Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

[bkrich83]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Yeah I think the ballpark argument is moot here. When you're hitting the ball 420+ feet, it doesn't matter what park you're in.

Agreed, although their park is a joke.

[Coug00]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Sweet Lord of Mercy I get tired of this ****. You want to see what Hamilton does outside of the Ballpark in Arlington? .433/.494/.970 with 11 home runs and 27 RBI. It's not like the Rangers only produce runs because the air makes the ball travel here; they produce everywhere.

Nice sample size of 6 weeks. If you take his career OPS its over 100 points higher at home than on the road. Statistically, Arlington inflates HR's for lefties by 20% and triples by 67% (Hamilton just so happens to have 2.5 times as many triples at home than on the road). Its not Hamilton's fault he plays in a ballpark that assists the hitters more than any other in baseball, but the numbers don't lie.

Edit:
Rangers 2011 - 42 more HR's at home, OPS of .120 points higher
2010 - 34 more HR's at home, OPS of .086 points higher
2009 - 20 more HR's at home, OPS of .101 points higher
2008 - 20 more HR's at home, OPS of .100 points higher

[bkrich83]

Nice sample size of 6 weeks. If you take his career OPS its over 100 points higher at home than on the road. Statistically, Arlington inflates HR's for lefties by 20% and triples by 67% (Hamilton just so happens to have 2.5 times as many triples at home than on the road). Its not Hamilton's fault he plays in a ballpark that assists the hitters more than any other in baseball, but the numbers don't lie.

Edit:
Rangers 2011 - 42 more HR's at home, OPS of .120 points higher
2010 - 34 more HR's at home, OPS of .086 points higher
2009 - 20 more HR's at home, OPS of .101 points higher
2008 - 20 more HR's at home, OPS of .100 points higher

Not to mention his sample doesn't take in to account the fact the weather hasn't started to heat up there like it will in 30 days or so. Not only affects ball flight but pitchers fatigue that much faster.

There's no disputing it's a hitter friendly park.

[Coug00]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Not to mention his sample doesn't take in to account the fact the weather hasn't started to heat up there like it will in 30 days or so. Not only affects ball flight but pitchers fatigue that much faster.

There's no disputing it's a hitter friendly park.

Exactly. My original comment was more of a comparison of where Hamilton & Kemp play half their games, it wasn't a knock against the Rangers. Dodger Stadium, at least for righties, is the antithesis of Rangers BP. Cookie cutter outfield, difficult for righties to hit the ball out, not many opportunities for extra basehits, etc. If Kemp were on the Rangers, you could argue his slugging would increase by 10-15% over the course of a season.

[bkrich83]

Exactly. My original comment was more of a comparison of where Hamilton & Kemp play half their games, it wasn't a knock against the Rangers. Dodger Stadium, at least for righties, is the antithesis of Rangers BP. Cookie cutter outfield, difficult for righties to hit the ball out, not many opportunities for extra basehits, etc. If Kemp were on the Rangers, you could argue his slugging would increase by 10-15% over the course of a season.

I don't know if you've ever been to Chavez Ravine, but the ball just doesn't carry there.

[ZB9]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

not surprised that Kemp's winning, but didnt figure it would be by such a margin

[ZB9]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Not to mention his sample doesn't take in to account the fact the weather hasn't started to heat up there like it will in 30 days or so. Not only affects ball flight but pitchers fatigue that much faster.

playing in an oven means that position players fatigue faster as well, not just the pitchers

[DonkeyJote]

playing in an oven means that position players fatigue faster as well, not just the pitchers

Not at nearly the rate, though (except for catchers). A pitcher is constantly doing something out there. A position player will have a handful of action a game. It certainly affects pitchers more, plus the ball carries so well (unlike Dodger Stadium, where the ball dies at night).

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[Gibbz]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Matt Kemp has had a higher WAR than Josh Hamilton only one time, has a much lower career OPS, and is horrendous defensively. I realize I'm biased for Texas, but unless it's strictly based on injuries I don't know how the poll could be so one-sided.

#justsayin

[bkrich83]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

playing in an oven means that position players fatigue faster as well, not just the pitchers

Impact isn't nearly the same. It can not be argued that playing in that park is not beneficial to hitters.

[ZB9]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Not at nearly the rate, though (except for catchers). A pitcher is constantly doing something out there. A position player will have a handful of action a game. It certainly affects pitchers more, plus the ball carries so well (unlike Dodger Stadium, where the ball dies at night).

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Playing in an oven during most of the summer can be quite a grind and absolutely wears down position players' stamina. Of course it does.

You living in Bellingham (beautiful place, i have a sister living up there), i wouldnt guess that you understand how brutal the heat gets in north Texas during the summer. It's the reason why Tom Landry and Tex Schramm smartly moved the Cowboys' training camp to southern California.

[snepp]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Ok, so the heat wears them down...

But the point remains, the offensive benefits of playing in Texas are enormous, this cannot be disputed.

[Coug00]

Matt Kemp has had a higher WAR than Josh Hamilton only one time, has a much lower career OPS, and is horrendous defensively. I realize I'm biased for Texas, but unless it's strictly based on injuries I don't know how the poll could be so one-sided.

#justsayin

I count two seasons with a higher WAR. OPS isn't park adjusted, its easily skewed. You could stick Hamilton on the A's and he would suffer a serious, serious impact to his OPS playing in that flyball mausoleum for 81 games/year. WAR would adjust for that home park difference.

The other factor is youth. Kemp is 3.5 years younger. Theoretically, he hasn't even hit his prime and he's pulling in 8+ WAR seasons. Hamilton is about to be 31.

[ZB9]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

Impact isn't nearly the same.It can not be argued that playing in that park is not beneficial to hitters.

The impact is different but the heat obviously has an impact on position players' stamina during the grind, not just pitchers every fifth day

Anyway, it is certainly a hitters park, that is true

[Sportsforever]

Re: Josh Hamilton vs. Matt Kemp

I love Matt Kemp, but at this point the only thing he has over Hamilton is age and durability. Those are two HUGE things, however, and I believe if all 30 GM's were polled they would take Kemp over Hamilton based on those two factors. All the talk about ballparks, etc, can be resolved by looking at OPS+ (which adjusts for those types of things) and you see that when he's played, Hamilton has out performed Kemp.