i didn't see any replays of 5 or so seconds before that missed knee)

So you may be right that he was faking there, but even if he was, faking an injury in MMA isn't technically against the rules. Throwing a knee aimed at a grounded opponent is illegal, eye gouging is illegal, and throwing a punch after the final bell is illegal. That's the point, and I agree that both guys do things to make people hate them. Koscheck is definitely a heel, he definetly wants to be hated. But in the actual fight, besides potentially faking an injury (which may be true i don't know), he didn't do anything illegal.

There's a reason why Dana White banned Daley from UFC and praised Koscheck. Dana White also called Koscheck a "dick", but as far as what happened in the fight, it was hard to tell if there was an eye gouge in there before the knee that caused Koscheck to carry on like that.

So, he may be a joke, but in the ring, he's a much more well rounded fighter than Daley. Daley has no grappling skill whatsoever.

No, I was talking about when he also faked a knee hit against Rumble Johnson.

And faking injuries may not be "illegal" but it's disrespecting the sport just as much, actually you could argue worse than, Daley punching Koscheck after the bell.

I never said Koscheck wasn't better than Daley, but my point still stands that both are douches and I'm glad 1 of them has their fate sealed against GSP. If Koscheck happens to beat GSP, I'll have to knee myself in the head from anger.

[MachoMyers]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

Dana on the illegal knee: "it was an illegal knee, and the knee didn’t touch him. If it did hit him, the only thing it must have fractured was a hair,” said White.
Saying that Koscheck's actions during the fight were worse than Daley's after is insane. You might not like Koscheck's antics but nobody should condone what Daley did. Good riddance to him.

[MC Fatigue]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

And yeah, most people want GSP to beat the hell out of Koscheck, but that's kind of what Koscheck is going for. He wants the fight to be as big as possible. People will watch hoping that he gets knocked out. And yeah GSP will be the heavy favorite, but I think Koscheck will give him a better fight than Daley would have. (because Koscheck is a good wrestler and has good takedown offense and takedown defense and is good in the clinch)

He'll give him a better fight, but still not much of a fight.

What's Koscheck going to do? His stand up is weak, and GSP's is actually pretty damn good. This is a fight where he could keep it standing if he wanted to, and just clown Koscheck. And Koscheck isn't going to out wrestle GSP; we already saw what happened before, and while Koscheck said he's grown as a fighter, well so has GSP by about 1,000,000 times that of Koscheck.

Koscheck can't win anywhere or do anything to GSP. It's another joke of a fight as is any WW challenger at this point for GSP, but hopefully GSP makes it entertaining as he usually does.

[BlueNGold]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

Not sure how Koscheck faked having a knee graze his eye. The result of it made Koscheck's eye look similar to getting an eye poke. It wasn't a devastating knee but it did hit his eye. It was also an illegal blow.

How you can say that Koscheck's actions during the fight were worse than Daley's after is insane. You might not like Koscheck's antics but nobody should condone what Daley did. Good riddance to him.

Where in my post did I say I condoned what Daley did? As far as I'm concerned he got what he deserved, which is being without a job in the UFC now.

I'm just saying that we don't need fighters turning MMA into soccer with people faking injuries to gain advantages. That's why I said you could argue what Koscheck did (faking the knee hit) is worse than what Daley did.

[simgamer0005]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

Anyone else find it kind of funny that the man who built his career on countering the moves of others got knocked out by a counter attack when he decided to be the aggressor? I do.

Yeah I do. It was not only kind of funny, but very telling. Machida fought much more aggressively than he usually does. He was out of character because he let the media-influenced controversy get to him. That was his mistake, and he payed for it.

But, let be real about it. In the first 3 minutes of the round, Machida had two great powerful takedowns. (something we didn't see from either guy in the first fight) One of those takedowns was actually Shogun attempting to takedown Machida and Machida reversing it and taking Shogun down. Machida had a great counter when Shogun started lunging in with his head down. So I thought Machida was clearly winning the round before he got dropped.

And if you look at the knockdown Shogun had, it was a punch that landed behind Machida's ear. (not on the temple as was said by the announcers, but near the back of his head, on the corner of the back of his head) Getting hit by a punch in that position is probably going to drop anyone. Danny Green dropped Roy Jones Jr in boxing from a punch in a similar spot.

