itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Sliders

[The_Gryphon75]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

At this page, you can found all the stats about my test matches. The Italy Clan Test Match. For the Spreadsheet of all stats i still take time
I'm around 10 matches (well, I know to have so little time for playing, but the hours of a day should be 48 to do all I have to)
The last two I won with a shoutout and a HR in the 11th.
So emotionals, for me.
The CPU hits very well, it's AVG now is increasing to .208 (.252 real MLB). Still too low but I think that in a bit of games it could to be realistic.
From the side of pitching, I am too low with Runs (and ER) and BB. for both.
For hits I'm well on all stats (except R and RBI obviously)
I'm very low on Steal Attempts by CPU, very low. Maybe I should increasing the Baserunner Steal Frequency to 8 ?
For the rest I continue with my test match. But I think that this is the way for having a realistic game even this year.
Ah, I've made a little paper with players of all teams and their feature for hitting, so I can use the schemes for Classic Pitching for helping me in the games. I must say that I am finding them very useful and very relevant to the batting situations. Obviously they will change from pitcher to pitcher and from batter to batter but at the moment they seem very fitting

[lere2001]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

I noticed a certain wrong in the era calculating after a match.
ERA is calculated with formula 9*(ER/IP), it's right ?
So if I Pitch 0.2 inning with 2 ER, the sum for ERA will be 90.00 ? Not 27.00, right ?
Or I'm wrong ?

No, it's 27.00

You need to count what we call 0.2 of an inning as 0.6666666 of an inning in the formula, since 2 out of 3 outs have already happened.

[lere2001]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

At this page, you can found all the stats about my test matches. The Italy Clan Test Match. For the Spreadsheet of all stats i still take time
I'm around 10 matches (well, I know to have so little time for playing, but the hours of a day should be 48 to do all I have to)
The last two I won with a shoutout and a HR in the 11th.
So emotionals, for me.
The CPU hits very well, it's AVG now is increasing to .208 (.252 real MLB). Still too low but I think that in a bit of games it could to be realistic.
From the side of pitching, I am too low with Runs (and ER) and BB. for both.
For hits I'm well on all stats (except R and RBI obviously)
I'm very low on Steal Attempts by CPU, very low. Maybe I should increasing the Baserunner Steal Frequency to 8 ?
For the rest I continue with my test match. But I think that this is the way for having a realistic game even this year.
Ah, I've made a little paper with players of all teams and their feature for hitting, so I can use the schemes for Classic Pitching for helping me in the games. I must say that I am finding them very useful and very relevant to the batting situations. Obviously they will change from pitcher to pitcher and from batter to batter but at the moment they seem very fitting

I think your fielder reaction and speed being so high is making CPU AVG come down. There's no way to hit the ball over their head or loop it down the line with your settings. I still see smooth animations at 4/4 that play better IMO

[The_Gryphon75]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

No, it's 27.00

You need to count what we call 0.2 of an inning as 0.6666666 of an inning in the formula, since 2 out of 3 outs have already happened.

you are right. stupid me

[The Kid 24]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

Lastly, I've tested the Stamina/Manager Hook sliders that @thekid24 suggested, and the Manager Hook reared its ugly head two games in a row. The first game of the Pirates series (which I won 5-1), they pulled their starter in the 5th inning for literally NO REASON. At that point, they were only losing 2-1, and at the time they pulled the pitcher, MY PITCHER WAS UP TO BAT. It didn't have anything to do with a matchup, and the situation didn't dictate him being pulled either. Coincidentally, I ended up putting up three runs against the reliever who replaced him, resulting in the final score of 5-1. This second game, the Pirates were winning 2-1 in the heading into the sixth inning. To my surprise, I saw them warming up two relievers in the 'pen. Didn't make much sense to me, since the starter was pretty much cruising through my lineup. Wasn't DOMINATING, by any stretch, but he definitely had me off-balance, relatively low pitch count, and I wasn't really mounting much offense. When he came up to bat in the top of the 6th, they let him bat, and I thought, "Cool. They're keeping him in." Then, they brought the reliever in in the bottom of the 6th. The switch literally made NO SENSE at all. In real life, there's no way that would happen to a pitcher who wasn't on a pitch count, or who wasn't injured.

