Understanding slider coefficients

[chesizzle]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

does changing cpu tendencies affect any ratings? like i want the cpu to shoot more threes but not necessarily have a higher 3pt rating..

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

that's all very interesting - thanks for posting. this makes me wonder - if one human were to play against another human with the second human having coach mode turned on (on say superstar or hof), would the cpu coach mode team get a boost?

well, i don't have 2k13 installed anymore... i went back to 12 a week ago due to frustrations. but anyway, i played a game vs a second human on coach mode and it played out pretty smooth on all star - i didn't notice any speed boosts or rebounding shenanigans... it was really fun for a change. could be placebo and the fact i was in a good mood, but that's how it went. i was also able to get double teaming to work this way (vs a human on coach mode). which as awesome.

maybe someone could test this out on 2k13...

Its too bad you gave up on 13 so easy, its by far superior to 12 and I played the **** out of 12 too.

But I will test out two controllers w/ one being coach mode to see if anything pops up.

does changing cpu tendencies affect any ratings? like i want the cpu to shoot more threes but not necessarily have a higher 3pt rating..

No, tendencies will not affect ratings in anyway.

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

i always play at home.

Just finished a Hof/negated attribute/12 game. i would definitely stick to this. still like a Hof feel but the cheating of the AI is gone. The ball security is associated in hands attribute. however if it goes lower than what i posted, the hands will be marked as red.

Really thanks to this. especially that the season opener roster update will be available soon.

Still looks like there needs to be some editing/slider adjustments to be done with those statistics there.

[papaey]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

Still looks like there needs to be some editing/slider adjustments to be done with those statistics there.

yup but i guess its in the game engine. tested some more games.in pro the AI are still penalized in SIT/SOD. and it seems that only in Rookie and hOf you will get the CPU REAL ratings.

In rookie ball security is normal when adjusted accordingly however there is a big drop in SIT/SOD since there are no corresponding sliders in that category.

In Hof all other attributes are normal except ball security/SIT/SOD which have big boost.

In ohter words ratings are OFF if playing against AI. I still cant decide if ill play rookie or Hof.honestly i didnt see much difference.Now im really concious knowing about this.

[blackaceons]

He's right the games players better when you set these up on Hof and CPU fatigue 61 user on 55

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[STLRams]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

I think I'm going to move from Pro to Allstar and lower the ratings by -5 or -4 and see how the game plays. This was a good find by the OP.

[papaey]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

I think I'm going to move from Pro to Allstar and lower the ratings by -5 or -4 and see how the game plays. This was a good find by the OP.

you have to adjust each affected slider until that red mark is gone. however in pro, all star and superstar you will not get their real rating beacuse of the 1.5ish change in the slider.

Its either you play in rookie- SIT/SOD are penalized by ten OR
you play in HOF - ball security/sit/sod are boosted drastically.

If you ask me no change on how the AI play in Rookie or Hof. plainly the cpu just have boost in higher diff setting.

[Mickeyknoxx]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

I was wondering.. Maybe the Tendencies sliders works the same way. Everything at 50 they play the real rating player. a little bit more or a little bit less works the same way the attributes. Butthere's no way to see the ratings in ral time in play...

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

you have to adjust each affected slider until that red mark is gone. however in pro, all star and superstar you will not get their real rating beacuse of the 1.5ish change in the slider.

Its either you play in rookie- SIT/SOD are penalized by ten OR
you play in HOF - ball security/sit/sod are boosted drastically.

If you ask me no change on how the AI play in Rookie or Hof. plainly the cpu just have boost in higher diff setting.

I have not tested that far yet. Need to confirm this though.

I was wondering.. Maybe the Tendencies sliders works the same way. Everything at 50 they play the real rating player. a little bit more or a little bit less works the same way the attributes. Butthere's no way to see the ratings in ral time in play...

Undoubtedly the tendencies work the same way, the coefficient logically would be the same, but ya never know. Also as you pointed out, there is no way to confirm it or not.

I did check all sub menu player cards and nothing shows for tendency adjustments like ratings. It would be safe to assume 1.5 per click in either direction though.

Also don't forget coaching sliders, again probably on the same coefficient scale. Roster/Slider makers need to keep note of this as it has a potentially big impact on player ratings / tendencies and the possibility of cancelling rating adjusted rosters out.

