Let's Talk Player Confidence - Madden 16 Edition

[LowerWolf]

I'd be fine with it not being in the game. But if you're going to have confidence, why not treat it like any other rating and have it move incrementally?

A guy like Brady should pretty much always be in the 90s. It should take years and eroding skills for his confidence to drop. And the same should hold true in reverse for an undrafted FA.

[CM Hooe]

Quote: Originally Posted by GameBreaker35

Just for the sake of discussion though, why is it that you are generally conformable with a confidence mechanic in the game? Do you find it to be reflective of the real NFL? You're obviously respected on these boards, so I'm interested in your thoughts on this one.

As a game designer I find it to be an interesting wrinkle in the game and, with respect to Game Prep in isolation, an interesting opportunity cost for the user.

Generally speaking I'm less concerned about "sim above all else" and more concerned about "does this mechanic meaningfully and in a context-appropriate manner engage the user in the video game and give the user agency in the experience". That's the difference between DDG and Confidence for me; managing athlete morale and its effects on my players makes sense to me and gives me something to do / a new variable to consider as a user, but the game telling me that running for 30 yards on this drive and punting is more important than scoring a passing touchdown - while indeed giving me agency in the choice to pursue those yards - I have a harder time wrapping my head around because it conflicts with the higher-level goal of a football game.

[ajk49er]

I think until you can get progression/regression "right", there is no reason to add a complicated system such as confidence to the equation.


if you go through the first patch, and CB's still have PD's counted instead of INT's for goals, I seriously question how one could feel confident in "confidence".


when you sim 4-5 years, and there are less than a handful of QB's over an 80 rating, I question how this was even put in the game to begin with. fix what is already in the game, then we can focus on other factors.


my biggest issue is this feels like another one of those "features" that will disappear from the game, and was ultimately unnecessary and a waste of time, while stuff broken every year(their draft classes, the rating system) remain untouched.


get rid of confidence.

[Alondite]

Confidence needs to be in the game, it just needs to be tuned.

Why? It's simple:

Let's say a team with low-rater players wins their first 6 games. In the real world, this team would be climbing up the power rankings and would be considered among the best teams in the league. Madden's roster updates would also improve the players on this team.

In Madden, and without confidence, this team would stay low-rated, and the fact that they are winning games would account for nothing. They could then go on to lost their final 10 games because their players are rated low. This could happen in the NFL, but it rarely does.

Confidence boosts their ratings while they are playing well, and will keep them high as long as they keep playing well.

The reason why player progression cannot be the solution is because having a few good games does not make a player permanently better. Confidence allows players to go hot and cold.

The problem isn't the system, it's the implementation. In-game confidence needs to be more dynamic and needs to change more. A player should theoretically be able to go from 0 to 100 confidence (or vice-versa) in-game if they are playing well (or poorly) enough, and their ratings should be temporarily boosted (or lowered) to reflect the fact that they are "hot" (or cold).

The idea is that even one big play should be able to give a team a huge lift in confidence and momentum, just like in the real NFL. Maybe this stat should be called "momentum" rather than confidence.

Out-of-game confidence, let's call it "season confidence," needs to be less dynamic. A player starts a game at their season confidence level, and depending on what their in-game confidence level (or "momentum") is at the end of the game, their season confidence could go up or down a few points to reflect it.

This also needs to be relative to player skills. A player should need to perform above or below their rating (including confidence-adjusted ratings) to be affected. Players should also need traits to determine how much their confidence is affected. Some players are more stable, while others are affected more by their performance.

And lastly, it actually needs to matter for top players. With stats being capped at 99, players who already have 99 in those stats get no bonus from high confidence. Confidence should be able to push stats over 99 for highly-rated players.

