Question About Potential

[FadeEmAll]

Quote: Originally Posted by kcarr

A person's potential is a set factor that cannot change. This is true in real life just like in the video game. People's perception of a persons potential is what you are describing here. There is a major difference in these 2 things. As long as the ratings control how well a player performs and therefore the player's ability then in the game they are no longer a matter of perception but how good that player actually is within the confines of the game. Therefore they shouldn't change in the same manner as perceptions change.

However there's no way of knowing a person's potential in real life so there should be no way of knowing it in the game. All you can verify is the player's performance and hence stat based progression.

[kcarr]

Quote: Originally Posted by Megatron2k7

Well said. I agree. I've heard too many times now that overalls shouldn't matter if you can put up good stats with a player. This is false. When I play a franchise, I don't play ALL the games.... I simulate many games sometimes. In the games that are simulated, the cpu will deterimine the outcome of the game, as well as stats based on overall ratings. For the sake of simulating games, the overall ratings are very important. The more I think about this potential cap, the more I don't like it. I realize it probably needs to be in the game to limit the number of super stars we have in franchise mode, but I don't think it should be set in stone either. Players should be able to go above it if they are performing extremely well especially consistantly. My main problem is the fact that we can see the potential cap. No one can truly see what a persons potential is. People can take educated guesses at it, but no one knows. It's just not that easy. If it was so easy for scouts, coaches, and GM's to see an exact measurement of potential, then why was Kurt Warner bagging groceries and playing Arena football from 1994 -1996 after being cut by Green Bay....??? The Rams signed him in 1997, and sent him to play in NFL Europe for a season or two. 1999 he gets his chance to start only because of Trent Green's season ending injury. If the GM's in real life had a crystal ball to see Warner's potential, do you think any of this would have happened to him.....???......... Of course not. He would have been a starter in the league by 1996-1997 at the latest. Seeing the exact potential cap of all your players is like having supernatural powers to see the future. It's so fake it makes my brain hurt. I thought we were going in a sim direction for this game, not fantasy........???

I agree noone can see the actual potential of a player. Actually noone can see any of the exact abilities of a player, all they have is an educated guess, but there need to be rating for player abilities and potentials to determine how well they can play and how well they will be able to play. As long as these are the same ratings as are shown they need to be treated as the player's actualy abilities. This is why I have always been so strongly in favor of a new system where there is an unseen set of ratings that actually control a player and then a seperate set that are actually show and are used to determine value.

[red butler]

Coaches call high percentage completion plays to build a quarterbacks confidence and get them in the flow of a game. This should result in a temporary accuracy boost for that game. But to say that the quarterback will be more accurate for the rest of his life because I made an effort to call high completion % plays isn't sim to me. IRL some quarterbacks just aren't going to be accurate, no matter how many screens and slants they throw.

[bucky60]

Quote: Originally Posted by FadeEmAll

However there's no way of knowing a person's potential in real life so there should be no way of knowing it in the game. All you can verify is the player's performance and hence stat based progression.

Not knowing the potential and not having any potential are two different things. Everybody has a limit on their potential. The players in the video game should have limited potential. We, as players of the game should just not know what that exact potential is. Our scouts and Coaching staff should give us there best guess.

As far as Cassel exceeding his potential in stats. Why did he exceed that potential? Is it the system he's in, the coaching, are we controlling him so that he plays much better? Where the coaching staff and scouts wrong about his potential? Was his potential always higher and we got a more accurate accesment of his potential after some playing time?

Matt's progression should not be determined by what kind of stats we can get him. Matt's potential, coaching, mentoring of other players, work ethic, practice, playing experience and so on should determine his progression.

The only way you could get me to subscribe to stat-based progression is if I could control all 55 players on all teams so the progresion ends up fair (probably not so reasonable or balanced) for each and every player in the league. Otherwise skewing the progression of certain players pretty much invalidates a real franchise.

You also have the problem of counting on the game giving each position a fair and resonable amount of stats. There was one year that I got tired of drafting RE's. They never got sacks. The LE always got the sacks. The LE got all kinds of progression and the RE would always turn to doo-doo. I moved my stud LE to RE and my crap RE to LE and the stud LE turned to crap and the crap RE started to progess.

Stats based progression is just a lazy, crappy system to use.

[red butler]

[/code]

Quote: Originally Posted by bucky60

Not knowing the potential and not having any potential are two different things. Everybody has a limit on their potential. The players in the video game should have limited potential. We, as players of the game should just not know what that exact potential is. Our scouts and Coaching staff should give us there best guess. As far as Cassel exceeding his potential in stats. Why did he exceed that potential? Is it the system he's in, the coaching, are we controlling him so that he plays much better? Where the coaching staff and scouts wrong about his potential? Was his potential always higher and we got a more accurate accesment of his potential after some playing time? Matt's progression should not be determined by what kind of stats we can get him. Matt's potential, coaching, mentoring of other players, work ethic, practice, playing experience and so on should determine his progression. The only way you could get me to subscribe to stat-based progression is if I could control all 55 players on all teams so the progresion ends up fair (probably not so reasonable or balanced) for each and every player in the league. Otherwise skewing the progression of certain players pretty much invalidates a real franchise. You also have the problem of counting on the game giving each position a fair and resonable amount of stats. There was one year that I got tired of drafting RE's. They never got sacks. The LE always got the sacks. The LE got all kinds of progression and the RE would always turn to doo-doo. I moved my stud LE to RE and my crap RE to LE and the stud LE turned to crap and the crap RE started to progess. Stats based progression is just a lazy, crappy system to use.

I agree completely. I'm starting to think that guys who want stats based progression don't want to play the game within the physical limitations of the players on the field. If I can improve Rex Grossman's accuracy by calling high percentage throws, there's a problem. If I do that long enough he will be able to make all the throws, not just the high percentage one's. If it was that easy, the Bears would have done that instead of trading their future for the chance to have a franchise quarterback.

[red butler]

Double Post

[stux]

I think there should be a small potential increase through the course of a players career IF:

He plays well on a BAD team
Has good coaching

If you but an average RB of say potential of 85 on a GREAT team he may put up better number then what his ratings would suggest. He might even do that for several years BUT still remain and average back on any other team.

The team has to have something to do with it otherwise great offensive teams will just pump out great RB after great RB no matter what their potential truly was.