2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

[Sundown]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

That would be a mistake in my opinion. 90% of the time I read someone's MyGM story they are making tons of stupid trades. Not just unfair trades but stupid stuff like oh I wish the cavs got oladipo so let me trade Bennett and Dion Waiters for him.

With crowdsourcing, you don't necessarily just take trades at face value. You assume the person trading is trying to get a better deal-- so if you used this as a data point, it means Bennett and Dion Waiters don't have as much trade value and Oladipo does. It means Cav fans don't consider Waiters and Bennett a real untradeable core to build around, and the AI shouldn't either.

You also poll the other direction. If Oladipo rarely gets traded for Bennett and like valued players, then Oladipo should register as having higher trade value.

Either way, the proposed trade isn't QUITE as stupid as many CPU trades, like Klay for Avery Bradley and Harrison Barnes for Vince Carter-- and this system's gotta be better than the current random trades the CPU proposes.

[Theyhateme459]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

The final trade, not shown in the pics was..

Bobcats: Ben Gordon, 2015 1st Round Pick
76ers: 2014 First Round Pick, Jason Richardson

Anyone care to dissect these? Almost all of them make no sense, but, that's what happens when teams are trading only because of player morale.

This shouldn't be happening, and I definitely shouldn't need 5 photos to show the amount of trades that happened in one season. Just damn

It was davez not Leftos. Here's the quote.



Also I completely agree about there being too many trades. Trades should be few and far between. When they happen it's normally a big deal because they're so rare. If they were happening all the time (like they are in 2k 14) then no one would care.

It's kind of like when I give flowers to my wife. Occasionally I'll pick some up for her for no reason. She loves it that ****. However, if I did it every day (or even once a week) then she would come to expect it and it would lose it's luster.

The same thing goes with trades. They should only happen once in a while, that way when they do you have a "wow factor". The exception, of course, would be around the trade deadline. Other than that there's shouldn't be more that a handful of trades through Nov-Jan and probably double that number for February.

Yeaaaa thats the big problem... there is almost 30 trades in that photo between Nov and Feb.

If you look at all past NBA trades http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-trade-history

There are usually only 10 or less and that is all at the trade deadline. There are a lot of Draft Day, Sign and trade and other off season trades. I know it's because of player roles, but Trades really need to be cut back A LOT!!!

[quehouston]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

With crowdsourcing, you don't necessarily just take trades at face value. You assume the person trading is trying to get a better deal-- so if you used this as a data point, it means Bennett and Dion Waiters don't have as much trade value and Oladipo does. It means Cav fans don't consider Waiters and Bennett a real untradeable core to build around, and the AI shouldn't either.

You also poll the other direction. If Oladipo rarely gets traded for Bennett and like valued players, then Oladipo should register as having higher trade value.

Either way, the proposed trade isn't QUITE as stupid as many CPU trades, like Klay for Avery Bradley and Harrison Barnes for Vince Carter-- and this system's gotta be better than the current random trades the CPU proposes.

I think you've sparked an awesome idea.

And I think it would be perfect if 2k divided it all up into communities, so that we can draw that information from like minds. Like its been said before, a lot of people make a lot of stupid trades, I wouldn't want my save drawing from that type of data. But lets say we created a OS community, or you and your buddies created a group, the data would be better represented. Think of it like Online Leagues, except you guys don't compete against each other, 2k just draws trade data from everyone's MyGM.

[Sundown]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

I think you've sparked an awesome idea.

And I think it would be perfect if 2k divided it all up into communities, so that we can draw that information from like minds. Like its been said before, a lot of people make a lot of stupid trades, I wouldn't want my save drawing from that type of data. But lets say we created a OS community, or you and your buddies created a group, the data would be better represented. Think of it like Online Leagues, except you guys don't compete against each other, 2k just draws trade data from everyone's MyGM.

Huh. Interesting. Clump data into communities of like minded individuals so they have some similarities and common understandings.


Perhaps 2K can then curate results from those groups and select ones that they feel look realistic, feed that into the logic engine, and have that be passed back down to all groups.


It'd allow some filtering for bad player driven trades and allow 2K to look at data in more organized data sets.

[jeremym480]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

Yeaaaa thats the big problem... there is almost 30 trades in that photo between Nov and Feb.

If you look at all past NBA trades http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-trade-history

There are usually only 10 or less and that is all at the trade deadline. There are a lot of Draft Day, Sign and trade and other off season trades. I know it's because of player roles, but Trades really need to be cut back A LOT!!!

November through the end of January trades are rare happen more frequently than a lot of people think.

Here's what the numbers look like over the past few years (I'm skipping the lockout season).

2012-13
Nov - Jan = 3
Feb = 12
Total = 15

2010-11
Nov - Jan = 6
Feb = 15
Total = 21

2009-10
Nov - Jan = 8
Feb = 12
Total = 20

2008-09
Nov - Jan = 11
Feb = 15
Total = 26

* There has also been at least one trade in October each of those years with the exception of the 08-09 season.

That's an average of 7 Nov-Jan trades
and 13.5 February trades
for a total of 20.5 mid-season trades per year over the last four full years


Now in my 1 season experience with 2k14 I only had 3 November trades which I thought was fine, as long as there weren't 3 every year. Through 12/25 there were 5 more trades which is a little high, but not to alarming, but as soon as Christmas was over the **** hit the fan and there were trades out the wazoo.

