fans of underground rap?

[Gmoney2002]

Re: fans of underground rap?

by JiggidyJames

Let's see...he carried Guru for 14 years, made Group Home and Jeru sound good, produced almost every MC worth anything and has dozens of uncontested classics under his belt. He's inspired so many of the producers out now, as well. It would take me all day to list all of his accomplishments.

JJames, well said. In my opinion Jeru is just an above average lyricists. With a Primo beat that duo was amazing.

by Xcell I still say 9th Wonder is the greatest

Xcell, I don't know about that. He may arguably be the best right now but not the best ever. His library is no where near Primo's. Primo has done work with Jay-z, Nas and other lyrical giants. He also makes average lyricists sound better(i.e Jeru, Heather B, Sonia Blade, Das Efx), 9th has not yet grasp that ability yet. He's almost there though. He's my favourite right now though. The funny thing is, most of his techniques he got from Primo. 9th, next to primo, is the best at chopping samples.

Jmood. Primo's beats simplistic? are you kidding me? you try chopping an 4-8 second sample into two full looped bars and make it sound good with fluidty and synchronization. It's easier said then done. The reason it sounds simplistic is because the way he puts the chops together it sounds like a full loop but it's not. The same with 9th, if you listen carefully you can hear the chops. Some beats are more obvious then some.

For instance, "Threat" off of Black album, a lot of people think that's just a looped sample but it's not. He chopped up a sample and re-looped it.

EDIT: I almost forgot about Pete Rock, wow hehe. He's one of the cornerstones too. He's in my top 5 for sure(all-time list that is....). I think in some circles RZA is underatted as a producer, he has some major bangers under his belt. Tru Master(Wu-tang producer) deservers honorable mention too.

He did these Wu Tang tracks:
Killah Priest - One step
Method Man - Torture(Classic)
Method Man - Love is Love
Cappadonna - Slang Editorial
Cappadonna - Splish Splash
Cappadonna - Super Model
Wu tang - Heaterz
Wu tang - M.G.M.

[X*Cell]

Re: fans of underground rap?

Xcell, I don't know about that. He may arguably be the best right now but not the best ever. His library is no where near Primo's. Primo has done work with Jay-z, Nas and other lyrical giants.

First of all... I'd like to say great post... you are right... 9th has definetely improved greatly over the last 2 years though. I didn't think super-highly of him as I do now when he first started, but his beats now are almost-always tracks to be repeated and repeated.

When you said Primo has worked with Jay-Z and Nas tho... 9th has too. So that point is moot. 9th also has recently done a track with Lloyd Banks.

I don't really look at producers in a all-time standpoint... I love 9th's beats now... so I think he's the best... and old-school producer could have been ill in the 80's... but in no way do I listen to that same producer now... 80's rap is much worse than it is today. Old-school rap is sometimes good to go back to, but its not what I listen to often.

[JiggidyJames]

Re: fans of underground rap?

EDIT: I almost forgot about Pete Rock, wow hehe. He's one of the cornerstones too. He's in my top 5 for sure(all-time list that is....). I think in some circles RZA is underatted as a producer, he has some major bangers under his belt. Tru Master(Wu-tang producer) deservers honorable mention too.

You know what it is with RZA, he never really branched out. I think the first time I heard him work with someone outside of the Wu was AZ in '95. He just never made his mark outside of his group. Some people don't consider that a good thing, but whatever. Personally, I rank him high.

And Tru Master learned from not only RZA, but Primo as well. Crazy, huh?

Nivek, you were spot-on. And don't forget everybody...every bassline is the same.

"it's not on iTunes" referred to any Dr. Octagon. there's like one song on it.

and if you read the rest of my post, correctly, you would know that I was talking about the FIRST Dr. Octagon cd. not the new one, or the bootleg that was posted on hiphopsite. I even said first, in multiple posts...

Weren't you talking about how you wanted to "pick up" the "new" Dr. Octagon, but after sampling a few tracks, you felt it wasn't any good?

That's right, you did...http://forums.operationsports.com/vB...57#post2678557

Our signals were simply crossed.

[JiggidyJames]

Re: fans of underground rap?

When you said Primo has worked with Jay-Z and Nas tho... 9th has too. So that point is moot. 9th also has recently done a track with Lloyd Banks.

ONE song with Jay, and it wasn't even the best song on the album! Primo's gotten more out of Nas than anyone other than Large Professor. After 9th produces Jay and Nas for half their albums, then the point is moot. As long he's just mailing them beat tapes, it's valid.

BTW, Marley Marl has beats in his closet from 1989 that would smoke any of these new producers. Seriously, he played some for me about six months ago when my friend was on Future Flavaz.

[ehh]

Re: fans of underground rap?

Hmm, I haven't followed rap that closely for the first time in about a dozen years, but unless 9th Wonder made drastic improvements since the Minstrel Show there is no way he's touching Primo or Pete Rock.

And I don't get how people say Primo has boring-sounding tracks, but to each his own - everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[Kruza]

Re: fans of underground rap?