That's enough of that nonsense. I'm moving Manager Hook back to 4. The horrible decision-making by the CPU is squarely because of the Manager Hook slider, and it's obvious those head-scratching decisions affect starters more than relievers. I can't live with those types of decisions over the course of a full season, though. I can get down with the theory that the Stamina Sliders affect the way the CPU manages the bullpen, and I'll continue testing that. But having the Manager Hook that high does not factor into that equation, in my opinion.

I doubt I'll test anymore today. Kinda need to step away from the game for awhile.

Thanks for testing bud! I will definitely be rolling with your sliders in the OP then.

[tonyfire2001]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

Itbeme,

He disregard all my stats, they were wrong...I was playing the a’s vs twins, and I noticed I was striking out a lot of twins, which i figure that was normal, but my wife went by and said you are doing Fantastic there is something wrong with your setting...I thought man woman I am just that damn good at this game. But curiosity got me and I check and sure enough pitching was at All-star...DAMN WOMAN WAS RIGHT!!!!....

Anyway, if have to delete that stat base...

Well back to the drawing board but hey I’m just glad she caught it...

[itbeme23]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

Game 2:

HUM: 1 9 2
CPU: 7 9 1

CPU Offense:
1B: 8
2B: 0
3B: 0
HR: 1

Batting Average: 9/33 (.273)
Walks: 2
Strikeouts: 6

HUM Offense:
1B: 6
2B: 2
3B: 0
HR: 1

Batting Average: 9/35 (.257)
Walks: 0
Strikeouts: 5

Notes:
Yikes

Game 1:

HUM: 6 11 0 (1 but errors arent counted properly)
CPU: 5 9 0

CPU Offense:
1B: 6
2B: 2
3B: 0
HR: 1

Batting Average: 9/35 (.257)
Walks: 1
Strikeouts: 11

HUM Offense:
1B: 7
2B: 1
3B: 0
HR: 3

Batting Average: 11/36 (.306)
Walks: 2
Strikeouts: 7

Notes:
I am a big time power team. I am also facing one of the ALs best offenses.
Two deflected hits (one from each side). One made diving play.

Interesting stats, man. Thanks for posting. At first glance, these would show an uptick in CPU offense, which is kind of what we're searching for. The stats in your first game look pretty good, but given your comment in the notes on the second game, I was wondering if you could give some more details on your experience. Do you feel we're on the right track? Any other suggestions?

Let me know.

[itbeme23]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

Thanks for testing bud! I will definitely be rolling with your sliders in the OP then.

Yeah, dude. I still appreciate the insight, and I think there is some legitimacy to the Stamina sliders affecting the way the CPU manages their bullpen. HOWEVER, the Manager Hook theory just doesn't seem to have enough legs to sustain over the course of the entire season, especially when they make HORRIBLE decisions within the first two games of testing.

[The Kid 24]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

Yeah, dude. I still appreciate the insight, and I think there is some legitimacy to the Stamina sliders affecting the way the CPU manages their bullpen. HOWEVER, the Manager Hook theory just doesn't seem to have enough legs to sustain over the course of the entire season, especially when they make HORRIBLE decisions within the first two games of testing.

Yep agreed, so you gonna test CPU stamina sliders then? I think I read that you were doing that.

Curious to see what you come up with.

[itbeme23]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

So, being that we're in full on testing mode, trying to figure out the CPU hitting, I went down the rabbit hole in other slider threads.

Have you guys noticed that nearly EVERY slider thread has the CPU Hitting sliders near default? Doesn't really matter which interface is being used, nor does difficulty level seem to matter either.

What that illustrates, in my opinion, is the amount of influence of the CONTACT SLIDER. Think about it, we only have Contact down one click from default, and we have Solid Hits nearly maxed out. In previous iterations of the game, just the fact that SH is so high would result in overpowered CPU offense, regardless of where Contact was set at. It's always been my belief, and my testing would confirm, that Contact affects the CPU's ability to make contact with the ball (as well as swings/misses). It also affects their aggressiveness early in the count (this has something to do with the way SDS has coded hitter's logic, in my opinion). Up until this year's game, I've always believed that the Contact slider only had MARGINAL effect on overall offensive output (because Solid Hits had the most).