[booker21]

Quote: Originally Posted by Alondite

Confidence needs to be in the game, it just needs to be tuned. Why? It's simple: Let's say a team with low-rater players wins their first 6 games. In the real world, this team would be climbing up the power rankings and would be considered among the best teams in the league. Madden's roster updates would also improve the players on this team. In Madden, and without confidence, this team would stay low-rated, and the fact that they are winning games would account for nothing. They could then go on to lost their final 10 games because their players are rated low. This could happen in the NFL, but it rarely does. Confidence boosts their ratings while they are playing well, and will keep them high as long as they keep playing well. The reason why player progression cannot be the solution is because having a few good games does not make a player permanently better. Confidence allows players to go hot and cold. The problem isn't the system, it's the implementation. In-game confidence needs to be more dynamic and needs to change more. A player should theoretically be able to go from 0 to 100 confidence (or vice-versa) in-game if they are playing well (or poorly) enough, and their ratings should be temporarily boosted (or lowered) to reflect the fact that they are "hot" (or cold). The idea is that even one big play should be able to give a team a huge lift in confidence and momentum, just like in the real NFL. Maybe this stat should be called "momentum" rather than confidence. Out-of-game confidence, let's call it "season confidence," needs to be less dynamic. A player starts a game at their season confidence level, and depending on what their in-game confidence level (or "momentum") is at the end of the game, their season confidence could go up or down a few points to reflect it. This also needs to be relative to player skills. A player should need to perform above or below their rating (including confidence-adjusted ratings) to be affected. Players should also need traits to determine how much their confidence is affected. Some players are more stable, while others are affected more by their performance. And lastly, it actually needs to matter for top players. With stats being capped at 99, players who already have 99 in those stats get no bonus from high confidence. Confidence should be able to push stats over 99 for highly-rated players.

I understand where are you going and in theory it make sense. But in practice EA have been trying to make this "dynamic" ratings for a very long time and they never got it right. In most cases, like this year, they are making more harm than good.

most OS agree that Play now give us the best football experience we ever got from Madden. CFM is another story.

I guess you know by now how confidence works. I lost the first 2 games and my QB still got 9 confidences each game. because he "completed 3 passes", "got 2 first down" threw 1TD. etc But he also lost the game, he also threw 2 interceptions, he also did only 170yds, etc. It´s not balance.

Every player will get over 80 confidence by week 7, the system never go down, it always going up it´s not balance.

So, the best option is that, have options. Options to be turn this feature off and let me play the awesome gameplay that play now offered in CFM. Simple.

If you guys want to keep waiting for EA to get the "dynamic" ratings balance and correct, ok, but for those who played this game long enough and want to play a balance realistic football, let us turn that option off.

[teeteegardner]

wanted to add 2 things...

what if you dont achieve the drive goal? either by choice or by fault. edit: ok i see the goals are easy to achieve sometimes.. that just needs to be tuned to be more harder.. across the board.

second - if you play as 32 team control , does the confidence system still take place? either online or offline CFM...

[booker21]

Quote: Originally Posted by teeteegardner

wanted to add 2 things... what if you dont achieve the drive goal? either by choice or by fault. edit: ok i see the goals are easy to achieve sometimes.. that just needs to be tuned to be more harder.. across the board. second - if you play as 32 team control , does the confidence system still take place? either online or offline CFM...

I´m going to try the 32 team control but is a pain actually. But at this point i´m open to any ideas.

The goals are hard not to achieved. I never tried to achieved any goal, i have all UI disable and every time a game end i have easily 6 or 7 points for succeed goals. some are really impossible not to get. Like get 2 first down. or complete 3 passes in the drive or gain 20yds passing. You can´t game-plan in order to not complete the goal because that would be almost like having to punt on most downs

[bcruise]

Quote: Originally Posted by teeteegardner

wanted to add 2 things... what if you dont achieve the drive goal? either by choice or by fault. second - if you play as 32 team control , does the confidence system still take place? either online or offline CFM...

There is no penalty for failing a drive goal.

I don't play 32 team so I can't answer the 2nd one.