[lostsoul]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

you know, i was wondering about tendencies the other day.... not slider tendencies, but player tendencies. if you take a look at a player's dribble tendencies, i think they're all screwed up. my new theory is that if you set everything to 50 (default in this case also?), the player will do whatever move is called for in a certain situation. for example, we see the cpu players use a crossover and end up bumping into us when they should have used a spin move that would have led right to the hoop. slimm44's roster re-do sparked this idea.

i'll have to do some testing over the next few days... i'll let you guys know how it goes.

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

you know, i was wondering about tendencies the other day.... not slider tendencies, but player tendencies. if you take a look at a player's dribble tendencies, i think they're all screwed up. my new theory is that if you set everything to 50 (default in this case also?), the player will do whatever move is called for in a certain situation. for example, we see the cpu players use a crossover and end up bumping into us when they should have used a spin move that would have led right to the hoop. slimm44's roster re-do sparked this idea.

i'll have to do some testing over the next few days... i'll let you guys know how it goes.

Go check out this thread, it should cover most of your questions; http://www.operationsports.com/forum...cy-update.html

But to speak on what your talking about; the dribble tendencies are jacked up, but you cannot determine which move a player will do in any situation, the best we can do is scale the dribble tendencies so that players will use some moves more than others.

[slimm44]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

you know, i was wondering about tendencies the other day.... not slider tendencies, but player tendencies. if you take a look at a player's dribble tendencies, i think they're all screwed up. my new theory is that if you set everything to 50 (default in this case also?), the player will do whatever move is called for in a certain situation. for example, we see the cpu players use a crossover and end up bumping into us when they should have used a spin move that would have led right to the hoop. slimm44's roster re-do sparked this idea.

i'll have to do some testing over the next few days... i'll let you guys know how it goes.

You noticed! I didn't know if anybody would notice that. I lowered ALL dribble tendencies for all players to 0 and the results were a much more contextally-accurate dribbling system. Setting them at 0 doesn't mean those moves are never triggered, it means that they're never triggered more than that baseline the AI was given in the first place. Personally, I think it looks MUCH more realistic.

Good lookin' out, man.

[lostsoul]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

thanks jason, that looks like an interesting read. at least it would give the game more variety and as slimm said make it look more realistic.

You noticed! I didn't know if anybody would notice that. I lowered ALL dribble tendencies for all players to 0 and the results were a much more contextally-accurate dribbling system. Setting them at 0 doesn't mean those moves are never triggered, it means that they're never triggered more than that baseline the AI was given in the first place. Personally, I think it looks MUCH more realistic.

Good lookin' out, man.

haha, i did notice - it was actually the first thing i looked at when i d/led your tendency update. tbh i was always scared to change any numbers there because i was afraid it would upset the delicate balance of the game (well, what little balance there is). i find it funny that 2k tried to match a player's life-like tendencies when in actuality smart players use whatever move is called for in that certain situation. i've also always wondered why in 2k12 when wade would drive on me, get bumped halfway to the basket and use five or six consecutive crossovers that lead nowhere lol (dwade's xover rating is way too high i think it was 94).

so are you saying that a zero rating is more of a 'default' in this scenario than 50? it's really hard to gauge... i mean, i guess everyone would play the same if evertyhing in their tendency column were set to fifty and the game would seem pretty boring and flat because some of those tendencies DO help define a player. but on the other hand, i imagine there would be so much more variety.

i haven't even really gotten a chance to test out your roster tendencies because i've been so intrigued messing with my own, lol.

[JasonWilliams55]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

You noticed! I didn't know if anybody would notice that. I lowered ALL dribble tendencies for all players to 0 and the results were a much more contextally-accurate dribbling system. Setting them at 0 doesn't mean those moves are never triggered, it means that they're never triggered more than that baseline the AI was given in the first place. Personally, I think it looks MUCH more realistic.

Good lookin' out, man.

Interesting, gonna have to plug in your roster tonight and do some testing.

[Matty Aqua]

Re: Understanding slider coefficients

Hey Jason - This is some great Insight...thanks for sharing!.

I've always wondered how much All-Star and other difficulties effects thing!

I think the addition of "Sig Skills" would also create madness with ratings above Pro difficulty... due to the fact they also effect Ratings...which is most likely why some people are struggling to find a consistency on All-Star.

Basically leads me to think to keep the CPU playing to there "true ratings" it would be best to stick to Pro/Sim settings?...