Now, it seems the amount of influence of these sliders is seemingly reversed. Based on what other slider guys are doing (Armor, Mike Lowe, and JoshC), we can deduce Contact has more impact on CPU offensive output than Solid Hits. These guys know what they're doing, so I don't think it's a coincidence that all of them have CPU Contact set at or near default.

I'm going to continue testing our sliders for another 3 games to see if there is any consistency in CPU output, and I would encourage you guys to do the same, if you're up for it. If we can get 10 test games between us, we should know if we're on the right track or not.

Contact: 4
Power: 3
Timing: 5
Solid Hits: 9
Foul Frequency: 5

HOWEVER, if there isn't enough of a feeling that we're on the right track, we're going back to the drawing board. I'm not a big fan of forcing square pegs into round holes, or beating my head against the wall.

If these final test games don't yield the results we're looking for, I'm going to start with CPU hitting sliders back at default and work from there. My initial thought is Power will still need to be at 3 to balance the OP home runs. To combat the anticipated dip in CPU K/rate (with Contact at default), we will likely need to decrease the Timing slider, which is something I hate doing because it's really tough to gauge Timing's effect in-game. Solid Hits would be the wild card value, as I think that decreased Timing will ultimately have a negative effect on the CPU offensive output as a whole.

Would love to hear your thoughts on this.

Cheers.

[itbeme23]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

Yep agreed, so you gonna test CPU stamina sliders then? I think I read that you were doing that.

Curious to see what you come up with.

Rolling with CPU Stamina sliders at 7, per your previous post. Again, all we can hope for is the CPU makes reasonable decisions with them set at that level. If they start leaving relievers in too long, then I'll likely make a change. Other than that, I don't really know what to look for in testing that theory.

[Rmiok222]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

So, being that we're in full on testing mode, trying to figure out the CPU hitting, I went down the rabbit hole in other slider threads.



Have you guys noticed that nearly EVERY slider thread has the CPU Hitting sliders near default? Doesn't really matter which interface is being used, nor does difficulty level seem to matter either.



What that illustrates, in my opinion, is the amount of influence of the CONTACT SLIDER. Think about it, we only have Contact down one click from default, and we have Solid Hits nearly maxed out. In previous iterations of the game, just the fact that SH is so high would result in overpowered CPU offense, regardless of where Contact was set at. It's always been my belief, and my testing would confirm, that Contact affects the CPU's ability to make contact with the ball (as well as swings/misses). It also affects their aggressiveness early in the count (this has something to do with the way SDS has coded hitter's logic, in my opinion). Up until this year's game, I've always believed that the Contact slider only had MARGINAL effect on overall offensive output (because Solid Hits had the most).



Now, it seems the amount of influence of these sliders is seemingly reversed. Based on what other slider guys are doing (Armor, Mike Lowe, and JoshC), we can deduce Contact has more impact on CPU offensive output than Solid Hits. These guys know what they're doing, so I don't think it's a coincidence that all of them have CPU Contact set at or near default.



I'm going to continue testing our sliders for another 3 games to see if there is any consistency in CPU output, and I would encourage you guys to do the same, if you're up for it. If we can get 10 test games between us, we should know if we're on the right track or not.



Contact: 4

Power: 3

Timing: 5

Solid Hits: 9

Foul Frequency: 5



HOWEVER, if there isn't enough of a feeling that we're on the right track, we're going back to the drawing board. I'm not a big fan of forcing square pegs into round holes, or beating my head against the wall.



If these final test games don't yield the results we're looking for, I'm going to start with CPU hitting sliders back at default and work from there. My initial thought is Power will still need to be at 3 to balance the OP home runs. To combat the anticipated dip in CPU K/rate (with Contact at default), we will likely need to decrease the Timing slider, which is something I hate doing because it's really tough to gauge Timing's effect in-game. Solid Hits would be the wild card value, as I think that decreased Timing will ultimately have a negative effect on the CPU offensive output as a whole.



Would love to hear your thoughts on this.



Cheers.

