The Hot Stove League Thread

[12]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

In all honesty, how much closer do you think you'll get to the play offs with Felix? I know he's an icon in Seattle but if you aren't winning with him why not trade him and get some huge pieces back? I doubt he's going to resign when his contract's up anyway, you could get some serious prospects for him.

I think the Mariners can become competitive when some of ours guys develop. I know that's not a sure thing but a trio of Ackley, Montero and Smoak is exciting to build around. Who's to say that the M's can't become competitive in the AL West in the next couple of years? Felix, by all accounts, loves Seattle and has said repeatedly that he would resign after his current deal expires. Of course, that could just be him playing the PR game, but I think he might be genuine with his words when he says that.

The M's will have some $ to spend with the expiring contracts of Ichiro and Figgins coming off of the books...

This is a city that has lost their three biggest baseball stars over the past 12 years and the fan base would be extremely pissed off if Felix was moved for prospects.

[12]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

What if you got a package of Matt Harrison, Mike Olt, Tanner Scheppers, and either Rougned Odor or Neil Ramirez?

No thanks.

Do you think that's a better package than what the Yankees supposedly offered in Montero, Betances, Banuelos and another prospect (can't remember who that was at the moment)?

If we trade Felix, they have to get a legit, MLB proven offensive talent and prospects. Prospects aren't enough, and that's why he probably won't be dealt. The M's asking price is ridiculous and they feel like they're not in a position to settle for anything less than what they feel will help soften the blow of trading another Mariner icon.

[CabreraMVP]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

Wait...did you just acknowledge someone other than Verlander is the best pitcher in baseball? Won't they make you turn in your Tiger's homer card for that?

I've never thought Verlander was the best...I gave him credit for his great '11 season but Hernandez was hands down better in 2008, 2009, and 2010. His ERA was a full run lower in 2 of those years. I've thought Felix was the best pitcher in the AL since the 08 season but people rarely agree.

I would take Hernandez over Verlander every single time. I would trade them straight up tonight.

[Perfect Zero]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

No thanks.

Do you think that's a better package than what the Yankees supposedly offered in Montero, Betances, Banuelos and another prospect (can't remember who that was at the moment)?

If we trade Felix, they have to get a legit, MLB proven offensive talent and prospects. Prospects aren't enough, and that's why he probably won't be dealt. The M's asking price is ridiculous and they feel like they're not in a position to settle for anything less than what they feel will help soften the blow of trading another Mariner icon.

I do believe that's better than that offer. Harrison is not a prospect; he's a young winner with World Series experience under his belt. Tanner Scheppers needs a few adjustments but could possibly be in the bullpen to start the season. Mike Olt and either Rougned Odor or Neil Ramirez have raw talent that will be available after two years right when the Mariners could peak.

If the Mariners don't take that for Felix, he's going to test free agency.

[TCM]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

Why not wait a 1.5-2.5 years to decide if you need to do that?

I never said they need to trade him right away, but I do think they need to trade him some time before he hits free agency.

[snepp]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

I never said they need to trade him right away, but I do think they need to trade him some time before he hits free agency.

As opposed to trading him after he hits free agency.

[Coug00]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

They might compete in that time or they might not, what if they have 3 more losing seasons and Felix signs elsewhere? I'd much rather take the huge package for him than keep him based on the chance you have a winning season.

And those prospects they'd get for Felix might turn out and they might not. Obviously the M's, who have better knowledge of their young personnel than you or I, are comfortable holding onto Felix.

[Sandman42]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

Yanks fans will obviously miss the offensive potential of Jesus Montero. But don't forget, they've got Austin Romine waiting in the wings too. And a staff that had a 4+ ERA just got a young, cost-controlled superstar in the making. And a deadly pitcher in Kuroda. Their rotation needs could not have been addressed via free agency, and it takes talent to acquire talent.

Props to Cashman for sadly vaulting to the front of the line, in my estimation.

Romine isn't really close to the prospect Montero is. The last 2 years have dropped Romine's stock. He doesn't have anywhere near the bat that Montero has and while he can stick behind the plate, most scouts think he is below average defensively.