It was a great punch by Shogun, but it didn't hit Machida flush in the face or anything. And it was a punch after Machida was getting back up after taking down Shogun. So, yeah it is ironic and funny that Machida got knocked out by being aggressive, but if Machida would have stuck to his usual style, he likely would have won a decision again. (or lost a close decision or something, ya know?)

I give credit to Machida for fighting more aggressively, essentially for trying to please the fans. But it ended up getting him KTFO. Now Rua is the champ and it will be harder for Machida to have his usual style and his mystique has passed now that he's been knocked out. Rua was in great shape and had a great gameplan so as not to take anything away from Rua. But, I think Machida just got unlucky in that situation, and could have very easily been on his way to a win had he survived the first round. If anything, I think it would have served Machida better to be conservative in the first round, then to open up more in rounds 2-5. But hindsight 20-20.

Anyway, I kind of had a feeling Rua could do it having fought Machida before; he's the only one who'd actually had experience against his timing and movements.

Yeah. We knew Rua could beat Machida but it was a question of would Machida let him. Machida looked a tad slower than usual (not by much but slightly) But Machida still looked good early. But you could tell he was a bit unsure of exactly what he wanted to do.

I'm curious when this LHW belt is going to be defended more than once. Seems like it likes to move around.

You think Machida - Rua III will happen next? Or will Rua take on the winner of Evans vs Rampage? I personally would like to see Machida - Rua III, but Rua would be the heavy favorite after he knocked out Machida.

And F Anderson Silva. The last thing I want to see now is that guy fight. I have no desire to see the guy go for the 205 belt no matter how impressive he's looked at 205. I'd rather him defend his belt against Sonnen and then promptly **** off. I'd rather see the established 205'ers continue to go at it as if Silva didn't exist.

Look, Silva is the extreme Machida. His last fight was crazy. He was Muhammad Ali times 10 in the first two rounds, then did absolutely nothing in rounds 3-5. Silva is however a great athlete, and I don't hate him. I find his fights interesting because he walks that line that no one else (even Machida) seems to walk. Still, beating Anderson Silva is very difficult to do, beacuse you have to actually get within range of him (which is hard) then actually hit him hard.

Silva at times looks unbeatable, other times looks uninterested, but seemingly he's here to stay, even though Dana White was pissed at his last performance. Silva has said he will not fight Machida because he is like a brother to Silva. Yet, Rua was asked whether he would fight Silva and he said yes he would. So maybe Silva won't fight Machida but maybe he'll fight Rua. Rua is Brazilian but more aggressive than either Silva or Machida. (a style Dana White among others prefer)

As for Daley, glad he lost. As much as I can't stand Koscheck, Daley was even more obnoxious. Looks like that won't be a problem anymore, however.

Me, too. Daley was much more obnoxious than Koscheck. Koscheck loves to be hated, but he does it in a way that is less annoying than Daley. As Dana White said, Daley is done, and frankly, I don't blame him.

Any way you slice it, Daley lost everything against Koscheck. The fight, his UFC career, everything. Koscheck totally outclassed him and owned him.

[simgamer0005]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

He'll give him a better fight, but still not much of a fight.

I agree that GSP is probably better than Koscheck in basically every area. Striking and on the ground. But I wouldn't count Koscheck out after that kind of performance. GSP is going to be favored against anyone he fights at this point. So of course GSP will be the favorite to win.

What's Koscheck going to do? His stand up is weak, and GSP's is actually pretty damn good. This is a fight where he could keep it standing if he wanted to, and just clown Koscheck. And Koscheck isn't going to out wrestle GSP; we already saw what happened before, and while Koscheck said he's grown as a fighter, well so has GSP by about 1,000,000 times that of Koscheck.

Well I don't think Koscheck will stand with GSP. He'll try to setup a clinch or a takedown. He'll probably try to either counter GSP's takedowns or go for takedowns of his own. Koscheck had a great NCAA wrestling career and I think he was like 42-0 or something as a junior in college. GSP is a great grappler as well, but I think Koscheck has actually improved more than GSP. GSP was much better than Koscheck 5 years ago. Now, he still may be better, but I think Koscheck is closer to GSP. (Both have improved, both have refined their skill) But Koscheck seemed to be more decisive with his takedowns. Sure he was fighting a guy in Daley with no grappling skill whatsoever. And don't get me wrong. I think GSP will win, I Just think it will be an interesting and as good of a fight for GSP as there is out there. Who else out there deserves to fight GSP more than Koscheck? Who out there has a better chance against GSP than Koscheck? (i'm not being sarcastic here saying that there isn't someone else out there, but merely asking who do you think is out there that you'd rather see fight GSP than Koscheck?)