Damn it you’re right. I wish I didn’t read this[emoji23] but you’re right. I’ve been rolling with contact at 3. Cpu is a lot less aggressive but I’ve been getting realistic stats. I’m curious about your theory now.


Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

[JoshC1977]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

So, being that we're in full on testing mode, trying to figure out the CPU hitting, I went down the rabbit hole in other slider threads.

Have you guys noticed that nearly EVERY slider thread has the CPU Hitting sliders near default? Doesn't really matter which interface is being used, nor does difficulty level seem to matter either.

What that illustrates, in my opinion, is the amount of influence of the CONTACT SLIDER. Think about it, we only have Contact down one click from default, and we have Solid Hits nearly maxed out. In previous iterations of the game, just the fact that SH is so high would result in overpowered CPU offense, regardless of where Contact was set at. It's always been my belief, and my testing would confirm, that Contact affects the CPU's ability to make contact with the ball (as well as swings/misses). It also affects their aggressiveness early in the count (this has something to do with the way SDS has coded hitter's logic, in my opinion). Up until this year's game, I've always believed that the Contact slider only had MARGINAL effect on overall offensive output (because Solid Hits had the most).

Now, it seems the amount of influence of these sliders is seemingly reversed. Based on what other slider guys are doing (Armor, Mike Lowe, and JoshC), we can deduce Contact has more impact on CPU offensive output than Solid Hits. These guys know what they're doing, so I don't think it's a coincidence that all of them have CPU Contact set at or near default.

I'm going to continue testing our sliders for another 3 games to see if there is any consistency in CPU output, and I would encourage you guys to do the same, if you're up for it. If we can get 10 test games between us, we should know if we're on the right track or not.

Contact: 4
Power: 3
Timing: 5
Solid Hits: 9
Foul Frequency: 5

HOWEVER, if there isn't enough of a feeling that we're on the right track, we're going back to the drawing board. I'm not a big fan of forcing square pegs into round holes, or beating my head against the wall.

If these final test games don't yield the results we're looking for, I'm going to start with CPU hitting sliders back at default and work from there. My initial thought is Power will still need to be at 3 to balance the OP home runs. To combat the anticipated dip in CPU K/rate (with Contact at default), we will likely need to decrease the Timing slider, which is something I hate doing because it's really tough to gauge Timing's effect in-game. Solid Hits would be the wild card value, as I think that decreased Timing will ultimately have a negative effect on the CPU offensive output as a whole.

Would love to hear your thoughts on this.

Cheers.

I read other threads too

I think your observation is spot-on here about the contact slider. CPU hitting IS better this year by default and interestingly, the solid hits slider at default has produced a far better variety of outcomes....this is the first year I have no inclination of dropping it a notch to reduce the steady influx of non-stop line drives.

Can I offer a thought? Pay really close attention to the impacts of the user pitch control slider on CPU hitting (specifically, their tendencies on borderline pitches). I actually INCREASED the user (and CPU - but that was to improve their AI) control sliders to 6. On the user side, I'm seeing increased walk and K-rates (as well as a decrease in strike percentage - which IIRC is a big peeve of yours). The reason, pitches on the edge aren't drifting as much. So, instead of missing 6 inches outside (and often inducing a swing-miss) or getting hung and screwing up the CPUs bat placement, you miss by a couple of inches and the CPU is more apt to hold on that pitch. It builds up pitch counts in ABs which spills into all other areas of the game.

Now...I'm quite sensitive to the fact that you have other values which may (or may not) have impacts on those outcomes (I'm usually hesitant to offer my thoughts in other threads for that reason, but I think I "get" what you're gunning for and it may be compatible). So, I'm definitely not saying it WILL work for you, but if you're looking at a different approach; you might want to give that a try and see if it compliments your other settings.

Hope you don't mind my butting-in here, but I LOVE chatting about this game

[tonyfire2001]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

Game 1

Slider changes that I did
CPU starter Stamina 7
CPU Reliever Stamina 7
CPU Manager Hook 6
CPU Strike Frequency 5

Ok I went what the Kid suggested from an another forum to test it out, but with the Higher stamina I am trying the lower Strike Frequency cause the First Pitch strikes we’re off the hook hovering around 80%, just testing this out..