[BatsareBugs]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

I don't understand Seattle's mindset to not even consider trading Felix. They gladly pay this 17 million a season even though they are going nowhere, and then they will trade away guys like Pineda. I know Felix is as good as it gets, I'm just upset that the best pitcher in baseball won't pitch a meaningful game until he's like 35.

You get more for a guy who don't necessarily need to trade than someone you do. $17 is hefty for any team and at that amount you lose some leverage.

[CabreraMVP]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

You get more for a guy who don't necessarily need to trade than someone you do. $17 is hefty for any team and at that amount you lose some leverage.

17 is hefty, but there is a long list of teams that would gladly take him because he is a bargain at that price. In a league where Burnett makes 17 million a season, Santana at 25mil, Mauer at 22mil, Lackey at 17mil, Wilson at 15..Hernandez is a deal. Same with Verlander, Felix set the precedence for the 5yr/75 Verlander got. Those guys are bargains compared to all these other guys who are paid similar but 1/2 the pitcher.

[bkrich83]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

And those prospects they'd get for Felix might turn out and they might not. Obviously the M's, who have better knowledge of their young personnel than you or I, are comfortable holding onto Felix.

Given their recent performance that's nor a great argument.

[abcabc]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

Yanks fans will obviously miss the offensive potential of Jesus Montero. But don't forget, they've got Austin Romine waiting in the wings too. And a staff that had a 4+ ERA just got a young, cost-controlled superstar in the making. And a deadly pitcher in Kuroda. Their rotation needs could not have been addressed via free agency, and it takes talent to acquire talent.

Props to Cashman for sadly vaulting to the front of the line, in my estimation.

i'm not high on the copy boy turned GM (i'm a nyy fan) he'd be in position to trade montero for something else if he'd kept Aceves. Don't think it'd cost NYY $10mill to keep Aceves vs. now signing the Japanese free agent either. Worse, Aceves went to the BOS.

Plus, if he didnt give up Phil Coke, NYY would not be seeking a lefty in the pen the past two seasons... all they had was Boone Logan, who came in because the other lefty, Damaso Marte, another Cashman give/grab, had been on the long disabled list...

and on the same trade with coke was giving up Ian Kennedy. Though Granderson is okay, he could have kept Gardner in center and grabbed some other left fielder... or have kept Austin Jackson for defense, speed and his righthanded bat... and he let Matsui go and signed the 1b/DH always injured nick johnson... for more money lol.

And Cashman messed up the rehab of ChienMingWang, leading to his demise and causing a hole in our rotation that needed to be filled. AJ Burnett, argh.

[Melanconfan]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

i'm not high on the copy boy turned GM (i'm a nyy fan) he'd be in position to trade montero for something else if he'd kept Aceves. Don't think it'd cost NYY $10mill to keep Aceves vs. now signing the Japanese free agent either. Worse, Aceves went to the BOS.

Aceves? Really? He's not a starter for a playoff team as seen by his peripherals. I'd be thrilled if he gets a good share of starts for Boston.

Plus, if he didnt give up Phil Coke, NYY would not be seeking a lefty in the pen the past two seasons... all they had was Boone Logan, who came in because the other lefty, Damaso Marte, another Cashman give/grab, had been on the long disabled list...

Don't disagree with Marte (or Feliciano) but relievers like Coke are as fungible as they come. Case in point, Boone Logan who was a throw in and has performed just as well as (or better) than Coke the past 2 years. The problem with the Marte and Feliciano (and Soriano but that's not on Cashman) deals is there are few relievers worth giving up anything for.

and on the same trade with coke was giving up Ian Kennedy. Though Granderson is okay, he could have kept Gardner in center and grabbed some other left fielder... or have kept Austin Jackson for defense, speed and his righthanded bat... and he let Matsui go and signed the 1b/DH always injured nick johnson... for more money lol.

They did sell low on Kennedy and it burnt them but they also sold high on Jackson and that looks like a good move. Though they may have been able to bring in more for that package, calling an MVP candidate in Granderson just "okay" is ridiculous.

[rsox]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

The Indians front office continues to insist that they're in on Carlos Pena. I doubt it.

Since no one else is in on Pena it is probably true.

[TCM]

Re: The Hot Stove League Thread

Twins sign Joel Zumaya to a 1 year contract.

Spoiler