It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

[fcabanski]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

As for the trades and signings, by 2016 nobody had signed a free agent for 4-5 years, and trades were at most 2 per year.

Anthony, older but still rated 91, was left sitting as a free agent all season.

In the 2016-2017 season there were 3 unsigned FA above 80 overall and a total of 10 above 70. There was only one trade that season.

BTW, the PC version sims much faster than the PS3 version. It sims games in a flash, and even off season tasks. But the massive HCA and lack of trades is the same.

[Jukeman]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

^^^

There isnt much need of a 80 OVR FA if generate rookies coming in as 80's and high 70's


Rarely would you see a 60 guy if so, he's undrafted....

75 should be max for rookies...

there is no room for improvement in this game which has a great progression system

Thank god for customization!

I dont think its a bug, I just think its the AI using logic and building thru the draft...

not much to choose from if the rating range is on 75-99 among players...

It needs to be 50-95 with a average starter being in the low 70's (70-75) and rookies coming in between 50-75 with variety at the potential rating

[fcabanski]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

If they're bringing in Jordan at 79 for the create a legend, why would any rookie ever have a higher rating?

This is an Association killer if not fixed. And if it kills association it kills the game for me.

The huge HC advantage in sim isn't quite a kill shot, but it's damaging.

I suppose the next thing to do is edit an entire draft class, drop down all their ratings, then see if there's trade movement.

FA may have to do with those high draft class ratings. Lack of trades is a different issue, but who knows, maybe because teams are grabbing high rated players in the draft they don't need trades to meet their goals.

[Jukeman]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

If they're bringing in Jordan at 79 for the create a legend, why would any rookie ever have a higher rating?

This is an Association killer if not fixed. And if it kills association it kills the game for me.

The huge HC advantage in sim isn't quite a kill shot, but it's damaging.

I suppose the next thing to do is edit an entire draft class, drop down all their ratings, then see if there's trade movement.

FA may have to do with those high draft class ratings. Lack of trades is a different issue, but who knows, maybe because teams are grabbing high rated players in the draft they don't need trades to meet their goals.

and the thing is, there are multiple rookies coming in as 77...

Im not even going to talk about John Wall's 81...I mean if Jordan is a 79 I think no player should be higher than that...

[ggsimmonds]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

I disagree that rookies come in rated too high. I certainly would not argue if 2k decides to lower the rookie scale, but I do not think it is the primary culprit.

It is potential. Without spending too much time with the game, it is my guess that there are too many players with good potential.

Having said that, I do believe that the highest rated rookies should typically fall between 74-78, not above 80. There should be a few exceptions, (Lebron and KD come to mind) but any one draft class should not contain numerous guys rated 78+

Lower potential and make more of the 2nd round guys be complete busts.

And on a related note, I did notice that just because a player had 91 potential did not guarantee that he would develop into a 91 player. I am unsure of the parameters involved, but is this still the case? Or do players always reach their potential?

[Jukeman]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

Only thing wrong with it to me is the trading logic. Why is DeMarcus Cousins rated 5 stars in trade value while players like Andre Igoudala and Stephen Curry are rated 4 and a half stars? Cousins has a B in potential and is only rated a 70, yet he is impossible to trade for. It is much easier to trade for Stephen Curry (who is rated an 80 with A+ potential) or Andre Igoudala (who is rated an 80 with a B+ potential). That makes no sense to me. And also some teams seem to make trades that don't exactly fit into the roster they currently have. It seems to be just like last year when it comes to trade logic unfortunately, which is a bummer. At least my Miami Heat (the team I currently play with in an Association) won't need to make many trades.

I wanna quote the bolded part...

This right here tells us something important and may be the reason why people are seeing lack of trades and FA signings

If they value a rookie rated this way (which basically what everyone in a generate draft class looks like) the draft class may be the problem, its worth testing out

In my draft classes in 2k10 a 70 rated player would be a top 5 pick...

2k's draft class, a 70 is low first rounder...

[ggsimmonds]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

and the thing is, there are multiple rookies coming in as 77...

Im not even going to talk about John Wall's 81...I mean if Jordan is a 79 I think no player should be higher than that...

That is not really the problem per se. As far as measuring a players worth we should know that overall is not the perfect representation of that worth. What I meant to say is I don't have a problem with Wall's rating compared to Jordan's when I am pretty sure I could do more with Jordan.

I think a pg will always have a skewed overall because of the awareness rating. Maybe 2k needs to change the way overall is calculated.

However, that does not mean that every draft class's best player should be
rated in the low 80's. That should be exceedingly rare.

[TooTall]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

Yeah, going in and editing the rookie classes, some rookies were coming in as high as 85. I lowered the potential for just a few years but didn't really see a difference. It was a quick test though. Didn't end up conclusive either way.

