MLB Off-Topic

[Blzer]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

It makes sense to me that it's still a perfect game. So your catcher costs you a few extra pitches. You still got the out. There is no limit on the number of pitches to still call it perfect.

Yup. I always described it as a complete game where no one reaches base on a hit, walk, or error (within this I'm including hit batsmen and drop-third strikes... catcher's obstruction is an error, by the way).

I can't say 27 up and 27 down, because there are too many holes in that. What if there are pick-offs, caught stealing's, double plays, and hits that players attempted to stretch extra bases with? What if the game goes into extra innings? Easier to say the other.

Speaking of which, I'd like to know if it's a perfect game if a batter reaches base on a drop-third strike, and on that exact same play he attempts to make it to second base and is thrown out. I am guessing that it's not.

Anyway, in the scorebook, you're supposed to refer to foul instances with a preceding F. So if a catcher snags a foul fly, you would write FF2. If he commits an error, in the corner you would write FE2. This way it is still an error in the box score and should he reach base this would be an unearned run credited to the pitcher. It would still be a perfect game if they get him out, though.

[CMH]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

If it can be assumed that the catch can be made without extraordinary effort, it's an error.

I used to think it was only counted as an error if the batter got on base, but at some point I learned that wasn't right.

It's like people that think, "it touched the glove, it's an error."

That irked me on baseball teams. It's not a rule.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk

[Jr.]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

So I'm watching a re-run of the LSU/Arkansas SEC CG from today and a situation came up that I thought was really interesting.

Arkansas is trying to rally from a 4-1 deficit in the 9th. They get runners on 1st and 2nd with 2 outs. Arkansas's best hitter is on deck, and the guy up to bat hits a single up the middle. The 3rd base coach sends the runner to cut the lead to 2, but leaves an open base. LSU then walks Arkansas's best hitter to load the bases and the next guy grounds out (he was 0-3 in the game and 0 for his last 6).

I had never really thought about this before, but it brought the situation to my mind and made me think of what I would do. Would any of you give up a sure run to make it more likely that your best hitter gets an opportunity, or do you take the sure run no matter what?

Say you're the Angels in a similar situation with Mike Trout on deck. Do you keep the runner at 3rd, even if he would score easily, to give Trout a chance with the bases loaded knowing that the opposing team is MUCH less likely to put him on intentionally? Or do you take the sure run, keep an open base, and hope they pitch to him, or whomever is hitting after Trout comes through?

[TheMatrix31]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

I mean, if you could process it while it's happening to stay at third to make sure there isn't an open base then yeah, maybe.

Depends who's up behind your best player I suppose.

[Speedy]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

man I'm ignorant to the rules, I thought a dropped foul ball was just a strike

Yeah, I don't understand why this is an error in MLB rules. If the ball isn't caught, it's not going to put a man on base or move any runners up so why is there a negative impact? I think it should be treated like an infield fly rule sort of.

[Jr.]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

I mean, if you could process it while it's happening to stay at third to make sure there isn't an open base then yeah, maybe.

Depends who's up behind your best player I suppose.

Yeah it's a very specific situation, and I had never thought of it before. Just happened to occur in that game and made me think. It's a lot to process as a 3B coach before the play.

[Sportsforever]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

Yeah, I don't understand why this is an error in MLB rules. If the ball isn't caught, it's not going to put a man on base or move any runners up so why is there a negative impact? I think it should be treated like an infield fly rule sort of.

How is it NOT an error? An out SHOULD have been made and wasn't...a fielder shouldn't be penalized for failing to make a play that is made 99.9% of the time?

[l3ulvl]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

Yeah it's a very specific situation, and I had never thought of it before. Just happened to occur in that game and made me think. It's a lot to process as a 3B coach before the play.

I'm thinking score the runner no matter what, if they walk the best hitter to load the bases I'd guess the guy behind him in the order is at least decent. Being 0-3 at that point just means he's due right?

baseball is so random

[Jr.]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

How is it NOT an error? An out SHOULD have been made and wasn't...a fielder shouldn't be penalized for failing to make a play that is made 99.9% of the time?

There's no error when a ball drops in between guys

[kehlis]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

Yup. I always described it as a complete game where no one reaches base on a hit, walk, or error (within this I'm including hit batsmen and drop-third strikes... catcher's obstruction is an error, by the way).

I can't say 27 up and 27 down, because there are too many holes in that. What if there are pick-offs, caught stealing's, double plays, and hits that players attempted to stretch extra bases with? What if the game goes into extra innings? Easier to say the other.

