Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

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  • yiy1156
    All Star
    • Mar 2014
    • 6483

    #346
    Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

    Originally posted by ActionJack
    But is there a real, pragmatic reason with some basis behind it?

    Them not being draftable is an arbitrary reason. It doesn't make any intrinsic sense. It's a "because I said so" kind of thing.

    NWGD- would you mind sharing the reasoning behind not making MVP/RS/All Star cards non actionable? What's the benefit to you/us?

    It benefits them because credits can only be obtained through buying(daily bonus too little)

    They don't want them to be auctioned because they don't want you to get rid of your normal stars to buy them on the AH, they have to be purchased through packs, that way, since the AH is now over, they'll get more money with these packs

    And they don't want everyone to have a full mvp pro lineup without spending money
    mynba2k14:
    IGN: yiy1156
    QG Record: 20044-3814
    Epics: 26 (1 support)
    Epic Pros: 1 (midyear Tereke Evans)
    Drafted Epics: 24
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    Rivals: MJ, Duncan, Ewing, Dirk, KD

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    • redsox4evur
      Hall Of Fame
      • Jul 2013
      • 18169

      #347
      Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

      Originally posted by ActionJack
      But is there a real, pragmatic reason with some basis behind it?

      Them not being draftable is an arbitrary reason. It doesn't make any intrinsic sense. It's a "because I said so" kind of thing.

      NWGD- would you mind sharing the reasoning behind not making MVP/RS/All Star cards non actionable? What's the benefit to you/us?
      The benefit to them for All Stars is that you have to keep buying the All Star if you want to make it pro. And would they get the tax which would would be anywhere from 750-1500 credits or the credits that they would get 100% of when you buy the pack hoping for the small chance that you card you need to make pro. Which from my guess would be way more than them allowing these cards to be sold in the AH and depending on the tier getting between 750-1500 credits. And that's just for All Stars. So they are losing money by putting those cards in the AH. Whereas all the cards that could be put in the AH you could get by grinding through the game and drafting them or winning them in seasons. Like you said to me when I said something about them giving credits to us for playing games, Cat Daddy is a business. They're not gonna make it so that you don't have to spend money ever, and you get everything you want.
      Follow me on Twitter

      Comment

      • ActionJack
        Pro
        • Mar 2014
        • 586

        #348
        Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

        Originally posted by redsox4evur
        The benefit to them for All Stars is that you have to keep buying the All Star if you want to make it pro. And would they get the tax which would would be anywhere from 750-1500 credits or the credits that they would get 100% of when you buy the pack hoping for the small chance that you card you need to make pro. Which from my guess would be way more than them allowing these cards to be sold in the AH and depending on the tier getting between 750-1500 credits. And that's just for All Stars. So they are losing money by putting those cards in the AH. Whereas all the cards that could be put in the AH you could get by grinding through the game and drafting them or winning them in seasons. Like you said to me when I said something about them giving credits to us for playing games, Cat Daddy is a business. They're not gonna make it so that you don't have to spend money ever, and you get everything you want.
        Believe me, I'm not losing sight of the fact that they're a business.

        This isn't about giving us what we want for free.

        1. For RS/MVP/All Stars to even enter the market, SOMEBODY has to buy them.

        2. The fact that we can't auction them is a HUGE reason not to buy them. The sales of these packs are absolutely lower than they would be, if the cards were auctionable. This is unquestionable. These cards are harder to Pro (why buy?) and you can't sell them when you're done with them (why buy?).

        This is just a matter of doing something to make the customer happy, that also makes the product more viable. The question is whether or not the boost in sales would be significant enough to offset the loss in percentage (from 100% take, to some smaller number based on whatever rake they're gonna take, how many times these cards sell, and how much they sell for on AH).

        It seems like it would benefit their business to open it up, and it would benefit the players, but obviously I don't work there, so they know more about the specific numbers than I ever could.

        I think all the cards should be auctionable, except RC cards.. though something has to be done about RC too. That's obviously a separate discussion, but I stopped caring about RC weeks ago, once I got a couple of Star Pros. Now that a much larger percentage of players has reached the point where RC doesn't help them, CDs gotta come up with something here. They can roll out popular players for the time being (I'm sure people will play hard for KD regardless of their need for cards), but something's gotta shake soon.
        Last edited by ActionJack; 02-23-2015, 05:48 PM.

