IDK about you guys, but ACE doesn't work at all for me.

[JoFri]

Quote: Originally Posted by youALREADYknow

3. The Run Plays logic is preset to only run plays for the perceived "star" players when the base Series execution finally ends. That means the Touches tendencies are virtually useless in this game with ACE turned On. It's realistic for some teams/coaches as they want the ball in their stars hands, but it removes so much diversity in play style that it makes the play calling predictable and boring after a few games with a team whose star tends to run either Iso or Post based play types.

Are u referring to Cpu or User? If Cpu, this was what I noticed too. I was playing against the Cpu wolves. The Cpu had Butler and KAT with similar Touches tendency but the Cpu ran the play mostly through Butler in the first quarter. When there's a broken play, the Cpu put the ball in Butler's hands too. That was custom HOF mode.

Quote:

If we had front-end options for editing any of these, then this wouldn't be a problem. If I'm ever able to get in anyone's ear at 2K/VC, then it's what I would push for. There are so many plays and Series available to run in this game, but the CPU/AI refuses to run more than a few each game. They even advertised on the gameplay blog that we would have a deeper execution of plays in the playbook, but the way ACE is configured prevents us from seeing how deep this system actually is.

Disagree with 'Cpu running a few plays'. There was a variation of plays ran through Butler, and I posted the video clip in another thread earlier.
On the other hand. Czar also confirmed that Series is not tied to any team for now, so I dont expect the Cpu to run any Series actions.
To me, 'Series' is a set of plays designed to trick the defense, having to assume the offense running the same play again but a different action set at some point out of the base set. I definitely didnt notice this yet vs the Cpu.

Back to OP topic, I think it really depends on the individual playing style. If u like running the Series, Ace will track the success rate of the execution. If the shot quality was good or the shot was made, the same action in the Series will keep running until u stop it.
I confirm this is happening in the game.




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[youALREADYknow]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoFri

Disagree with 'Cpu running a few plays'. There was a variation of plays ran through Butler, and I posted the video clip in another thread earlier.

Czar already confirmed in a 2K19 video on YouTube that ACE is set to run around 60% of plays out of a team's Series/Freelance depending on the quarter. If you test this with Playcalling Messages ON and ACE ON, then this is easy to confirm. I'd estimate it's around 40% of the offense in an entire game being run through Series/Freelance and it does not depend on the Run Plays coaching slider at all. After that it's basic math to see the impact.

If you play on 12 min quarters, then teams are averaging around 100 possessions per game. Teams are making 45-50% of their shots and another 10% of possessions end at the free throw line or with a dead ball. That's 60% of the offense (or 60 plays per game) coming out of half court sets. If 40% of those half court sets (24 plays) are Series/Freelance as controlled by ACE, then that leaves 36 plays to be called out of the team's playbook.

Czar also stated in his video that the default ACE setting for most teams is to run plays for the #1/2 options on the floor. This is also easy to confirm as the Touches tendency does not spread play calls around the floor with ACE turned ON. On a team with established stars that doesn't use the bench a lot (i.e. not the Nets with 9 guys getting 20+ minutes), this means 3-5 players per game will get actual plays called for them out of those 36 set plays. There's not much variation in those plays, especially not if any of them are running Isolation plays. If the two lead players on the team are both similar players (think CP3/Harden, Lillard/McCollum) then they will typically alternate running the same plays but with different play initiators. There are only 4-8 plays per play type in most playbooks so it's going to get repetitive with only a couple of players deciding which plays get called. Substitution patterns matter too because mass subs will reduce the possible lineup combinations to bring new guys into lead scoring roles.

I'm seeing 10-12 different set plays called per game on 12 min quarters with ACE turned ON, up to 18-20 different set plays called if the team has a Series in their default config. With ACE turned OFF, I'm seeing over 25 different plays called each game and can still call Series during timeouts to bring that up to 30+.

In addition, the ACE system triggers the same exact sequence every single game. You can test this with the Rockets and they will run 21 Delay (used to be Point) for the first 6 minutes of every single game no matter what. They follow this with Harden/CP3 Isolation on default rosters (assigned play types in custom rosters) until the bench takes over and then switching back to 21 Delay and repeating this cycle until the game is over. The play calling itself is static for large chunks of the game with branching options on each play for passes/actions in Freelance.

Each team has 50 plays in the playbook and another 20+ plays/options added through Series/Freelance. There's no reason we should be seeing the same game script most games, but Czar probably hasn't pushed his updates to the roster yet and we're still playing a half-finished product.

I'm not posting this to talk down on the ACE system as a whole, just to say that the version that shipped doesn't seem to be game-ready yet and there's no ability to turn it OFF for the CPU. This feature should be the future of 2K's AI system so we need to have ways to give feedback that can be rolled into future versions or the ability to customize the config without having to hound Czar on social media.

