2018-2019 Hot Stove Thread

[Jr.]

I understand why the players would strike and don't have any problem with it. The current CBA isn't working and needs some pretty major adjustments.

[SPTO]

Quote: Originally Posted by Jr.

I understand why the players would strike and don't have any problem with it. The current CBA isn't working and needs some pretty major adjustments.

The CBA has actually been quite beneficial for both sides. It's only been in the last 2-3 years where owners and front offices have been manipulating the rules to their advantage and the lack of owners going crazy with long term crazy money contracts which has been exposing some of the warts of the CBA (at least for players)

I can understand why players are frustrated and want to strike but it's not like they're being COMPLETELY screwed. It's clear that there's a market correction and that players are paying the price for it but it's not like they're hurting for money either. Let's face it, the age of the insane big money deal is over and players are going to adjust.

Long term deals have never worked out to any great degree and honestly, I don't understand why players are so willing to die on that hill. If you don't think you can play yourself to a pretty good contract the next time around than you really need to check yourself. The lack of confidence and security that way is pretty telling.

[CMH]

Quote: Originally Posted by WaitTilNextYear

Saw this on Cubs dot com re: Brad Brach's free agency experience... Holy strike, Batman!

Doesn't Brach's account of free agency ignore the work of his agent who is likely telling teams the figures Brach would sign for?

If every team receives a range then it's very likely every team that responds would have offered him similar dollars.

This isn't collusion. This is negotiations.

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[DamnYanks2]

Quote: Originally Posted by SPTO

The CBA has actually been quite beneficial for both sides. It's only been in the last 2-3 years where owners and front offices have been manipulating the rules to their advantage and the lack of owners going crazy with long term crazy money contracts which has been exposing some of the warts of the CBA (at least for players) I can understand why players are frustrated and want to strike but it's not like they're being COMPLETELY screwed. It's clear that there's a market correction and that players are paying the price for it but it's not like they're hurting for money either. Let's face it, the age of the insane big money deal is over and players are going to adjust. Long term deals have never worked out to any great degree and honestly, I don't understand why players are so willing to die on that hill. If you don't think you can play yourself to a pretty good contract the next time around than you really need to check yourself. The lack of confidence and security that way is pretty telling.

You hit it right on the head. Owners are greedy. No doubt. But fans are so weary of these long term contracts because they never ever work out.

So I think alot of fans are siding with owners on that. I don't want any more 10 year contracts for my team.

I'd be fine giving Harper or Machado a 5 or 6 year 250 mil contract or around there. But I don't want you for ten years.

Shorter contracts with player friendly figures are the way to go.

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[DieHardYankee26]

If it couldn't be proven that Barry Bonds was colluded against, we might as well just bury the word collusion. No need to even go down that road. I think it's also fair to assume, based on this offseason, that the offers were not in the range he would've offered. So it would still be weird to tell everyone you want 3/30 and they all come back with 1/6.

Quote: Originally Posted by SPTO

The CBA has actually been quite beneficial for both sides. It's only been in the last 2-3 years where owners and front offices have been manipulating the rules to their advantage and the lack of owners going crazy with long term crazy money contracts which has been exposing some of the warts of the CBA (at least for players)

The current CBA has only been in effect since 2017.

[BigOscar]

Some people are far too hung up on the 10 year deals, that's not really the issue in the market. The issue is the 3, 4 or 5 year deals for good players have all but disappeared.

How many multiyear deals have free agents got this year? Barely any, owners know that they can get away with giving players a low ball 1 year deal and that there just isn't enough competition in the market to force them to do any better than that. Supply has outstripped demand as so many teams are happy to just suck and so many teams are happy to save money rather than actually improve their team.

Look at someone Mike Moustakas as the prime example. Good but not elite player, well above average, decent age. Can't get a multiyear deal, two years in a row. Jonathon Schoop, 26 year old free agent with a 5 WAR season the year before last, signs a one year deal for barely anything as there is nothing out there. These are guys who'd be getting 3 or 4 years of decent money in the past, but now there is so few teams interested in actually competing that they are having to settle for terrible short term deals.

Meanwhile what happens to all the extra money the teams are saving? Is it passed onto the fans in the form of cheaper tickets, lower price of TV? Hell no, straight in the owners pockets. Most owners are parasites that do nothing for the game except take money out of it, no idea why anyone would take their side, ever.

[Master Live 013]

The problem is the incentives. The owners don't like they have to compete to make money. And they don't.

Change the incentives.

[CMH]

Quote: Originally Posted by DieHardYankee26

If it couldn't be proven that Barry Bonds was colluded against, we might as well just bury the word collusion. No need to even go down that road. I think it's also fair to assume, based on this offseason, that the offers were not in the range he would've offered. So it would still be weird to tell everyone you want 3/30 and they all come back with 1/6. .

You're right. I think Brach's story is missing elements to understand what really happened with his free agency.

He fails to say what his team was looking for, and he fails to acknowledge that his agent was out there discussing terms with teams.

There's more to the story than what is written which is to imply that teams were clever to collude on a salary figure for him but stupid enough do it at the same time.

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