        Comment

        • redsox4evur
          Hall Of Fame
          • Jul 2013
          • 18169

          #349
          Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

          Originally posted by ActionJack
          Believe me, I'm not losing sight of the fact that they're a business.

          This isn't about giving us what we want for free.

          1. For RS/MVP/All Stars to even enter the market, SOMEBODY has to buy them.

          2. The fact that we can't auction them is a HUGE reason not to buy them. The sales of these packs are absolutely lower than they would be, if the cards were auctionable. This is unquestionable. These cards are harder to Pro (why buy?) and you can't sell them when you're done with them (why buy?).

          This is just a matter of doing something to make the customer happy, that also makes the product more viable. The question is whether or not the boost in sales would be significant enough to offset the loss in percentage (from 100% take, to some smaller number based on whatever rake they're gonna take, how many times these cards sell, and how much they sell for on AH).

          It seems like it would benefit their business to open it up, and it would benefit the players, but obviously I don't work there, so they know more about the specific numbers than I ever could.

          I think all the cards should be auctionable, except RC cards.. though something has to be done about RC too. That's obviously a separate discussion, but I stopped caring about RC weeks ago, once I got a couple of Star Pros. Now that a much larger percentage of players has reached the point where RC doesn't help them, CDs gotta come up with something here. They can roll out popular players for the time being (I'm sure people will play hard for KD regardless of their need for cards), but something's gotta shake soon.
          Yea I just copied and pasted your whole quote.

          But to your point about not selling them you can either keep them and use them or just use for training. And your right during the AH Beta there sales are probably down. But when the Beta ends they will go right back up because people will be buying the packs because they missed out during the AH period. And it doesn't help CD at all if they open up the AH for those cards, because as I stated in my other post you spend 2500 for All Star Packs and you can't pro the player unless you buy another pack. And the chances of getting that dupe are astronomical. So people have to keep buying packs until they can dupe their card. It's as simple as that. Let's say you get an All Star in the Star tier, which is less than a 10% chance of happening. Now you have a good card that will be in your lineup for awhile, until you get a line of up all star pros. So if you want to pro that card, you have to keep buying all star packs at 2,500 a piece and hope you get that one specific card. And you have less than a 1% chance of getting that star tier card you need to pro. So it is going to cost a lot more credits than being able to go to the AH and spending either 5,000 credits or less if you do the common trade. So for CD it makes so much more sense to not allow these cards to go to the auction house.
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          Comment

          • ActionJack
            Pro
            • Mar 2014
            • 586

            #350
            Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

            You're operating under the belief that people will actually DO that.

            Given the fact that your chances of getting a Pro (the only thing that helps most players, especially those that spend actual money on this) are sooooooo tiny, I think rather than playing out the scenario you just laid out... most people choose to just not buy the packs.

            So yes... From the pool of players that currently buy these packs, making them unauctionable allows CD to rack up sales, and it has the absolute benefit of clearing credits from the market. Any other sale will clear some credits, but recycle most. These sales completely clear them. That's the benefit to CD. I'm not missing that.

            My argument is that opening the packs up to auction will increase sales of the packs, because way more people will be willing to buy them. As it is, it is just unquestionably stupid to buy a Record Setter pack. Sure, people do it anyway.. but it is objectively stupid, just given the odds of getting something worthwhile. If you don't think that the fact that it's objectively stupid, keeps sales down, I think you're mistaken.

            Now again, I don't work there. I don't know the figures... but I have to believe that opening these up for auction would make these cards so much more desirable to everyone, which necessitates a raise in pack sales because that's the only way they're gonna enter the market.

            On top of that, these individual cards would probably sell on the AH for well above CDs market price. With CD taking their rake, they still are able to clear a significant amount of credits from the market on each transaction (which is their goal, business wise).

            It's nowhere near as "simple as that", as you put it, describing how some guy will make the objectively bad decision to pour money down the toilet over and over again, buying these packs from CD.

            There's way more to it.

            Comment

            • eVizions
              MVP
              • Apr 2008
              • 1257

              #351
              Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

              Originally posted by ActionJack
              You're operating under the belief that people will actually DO that.

              Given the fact that your chances of getting a Pro (the only thing that helps most players, especially those that spend actual money on this) are sooooooo tiny, I think rather than playing out the scenario you just laid out... most people choose to just not buy the packs.