I'm hopeful that this is fixed in Patch 3, but I just wanted to point out that early and mid-season trades do happen. Just not at the rate that they happen in the game (which everyone knows already).

[jeremym480]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

Huh. Interesting. Clump data into communities of like minded individuals so they have some similarities and common understandings.


Perhaps 2K can then curate results from those groups and select ones that they feel look realistic, feed that into the logic engine, and have that be passed back down to all groups.


It'd allow some filtering for bad player driven trades and allow 2K to look at data in more organized data sets.

I like this idea, but here there is one caveat that I would add to it. We all know that for whatever reason, in the world we live in today, people love to basically troll others. Even friends do.

Therefore, I want the ability to review others trades. Whether it's people on my Friends list or in my Community or whatever. Then if I see someone who is approving trades that I don't agree with I can Block them so that their data isn't used in my Association.

I don't know maybe that too unrealistic, but something like that would certainly put Next Gen "on a whole nother level".

[LakersNation]

2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

Solution is more complicated than the problem. Just allow trade veto.

[Gosens6]

2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

You guys have to realize that 95% of these trades happen because of the morale system.

With the third patch tweaking player morale, we'll see what that does to all these insane trades.

The solution isn't allowing us to veto, it's about giving the AI an actual brain when it comes to trading. They should trade based off of many other factors, not just morale which is the only driving force when it comes to trades right now

Because with the way it's set up now, it we were allowed to veto all these trades, player morale would just get worse and worse, ruining ratings and team chemistry more than it already is.

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[Sundown]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

You guys have to realize that 95% of these trades happen because of the morale system.

With the third patch tweaking player morale, we'll see what that does to all these insane trades.

The solution isn't allowing us to veto, it's about giving the AI an actual brain when it comes to trading. They should trade based off of many other factors, not just morale which is the only driving force when it comes to trades right now

Because with the way it's set up now, it we were allowed to veto all these trades, player morale would just get worse and worse, ruining ratings and team chemistry more than it already is.

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Veto is a spot fix, but yes, the morale/role problem needs to be fixed as it's the root of it.

Veto would help with other issues like the improper overvaluing of OVR, players being traded just because they're injured, and that sort of thing, at least until 2K implements proper AI trade logic. We'd love that, but it's been pretty bad for... half a decade now? A veto spot fix would alleviate some of the pain but I'd love it to be properly done if they're motivated to do so.

As I understand it, properly rating a few players so their OVR decreases also helps with the morale/role problem. I'm looking at you JR Smith and Jamal Crawford.

[LakersNation]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

Veto is a spot fix, but yes, the morale/role problem needs to be fixed as it's the root of it.

Veto would help with other issues like the improper overvaluing of OVR, players being traded just because they're injured, and that sort of thing, at least until 2K implements proper AI trade logic. We'd love that, but it's been pretty bad for... half a decade now? A veto spot fix would alleviate some of the pain but I'd love it to be properly done if they're motivated to do so.

As I understand it, properly rating a few players so their OVR decreases also helps with the morale/role problem. I'm looking at you JR Smith and Jamal Crawford.

Yea changing ovr is the best user fix for now. Veto doesn't address the root but I've given up on free agent/trade/draft logic. Been a problem for now 3 generations of consoles.

[Glenn33]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

What is the "cutoff" for OVR where the players morale won't be impacted if they don't start and/or play major minutes?

[LakersNation]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

What is the "cutoff" for OVR where the players morale won't be impacted if they don't start and/or play major minutes?

We think under 73

http://www.operationsports.com/forum...d.php?t=685427

[jeremym480]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

In addition to the ability to veto trades the other band-aid fix would be the ability to reset Player Morale. In CG 2k's I always liked to play with Morale on, even though it was as flawed as it is now. The good thing about it was there was a workaround to reset it if you saw the need.

[sfx]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

What surprises me is that players demand trades and the teams actually give in as often as they do. First, how often do we see players 'demanding' trades IRL? Second, how often do those demanding trades actually get dealt?

While the actual trades are silly and one sided, maybe the thing that needs to be toned down is the demand. The players under contract have very little power. They can complain and bring down morale but unless someone is a horrifying locker room cancer or they're in the last year of their deal, they usually get shut down pretty fast.

[Gosens6]

Re: 2K needs to patch player roles NOW and not wait until next year.

What surprises me is that players demand trades and the teams actually give in as often as they do. First, how often do we see players 'demanding' trades IRL? Second, how often do those demanding trades actually get dealt?

While the actual trades are silly and one sided, maybe the thing that needs to be toned down is the demand. The players under contract have very little power. They can complain and bring down morale but unless someone is a horrifying locker room cancer or they're in the last year of their deal, they usually get shut down pretty fast.

True, but morale plays too big of a part in this game for it to work that way unfortunately. Team chemistry is a big part of player overall and team overall.

Teams see unhappy players, they see bad chemistry and they get traded ASAP. Once again, it player morale wasn't such a big deal, we wouldn't see such crazy trades.

The thing I'm worried about is when patch three comes, and they tune player morale, we might not see ANY trades


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