[JoFri]

Quote: Originally Posted by youALREADYknow

Spoiler Czar already confirmed in a 2K19 video on YouTube that ACE is set to run around 60% of plays out of a team's Series/Freelance depending on the quarter. If you test this with Playcalling Messages ON and ACE ON, then this is easy to confirm. I'd estimate it's around 40% of the offense in an entire game being run through Series/Freelance and it does not depend on the Run Plays coaching slider at all. After that it's basic math to see the impact. If you play on 12 min quarters, then teams are averaging around 100 possessions per game. Teams are making 45-50% of their shots and another 10% of possessions end at the free throw line or with a dead ball. That's 60% of the offense (or 60 plays per game) coming out of half court sets. If 40% of those half court sets (24 plays) are Series/Freelance as controlled by ACE, then that leaves 36 plays to be called out of the team's playbook. Czar also stated in his video that the default ACE setting for most teams is to run plays for the #1/2 options on the floor. This is also easy to confirm as the Touches tendency does not spread play calls around the floor with ACE turned ON. On a team with established stars that doesn't use the bench a lot (i.e. not the Nets with 9 guys getting 20+ minutes), this means 3-5 players per game will get actual plays called for them out of those 36 set plays. There's not much variation in those plays, especially not if any of them are running Isolation plays. If the two lead players on the team are both similar players (think CP3/Harden, Lillard/McCollum) then they will typically alternate running the same plays but with different play initiators. There are only 4-8 plays per play type in most playbooks so it's going to get repetitive with only a couple of players deciding which plays get called. Substitution patterns matter too because mass subs will reduce the possible lineup combinations to bring new guys into lead scoring roles. I'm seeing 10-12 different set plays called per game on 12 min quarters with ACE turned ON, up to 18-20 different set plays called if the team has a Series in their default config. With ACE turned OFF, I'm seeing over 25 different plays called each game and can still call Series during timeouts to bring that up to 30+. In addition, the ACE system triggers the same exact sequence every single game. You can test this with the Rockets and they will run 21 Delay (used to be Point) for the first 6 minutes of every single game no matter what. They follow this with Harden/CP3 Isolation on default rosters (assigned play types in custom rosters) until the bench takes over and then switching back to 21 Delay and repeating this cycle until the game is over. The play calling itself is static for large chunks of the game with branching options on each play for passes/actions in Freelance. Each team has 50 plays in the playbook and another 20+ plays/options added through Series/Freelance. There's no reason we should be seeing the same game script most games, but Czar probably hasn't pushed his updates to the roster yet and we're still playing a half-finished product. I'm not posting this to talk down on the ACE system as a whole, just to say that the version that shipped doesn't seem to be game-ready yet and there's no ability to turn it OFF for the CPU. This feature should be the future of 2K's AI system so we need to have ways to give feedback that can be rolled into future versions or the ability to customize the config without having to hound Czar on social media.

Are u talking about user or cpu?




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[youALREADYknow]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoFri

Are u talking about user or cpu?

ACE is always ON for the CPU. I'm talking about the difference in Auto play calling for the User with ACE ON/OFF.

[JoFri]

Quote: Originally Posted by youALREADYknow

ACE is always ON for the CPU. I'm talking about the difference in Auto play calling for the User with ACE ON/OFF.

Autoplay does not call a series for user. Period.


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[youALREADYknow]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoFri

Autoplay does not call a series for user. Period.

We're talking semantics here. Autoplay calls the team's base Freelance set to start every game. The 2K19 official gameplay blog stated the following:

Quote:

"Our freelance tech has matured to the point where it is has become an infrastructure and now a freelance can be anything we want it to be. In an effort to provide users with more current freelance types. We took what sets, series, or actions teams like to run and turned them into seven brand new modern freelances."

For example, the Rockets will run 21 Delay for the first 6 minutes of every game on 12 minute quarters with ACE turned ON and Auto Play Calling.

These are branching freelance sets with the same exact sequences of action as the 21 Delay Series. The only difference I'm seeing is the order of the first action in a Series (multiple initiators) vs Freelance which kicks off from where the ball handler enters the half court set.

[Impetuous65]

Quote: Originally Posted by JoFri

Autoplay does not call a series for user. Period. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't think that's true, Da_Czar c stated if you have play call on auto and he has set a team profile, if a team runs a certain series he will put it in the game as part of their offense, If you play as Boston, and have auto play on you will get a series/freelance and plays.

[JoFri]

Quote: Originally Posted by Impetuous65

I don't think that's true, Da_Czar c stated if you have play call on auto and he has set a team profile, if a team runs a certain series he will put it in the game as part of their offense, If you play as Boston, and have auto play on you will get a series/freelance and plays.

My bad. Thanks for correcting me. I seldom play on auto play call, but once awhile when I do so, I didnt see any at all. Am running the Bucks. Maybe that hasnt been added bcos preseason hadnt started yet back then. He need some time to scout.

I'm hearing Rockets on 21 Delay. Can we list it somewhere in the thread so we can reference to?

To the OP, which team are u running?


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