              So yes... From the pool of players that currently buy these packs, making them unauctionable allows CD to rack up sales, and it has the absolute benefit of clearing credits from the market. Any other sale will clear some credits, but recycle most. These sales completely clear them. That's the benefit to CD. I'm not missing that.

              My argument is that opening the packs up to auction will increase sales of the packs, because way more people will be willing to buy them. As it is, it is just unquestionably stupid to buy a Record Setter pack. Sure, people do it anyway.. but it is objectively stupid, just given the odds of getting something worthwhile. If you don't think that the fact that it's objectively stupid, keeps sales down, I think you're mistaken.

              Now again, I don't work there. I don't know the figures... but I have to believe that opening these up for auction would make these cards so much more desirable to everyone, which necessitates a raise in pack sales because that's the only way they're gonna enter the market.

              On top of that, these individual cards would probably sell on the AH for well above CDs market price. With CD taking their rake, they still are able to clear a significant amount of credits from the market on each transaction (which is their goal, business wise).

              It's nowhere near as "simple as that", as you put it, describing how some guy will make the objectively bad decision to pour money down the toilet over and over again, buying these packs from CD.

              There's way more to it.
              The reason why RS/All Star/MVP cards will never be available on the auction house is because they represent the "final level" of the game. If you have 10 Star Pros (whether you earned them or bought them), you've essentially finished the game. As soon as you introduce another set of cards that are better than regular Stars, you've now created something else to strive for. Aside from using cash to get them, guys will begin auctioning off their Stars and Star Pros and using the profits to buy these packs. For the top players, it now stops being "how many Star Pros do you have?" and becomes "how many MVP Pros do you have?". Once you've got 10 MVP Pros, the only person who can beat you is Syd and anyone else willing to pay and grind for top 5 finishes. You have to always keep something elusive, yet available for people to strive for.

              Comment

              • ActionJack
                Pro
                • Mar 2014
                • 586

                #352
                Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

                I guess..... I still think the scarcity of the cards would keep their mystique.

                As somebody who entered AH with a bunch of Star Pros never having bought a pack, I did spend every credit I earned on MVP Packs. That had more to do with the fact that I didn't think it made sense to buy cards on AH though. With seasons, I basically get 5 free Stars per week, and I was racking up Pros as it was.. no reason to spend my credits on stuff I'd get for free anyway.

                So maybe that's the motivation. I still think it'd be better to open it up.

                Why can't I sell my Daily Bonus Rookies though?

                Comment

                • Melcho
                  Pro
                  • Feb 2015
                  • 501

                  #353
                  Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

                  People are crafty.

                  It's been interesting watching the AH from day 1 to where it got to, hell you can even cash out or buy credits direct from users if there is trust between the two parties.

                  I agreed with most tho, different minimums for pro/single, and tweak the tier pricing a little (potentially effects packs as well).

                  Overall I think the AH is good, it's been fun trading and hustling on it and I've rebuilt my QG lineup and gutted my season team thanks to it.

                  Comment

                  • Melcho
                    Pro
                    • Feb 2015
                    • 501

                    #354
                    Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

                    Originally posted by eVizions
                    The reason why RS/All Star/MVP cards will never be available on the auction house is because they represent the "final level" of the game. If you have 10 Star Pros (whether you earned them or bought them), you've essentially finished the game. As soon as you introduce another set of cards that are better than regular Stars, you've now created something else to strive for. Aside from using cash to get them, guys will begin auctioning off their Stars and Star Pros and using the profits to buy these packs. For the top players, it now stops being "how many Star Pros do you have?" and becomes "how many MVP Pros do you have?". Once you've got 10 MVP Pros, the only person who can beat you is Syd and anyone else willing to pay and grind for top 5 finishes. You have to always keep something elusive, yet available for people to strive for.
                    Correct. NWGameDad said this on Twitter to someone too, basically unless you have all the MVPs, RS etc, you haven't "finished" the game.

                    Comment

                    • Kabington
                      Rookie
                      • Feb 2015
                      • 299

                      #355
                      Re: Update 5 Release Notes and Auction House Beta

                      Originally posted by Kabington
                      What s supposed to happen after the beta?
                      Next steps and timeline?
                      Further information?
                      send me a pm if my grammar or words are wrong... really

                      Comment

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