Game 1
Twins vs A’s
Berrios vs Manaea

Twins 6 8 2
A’s 8 12 0

Twins hitting
2B: Donaldson (1), Sano (1)
HR: Donaldson (1), Garver 2 (2), Sano (1)
154 pitches 23 fouled

Twins pitching
Berrios 7.0 Ip 3 H 2 R 2Er 2 BB 8k
Duffey. 0.1 ip 3 h 3 r 3 er 1 bb 0k
May 0.2 ip 1 h 0 r 0 er 1 bb 0 k
Rogers 1.0 Ip 3 h 1 r 1 er 0 bb 1 k
Clippard 1.0 Ip 2 h 2 r 2 er 0 bb 1k

This game was hard. The Twins were swinging like the Twins 4 Hr this game, Berrios held me with no hits through 5, then I broke out and scored 2. Before that the twins were up 3-0 from back to back home runs in the 1st from Garver and Sano. When the 6th inning hit all heck broke loose again, Home runs from Garver again, and Donaldson.

Finally, from the 8th inning on, my bats finally came alive. Scoring 3 in the 8th to be down by 1 run and in the 9th was able to tie it up...the Game finally ended in the 11th with Laureano walk off 2 run bomb….

[itbeme23]

Re: itbeme23 The Show 20 "The Stats Approach" A.S. Directional/HOF Classic Sim Slider

I read other threads too

I think your observation is spot-on here about the contact slider. CPU hitting IS better this year by default and interestingly, the solid hits slider at default has produced a far better variety of outcomes....this is the first year I have no inclination of dropping it a notch to reduce the steady influx of non-stop line drives.

Can I offer a thought? Pay really close attention to the impacts of the user pitch control slider on CPU hitting (specifically, their tendencies on borderline pitches). I actually INCREASED the user (and CPU - but that was to improve their AI) control sliders to 6. On the user side, I'm seeing increased walk and K-rates (as well as a decrease in strike percentage - which IIRC is a big peeve of yours). The reason, pitches on the edge aren't drifting as much. So, instead of missing 6 inches outside (and often inducing a swing-miss) or getting hung and screwing up the CPUs bat placement, you miss by a couple of inches and the CPU is more apt to hold on that pitch. It builds up pitch counts in ABs which spills into all other areas of the game.

Now...I'm quite sensitive to the fact that you have other values which may (or may not) have impacts on those outcomes (I'm usually hesitant to offer my thoughts in other threads for that reason, but I think I "get" what you're gunning for and it may be compatible). So, I'm definitely not saying it WILL work for you, but if you're looking at a different approach; you might want to give that a try and see if it compliments your other settings.

Hope you don't mind my butting-in here, but I LOVE chatting about this game

Thanks for chiming in, Josh. I really appreciate your insight. I think part of the difficulty I'm having right now is due to the fact that I've used previous understandings of the sliders (specifically Contact) and applied them to this game. While most of my approaches have held true to this year's game, the CPU hitting sliders have DEFINITELY not. I can't remember the last time I've had CPU Contact at default, and I've been creating my own slider sets for the better part of the past seven years. To a certain extent, I think I've stubbornly resisted setting Contact at default for that very reason, because it requires me to go back to the drawing board, which as you know, can have a cascading effect on other areas of the game. I'm currently happy with most other aspects of my set, and I think that's why I have a reluctance to deviate from my approach. I don't want to change one area of the game, only to have it negatively affect another, because that's what will lead to slider-itis.

Very interesting approach with the Pitcher Control sliders. I've taken a different approach, but I think with the same goal. I accomplished better CPU pitcher performance by increasing Strike Frequency. It's produced noticeable improvement in starter performance (i.e. longer outings), and strike percentages have been in realistic ranges. However, you bring up a good point about user K rates, as I'm an extremely patient hitter, so my strikeout numbers always err on the low side. I actually lead the league in least amount of strikeouts in my Dodgers franchise. I've always wanted to try to increase my amount of Ks per game, but I haven't wanted to change my user hitting sliders, because they've produced realistic stats pretty much top to bottom. Perhaps your Control slider increase approach can help.

Thanks for the input. Any other suggestions or feedback you have, please feel free to chime in!