NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

[Taer]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

I have to be neutral in my opinion because I don't have the game to experiment on my own.

With that being said, perhaps next year or thereafter, Da_Czar can do some work in implementing basic defensive principles such as "weak-side shading" to be used by the cpu as default set-up.

We all know there has been a lot of work over the past decade on offensive system and mechanic development. 2k15 is the first year that I can remember that defensive play is being talked about in as a serious manner as offense.

This year, the on-ball tools seem to be taken to the next level, perhaps in the future off-ball ai tools will be developed as well.

As was said elsewhere, incremental development year after year is what we want to see. Expecting instant perfection year to year might not be realistic.

Edit: I also know that Roster gurus like to think the solution lies with roster rating adjustments. I am of the belief that underlying basketball mechanics implemented within the 2k systems is the correct approach. Ratings will always be subjective - basketball principles should stay constant across the sport and across the eras.

[vannwolfhawk]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

I have to be neutral in my opinion because I don't have the game to experiment on my own.

With that being said, perhaps next year or thereafter, Da_Czar can do some work in implementing basic defensive principles such as "weak-side shading" to be used by the cpu as default set-up.

We all know there has been a lot of work over the past decade on offensive system and mechanic development. 2k15 is the first year that I can remember that defensive play is being talked about in as a serious manner as offense.

This year, the on-ball tools seem to be taken to the next level, perhaps in the future off-ball ai tools will be developed as well.

As was said elsewhere, incremental development year after year is what we want to see. Expecting instant perfection year to year might not be realistic.

Edit: I also know that Roster gurus like to think the solution lies with roster rating adjustments. I am of the belief that underlying basketball mechanics implemented within the 2k systems is the correct approach. Ratings will always be subjective - basketball principles should stay constant across the sport and across the eras.

I have not heard or seen anything about this? Is this true? What is new? Actually I haven't seen much at all about gameplay this year. All I've heard or seen is my player, my team, except for czars videos. Then I heard about my league and my gym and work lefts did but nothing on gameplay which is 1st year I remember like this. I did hear about sig dribbles were in but I think that was from a you tuber and no specifics or anything showcasing this.

Anyways, if I missed this can you link me? Thx!

[Taer]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

I have not heard or seen anything about this? Is this true? What is new? Actually I haven't seen much at all about gameplay this year. All I've heard or seen is my player, my team, except for czars videos. Then I heard about my league and my gym and work lefts did but nothing on gameplay which is 1st year I remember like this. I did hear about sig dribbles were in but I think that was from a you tuber and no specifics or anything showcasing this.

Anyways, if I missed this can you link me? Thx!

The only official word is that 2k's team did actively work on defense as an emphasis. I don't recall the exact quotes so I can not give them to you atm but as I reread threads, I'll keep my eye out for you.

Given that point of emphasis, I draw my conclusion from what those who have the game and are providing feedback and impressions are stating. I'll just show examples that help reinforce this from this thread but there are many other sources such as the you tuber guys and the impression thread here and elsewhere. But here are a few statements that reinforce my gut-feeling here:

... I said "as i tried all kinds of defensive settings" meaning i was trying to see if there was an adjustment that could be made to make the cpu play this properly.

it obviously failed.

then i said, "manually i could contain it, but in transition there were too many things and players to manage to shut this tactic down".

let me be clear defense can be played in 2k15. On ball you have the tools to make a person work for their buckets, theres just a few situations where your teammates dont use them.

you could. they have these new mini shuffles with the right stick. but thats a big gamble at that distance, you could just find yourself moving out of the way. as in real life it would probably be better to just give ground.

2-head indicates that his on-ball defensive experiences were much more improved this year. The tools include the new mini-shuffles and that on-ball, these tools seem sufficient to succeed.

The failings of the ai (imo) seem to mirror the offensive plays breaking down in years past - and this is where I hope Da_Czar's work can be grafted to the defensive side of the ball. Obviously, not this year but hopefully in the upcoming years this could be accomplished.

[Khimera]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Definitely going to check this out myself when I get the game. If you think about last year, a lot of these situations would've resulted in a animation slowing you down when you're running full speed....so I am happy that looks to be gone....but I want make sure the proper tools are on place to stop this from being abused...

In all honestly, I am more concerned about the help D in this situation...

Help defense was suspect in 2K last year as well. In 2K14, if the CPU played full court press and I got by my initial defender, often times the help defense would never come and I would have an open lane for a dunk or layup. Seeing the Chalmers video disturbs me, as he could repeatedly blow by his defender with little to no help defense and that was Superstar/Sim. If it is easy to blow by your defender and trigger these crazy Gerald Green dunk animations, it's really going to hurt online play, especially MyTeam, since guys like LaVine probably won't cost very much to obtain. And even if you can stop it by playing user on-ball defense, I find it very difficult to play on-ball defense online since it feels like I'm on skates. But I'm not going to go crazy just yet, since there still could be a Day 1 patch that could remedy the situation.