Although it would suck to manually change the rookie classes, if that ends up being the problem, I'll just man up and fix it.

A patch would be much more preferable of course.

[Jukeman]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

That is not really the problem per se. As far as measuring a players worth we should know that overall is not the perfect representation of that worth. What I meant to say is I don't have a problem with Wall's rating compared to Jordan's when I am pretty sure I could do more with Jordan.

I think a pg will always have a skewed overall because of the awareness rating. Maybe 2k needs to change the way overall is calculated.

However, that does not mean that every draft class's best player should be
rated in the low 80's. That should be exceedingly rare.

If you look at Walls attributes, it vastly overrated....a 79 Jordan is base off of ATH...His skills wasnt overrated like Evan turner and John Wall's.

[ggsimmonds]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

I wanna quote the bolded part...

This right here tells us something important and may be the reason why people are seeing lack of trades and FA signings

If they value a rookie rated this way (which basically what everyone in a generate draft class looks like) the draft class may be the problem, its worth testing out

I think this is due to the AI placing a worth bonus on rookies. However the formula for trade value is designed, there is probably a variable for rookies. Like a multiplier or something. Something under the hood that discourages the AI from trading their rookies.

Here is a possible test. Attempt to offer numerous (fair) trades in exchange for a rookie. You don't want them to accept, that is key. Then sim to the next year and make the same trades. My guess is that in year 2 the same trade they declined the previous year they will now accept.

It may be easier to do it in reverse. Have 2 save files. Sim to season 2, make for Cousins. Load season 1 file attempt same trade. check results.

[statum71]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

I started a quick Association and the home teams seem to be winning by blowouts nearly every game.

Hope it gets fixed. Still love the game though.

[Primerica]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

That is not really the problem per se. As far as measuring a players worth we should know that overall is not the perfect representation of that worth. What I meant to say is I don't have a problem with Wall's rating compared to Jordan's when I am pretty sure I could do more with Jordan.

I think a pg will always have a skewed overall because of the awareness rating. Maybe 2k needs to change the way overall is calculated.

However, that does not mean that every draft class's best player should be
rated in the low 80's. That should be exceedingly rare.

Melo was a 81 in NBA 2k4. I hate crying threads. The only issue I see is the playoff sim. That's it and it's still better than last year where bum make the playoffs like the the 76ers and the Lakers with healthy Kobe miss it.

[fcabanski]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

I simmed an association through season 3 (2012-2013).

I gutted each draft class, knocking down anyone who was over 75 to 70 or below. Each of these players any rating over 75 was lowered to below 70. It wasn't done carefully, just lowered them quickly.

Year 2 and year 3 there were a large number of trades and free agent signings.

When the draft classes were left as-is, year 2 and year 3 there were hardly any trades (3 in year 2 and 1 in year 3) and no FA signings.

There are still some highly rated FA's unsigned. For example in 2012-2013 C. Lee is a 72 overall SG who is good from outside and perimeter D. Salary Caps may be part of this issue. Most teams have no soft cap room.

It would take a great deal of careful rookie class editing to determine where the threshold is. Over time if these rookies have high potentials would trades and FA signings stop? Does only overall count, or if there were still some rookies who were around high 70's overall but with 90+ in some attributes would that satisfy teams to where they weren't trading or signing FA's?

If I were on the payroll I'd have that time, but that time goes towards work.

Bottom line - trades and FA signing aren't "broken". Teams are filling their personnel needs with rookies, so there's no need to trade or sign FA's. This can be addressed with well designed draft classes.

BTW, you think gamers crying is bad with ratings? You should hear the players themselves. When I toured with the Madden Challenge guys would check out their ratings. I thought Randy Moss was going to attack me because his rating wasn't what he expected. Some guys looked deflated when they saw a 60 speed "I know I'm not fast, but I'm faster than that."

During an all star game party we were showing off NBA Live or 2K, don't remember which. The first thing people did was look at their ratings. If they didn't like the ratings they refused to play.

[TooTall]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

Melo was a 81 in NBA 2k4. I hate crying threads. The only issue I see is the playoff sim. That's it and it's still better than last year where bum make the playoffs like the the 76ers and the Lakers with healthy Kobe miss it.

So you are perfectly fine with having players like Melo stay in FA for an entire year? There was an association where Jennings was in the NBDL and stayed there for a few years.

That needs to be fixed.

[Andarus]

Re: It would be a total Buzz kill if Association mode is as broken...

Fix Rookie-Stats: 2-3 80-84 Rookies are just ridiculous. And Pick30 Player shouldn't be 70+!
Fix Trade-Bug in Association: This Bug kills the Association!

And pls release the PC-Patch not 6month after consoles!