Speaking of which, I'd like to know if it's a perfect game if a batter reaches base on a drop-third strike, and on that exact same play he attempts to make it to second base and is thrown out. I am guessing that it's not.

Anyway, in the scorebook, you're supposed to refer to foul instances with a preceding F. So if a catcher snags a foul fly, you would write FF2. If he commits an error, in the corner you would write FE2. This way it is still an error in the box score and should he reach base this would be an unearned run credited to the pitcher. It would still be a perfect game if they get him out, though.

You're really over complicating it.

A perfect game means no one reached base.


It is as simple as 27 up, 27 down. If someone reaches base, it's not a perfect game. You're confusing a perfect game with a no hitter.

Also, no, if a batter is thrown out at second trying to stretch a single into a double, the perfect game is gone because he got a single.

If a batter reaches first on a passed ball, third strike, no perfect game.

And no. No perfect game could ever include an unearned run, literally is not even possible.

[l3ulvl]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

You're really over complicating it.

Blzer, put this in your sig lol, it should be a prerequisite but sig is the best we have

[Blzer]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

You're really over complicating it.

A perfect game means no one reached base.


It is as simple as 27 up, 27 down. If someone reaches base, it's not a perfect game. You're confusing a perfect game with a no hitter.

Also, no, if a batter is thrown out at second trying to stretch a single into a double, the perfect game is gone because he got a single.

If a batter reaches first on a passed ball, third strike, no perfect game.

And no. No perfect game could ever include an unearned run, literally is not even possible.

I don't know how this post has anything to do with what I said. Read my post again.

If a pitcher faces the minimum of 27 hitters, he could have literally given up 27 hits in the process. So no, I can't say "27 up, 27 down." People would describe a scenario where somebody hits a double and is thrown out trying to stretch the hit into a triple as a part of a "three up, three down" inning. If you don't believe that to be the case, then I guess I see where the line is drawn here, and that's why there is confusion.

I know what a perfect game and no-hitter are. I differentiate between the two on here all of the time. I've never been confused between the two.

There's no error when a ball drops in between guys

Mental errors do not appear in the scorebook.

Nobody on, ground ball to short, shortstop throws to third base... base hit. Not a throwing error. Not a fielder's choice.

We can't presume that we know what the fielder was thinking at the time of the play to cause the physical action that occurred. The best physicality that we can look at is how a play best matches what is intended to be made, and how much "ordinary effort" was involved within the play itself.

[Redacted01]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

There's no error when a ball drops in between guys

Which is why errors are dumb, as plain as you can put it. If the catcher flubs an easy pop up behind home plate and the next pitch is sent over the outfield fence, it's hard not to blame the catcher. But between two players, now we get into scorer's interpretation which makes the stat as dumb as it is. We are really going to leave it up to interpretation when something goes wrong? Thankfully sabermetric defensive stats are catching up, but I don't pay enough attention any more.

At least in basketball, an assist is pretty well-defined, but you still have official scorer bias when you see higher assist rates at home than on the road. As someone that is very logical and mathematical, open-ended interpreted stats grind my gears. Wait, that's another thread.

[Sportsforever]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

There's no error when a ball drops in between guys

True (I'll get to that in a minute), but what we're talking about here is a guy settling under a foul pop and completely flubbing/dropping it. That's an error...always has been, always should be.

Now, as for pop ups that drop due to miscommunication, etc, I've always felt there should be a TEAM error category. It resulted from multiple people not doing their jobs, so mark it down as a team error instead of an individual error. Baseball hasn't been doing it since day 1, so it won't change, but that's what I'd do in those cases.

[kehlis]

Re: MLB Off-Topic

I don't know how this post has anything to do with what I said. Read my post again.

If a pitcher faces the minimum of 27 hitters, he could have literally given up 27 hits in the process. So no, I can't say "27 up, 27 down." People would describe a scenario where somebody hits a double and is thrown out trying to stretch the hit into a triple as a part of a "three up, three down" inning. If you don't believe that to be the case, then I guess I see where the line is drawn here, and that's why there is confusion.

I know what a perfect game and no-hitter are. I differentiate between the two on here all of the time. I've never been confused between the two.

How about this then,

A perfect game is a complete game where no batter reaches base via base hit, walk or error.

The rare feat of facing the minimum, is a pitcher facing 27 batters in a 9 inning outing regardless of the outcome of the at bat.