[Beluba]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

For those that have the game and are seeing this issue... were you prompted to install an update? Several defensive fixes were made for the day 1 patch and we were pretty sure that this problem was addressed. Regardless, we'll dig into this first thing in the morning.

[Smirkin Dirk]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Wow, talk about responsive!

[2_headedmonster]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

For those that have the game and are seeing this issue... were you prompted to install an update? Several defensive fixes were made for the day 1 patch and we were pretty sure that this problem was addressed. Regardless, we'll dig into this first thing in the morning.

glorious.

I was prompted to download something, but i thought it was server related as online ability was available right after i installed it. Maybe it was coincidental. but 23 indicated there was talk of faces being updated in the day one patch, i saw non, so i assumed i didnt have it.

[Vni]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

For those that have the game and are seeing this issue... were you prompted to install an update? Several defensive fixes were made for the day 1 patch and we were pretty sure that this problem was addressed. Regardless, we'll dig into this first thing in the morning.

It's that time of the year again... when Mike Wang makes us feel like special gamers.

[vannwolfhawk]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Wow, talk about responsive!

Lol! Amazing right? Now if we can get this in the online league thread I'd be ecstatic! But good to know mike and devs saw same thing 2head did and it was a flaw that was exploitable. Good to know it will be eliminated! Good looking beluba! Nice work as well 2head! All we all want is sim game and get rid of exploits... Were not just complaining to complain...

[Smirkin Dirk]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Madden and NHL devs need to be as engaged with the community as 2K developers are.

Communication is so important, even if the message "Look, it's not an easy fix".

[Hotobu]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Lol! Amazing right? Now if we can get this in the online league thread I'd be ecstatic! But good to know mike and devs saw same thing 2head did and it was a flaw that was exploitable. Good to know it will be eliminated! Good looking beluba! Nice work as well 2head! All we all want is sim game and get rid of exploits... Were not just complaining to complain...

There's a difference in patching a small defensive glitch and fixing the slew of problems with online leagues.

[vannwolfhawk]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

There's a difference in patching a small defensive glitch and fixing the slew of problems with online leagues.

Lol! I'd be happy just to have a dev/any dev VISIT a online league thread though! I'll take baby steps at this point.

[2_headedmonster]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Agreed, it sounds great but I don't think they have even come close to finding the balance here. This year could be different though so this is all past experiences IMO. I'd rather have more responsiveness and ability to stay in front consistently with defenders I should be able to stay in front with. I'm all for realism but it needs to be balanced correctly. I could live with lack of realism for proper game balance that gives me a fun experience.

I think in past few years it's near impossible to stay in front of a really good player online. I consider myself a good 2k player where I'm usually around 70% winning percentages in online leagues and this is with my horrible defense. I can adjust and outwit and outthink opponents but no thanks to on ball defense.

I just think sometimes to much realism is bad for video games UNLESS you nail it with balance which in basketball games seems hard to do. It always seems like offense is overpowered and the defense is automatically at a disadvantage. Maybe over power defense on ball slightly as far as sipped, recovery, agility, lateral quickness? But the thing is I don't want that to be the case off ball and see magical recoveries on close outs and recoveries getting around down screens, etc. I don't know...

But who knows maybe they nailed it this year? I'll need to feel it to see for sure.

To touch on this, the on-ball defense in 2k15 is a mix of 2k14 last gen and bumps. Id say the biggest differences between the two would be that defenders backpeddle on 14LG when you do moves instead or realistically shifting directions like they do in 15CG. On 14LG the cpu defenders seemed to use the shuffling better especially in the full court press. And finally on 15CG the bumps initiated with contact are more handicapping vs 14LG.

The bumps arent terrible, but they occasionally last a lil too long and cant be countered, when in reality ( if your handles and timing are good enough) there is almost always a counter. Im trying to master the use of dribbles that dont initiate contact, however thats easier said than done since, as far as i can tell, that's only stationary moves and sig size ups.

All that said, its worlds better than 2k14 current gen.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Thanks Mike!

That's what I'm talking about.

This is why we needed video...let's use these ridiculous amounts of sharing options for something, lol

[Goffs]

Re: NBA 2K15 Gameplay...a bit worrisome

Thanks Mike!

That's what I'm talking about.

This is why we needed video...let's use these ridiculous amounts of sharing options for something, lol

This...makes the life of a dev easier what the issue is and BOOM next roster update we get a mini fix...