Heh, Pete Rock is my favorite producer ever for a lot of reasons, but I'm not going to go over that here.

Primo is the man. He's done so many classic tracks and has been a part of the creation of quite a few standout albums. With that said, I still say to this day that his best-produced album is Jeru's The Sun Rises In The East. A truly awesome timeless classic. Jeru should've never left him after Wrath of the Math because the quality of production on his later albums haven't been as good since.

I also agree with RZA being one of the best producers. And you know what? I really like the first Bobby Digital in Stereo album when he was trying incorporate live instruments along with a bunch of odd-sounding, crazy high-pitch melodies. But it was a experimental album, and I think it turned many people off just by how "out there" it sounded. The second one, however, was pure garbage. He bounced back nicely with The Birth of a Prince, but by then it was too late. Most of the hip-hop audience has passed him by. Now I think he sticks to doing songs for certain movie soundtracks.

Also, those who like the RZA's style of production should check for Bronze Nazareth. Now there may be people who have not heard of him, but he's a guy who has assisted the RZA behind closed doors. The Great Migration is an album BN brought out earlier this year, and it's worth checking out. It's got that memorable Wu sound quality to it.

Big props for mentioning Large Professor. He's another one of my favorites for so many reasons to mention. So is Muggs of Cypress Hill. I liked Erick Sermon's work a lot back in the early-mid '90s with the Redman, Keith Murray and his own solo albums, but he hasn't done much for me to check for lately. It's too bad because he remains to be one-half of my favorite hip-hop duo of all time, EPMD. The other half Parrish Smith was the one mainly working it on the EPMD joints during their heyday, so I gotta throw his name out there.

I have my favorites of the '80s like Marley Marl, Ced-Gee of the Ultramagnetic MCs (did a lot of work on BDP's Criminal Minded as well), Dr. Dre with The D.O.C's No One Can Do It Better album alone, let alone the stuff he did for N.W.A. Hank Shocklee and the Bomb Squad for the early Public Enemy albums plus Ice Cube's Amerikkka's Most Wanted. Afrika Islam for putting in a lot of work on two of Ice-T's trifecta of classic albums Rhyme Pays and Power. (For those who are curious, O.G. Original Gangster is the other classic.)

And do you know who else is a great producer? Prince Paul. I personally think he's the most slept-on producer ever, but that's me.

Kruza

[ehh]

Re: fans of underground rap?

been a part of the creation of quite a few standout albums.

Kruza

Forget albums, he was part of the creation of a standout sound & style!

[JiggidyJames]

Re: fans of underground rap?

I second the Bronze Nazareth recomendation. The album sounds like it was mastered in a bathroom, but the spirit is there.

BTW, great post Kruza. We've had a lot from this discussion, but your's was the best.

[Nivek]

Re: fans of underground rap?

And do you know who else is a great producer? Prince Paul. I personally think he's the most slept-on producer ever, but that's me.

Kruza

Handsome Boy Modeling School = Dopeness.

[X*Cell]

Re: fans of underground rap?

Warren G used to be a standout producer too... not so much anymore... I wasn't a huge fan of "In the Mid-Nite Hour"... but he is one of my all-time faves I guess.

[rockchisler]

Re: fans of underground rap?

Since were talking about Producers Its gotta Be J Dilla (RIP) and 9th wonder....Then Dre, Primo, Pete Rock, Illmind

[X*Cell]

Re: fans of underground rap?


Artist: Zion I & Grouch
Album: Heroes in the City of Dope
Producers: Amp Live (12); Eligh; Headnodic; Grouch

This cd is only somewhat heroic, but some of the style thrown down is pretty damn dope. It's just a shame that Amp Live pretty much produced the entire album. The two best songs on the 15-track cd aren't produced by him. Instead, they are created by Eligh and Headnodic. I always express my opinion strongly about the beats in each of my reviews, but the lyrics here are pretty-super hero like. Zion does a great job tackling issues that are fresh off his mind. Oaktown, Bay Area, South Central, and LA should be proud of their young heroes. More and more hookups like this (maybe we can toss in Murs next time) should make for some good tunes to listen to. Oh yeah, and Chali 2na fans... he's on this cd.

• Grade:
  • B+
• Song to Download:
  • "Lift Me Up"
  • Produced by:
    • Eligh

[X*Cell]

Re: fans of underground rap?

Since were talking about Producers Its gotta Be J Dilla (RIP) and 9th wonder....Then Dre, Primo, Pete Rock, Illmind

and Khrysis.

[Tha_Kid]

Re: fans of underground rap?

Artist: Zion I & Grouch
Album: Heroes in the City of Dope
Producers: Amp Live (12); Eligh; Headnodic; Grouch

I like Zion I but the Grouch guy ruined nearly every song for me... can't stand rappers that sound like him and Immortal Technique...

[X*Cell]

Re: fans of underground rap?

I like Zion I but the Grouch guy ruined nearly every song for me... can't stand rappers that sound like him and Immortal Technique...

Immortal Technique Blows... totally agree!