Koscheck can't win anywhere or do anything to GSP. It's another joke of a fight as is any WW challenger at this point for GSP, but hopefully GSP makes it entertaining as he usually does.

I tend to agree, but I don't think it's a joke of a fight. Koscheck was impressive against a tough dude in Daley. He totally neutralized a powerful puncher. And if he can somehow time GSP, maybe he can hang with GSP for a few rounds.

I think GSP is probably the best pound for pound guy out there, and I would pick GSP against koscheck, but I think Koscheck's style will make GSP think a bit more than he usually does. Koscheck doesn't have very strong strike, but he does have some good footwork, and great mat skills.

[ManiacMatt1782]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

And? You dont take away points for failed attempts, you take them away for actually doing something illegal.

bs they have before and should continue to take points for intent

[MachoMyers]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

Where in my post did I say I condoned what Daley did? As far as I'm concerned he got what he deserved, which is being without a job in the UFC now.

I'm just saying that we don't need fighters turning MMA into soccer with people faking injuries to gain advantages. That's why I said you could argue what Koscheck did (faking the knee hit) is worse than what Daley did.

I wasn't giving you the business but goh. I should have quoted him. I'm with you on all fronts.

[ManiacMatt1782]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

Just watched machida and shogun again this morning, and machida looked good, but his downfall was being more aggressive with his "rush". Machida usually times this when his opponent is chasing to catch them off ballance, and so they cant be set to hit him with a bigh shot while set. he mistimed it, and shogun was set and made him pay.

[feedthehorse28]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

i think rua will face the winner of rashad/rampage and after he beats the winner of that fight im feeling a rubber match. machida did look better with the takedowns but as mentioned before his moment of being over aggressive cost him.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.



you've got to be ishing me Daley. You prick

[Bighoff]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

I agree that GSP is probably better than Koscheck in basically every area. Striking and on the ground. But I wouldn't count Koscheck out after that kind of performance. GSP is going to be favored against anyone he fights at this point. So of course GSP will be the favorite to win.



Well I don't think Koscheck will stand with GSP. He'll try to setup a clinch or a takedown. He'll probably try to either counter GSP's takedowns or go for takedowns of his own. Koscheck had a great NCAA wrestling career and I think he was like 42-0 or something as a junior in college. GSP is a great grappler as well, but I think Koscheck has actually improved more than GSP. GSP was much better than Koscheck 5 years ago. Now, he still may be better, but I think Koscheck is closer to GSP. (Both have improved, both have refined their skill) But Koscheck seemed to be more decisive with his takedowns. Sure he was fighting a guy in Daley with no grappling skill whatsoever. And don't get me wrong. I think GSP will win, I Just think it will be an interesting and as good of a fight for GSP as there is out there. Who else out there deserves to fight GSP more than Koscheck? Who out there has a better chance against GSP than Koscheck? (i'm not being sarcastic here saying that there isn't someone else out there, but merely asking who do you think is out there that you'd rather see fight GSP than Koscheck?)

Yep, Kos was 42-0 his Junior year at Edinboro University at 174lbs, he was a four time All American in college too. He came into the UFC a wrestler and has developed a nice BJJ game as well as a descent stand up. he's got KO power and can take a hit. He will be a better match up with GSP then most people think, GSP gets the win if it's a stand up fight but I give Kos a good chance if he can get the fight to the ground.

[Bighoff]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

you've got to be ishing me Daley. You prick

That was the ONLY chance that limey sissy got to land that "big left hand."

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

Good thing Kos had his guard up by instinct, he would have been KO'd and Daley might have gotten arrested

[BlueNGold]

Re: UFC 113-Machida-Shogun 2, May 8th in Montreal.

I wasn't giving you the business but goh. I should have quoted him. I'm with you on all fronts.

Ah, ok. My bad. It looked like you were talking to me because your post was right after mine.

LOL @ the Daley gif. So dumb...