Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

[Court_vision]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

You're right about the West.

I actually think a team from the East may win it all this season.

Simply because the west is going to be a WAR.

Phoenix, Dallas, Spurs, Lakers, Rockets, Nuggets...right now, they are all better than any team in the East IMO.

Even the T-Wolves would be a force in the east.

The west play offs will be brutal...lots of 7 game series.

Meanwhile, a team like Miami or Detroit could get on a roll and cruise through the east...make the finals and have much fresher legs.

Kind of like last season where the Mavs beat the best team in San Antonio...and then ran out of gas against a weaker Miami team who'd had a ridiculously easy run through the play offs.

[Gilateen]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

Whoever wins the MVP wont win the Championship.

So the MVP is irrelevant.

[Gilateen]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

Kind of like last season where the Mavs beat the best team in San Antonio...and then ran out of gas against a weaker Miami team who'd had a ridiculously easy run through the play offs.

So thats the new excuse huh?

[Quick6]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

and Dirk's numbers have been every bit as good as Nash's if not better (just depends if assists are more important than points scored and rebounds)

Comparing a PF to a PG? Numbers are gonna be skewed, Dirk is 9 inches taller than Nash (rebounds + blocks), plus he shoots more. Whats even more amazing is how well the Suns as a whole move the ball, I've seen MANY times where Nash set someone up who could've taken and made the shot only for that person to make the extra pass, in theory taking away another assist for Nash.

[Quick6]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

i agree. Howard should be an all-star but Marion is slightly ahead of him imo...and Marion is the glue for the Suns running style.

this brings me to yet another question.. the Suns have the 2 time MVP (or perhaps the 3 time MVP, Magic Johnson territory)...3 out of 5 of their starters are all-stars, and they have two of the best young players in the NBA in Diaw and Barbosa. It's amazing that the Suns dont just run away with the western conference. I wonder what is standing in Phoenix's way?

Dude they're 30-8!!! Take away their 1-5 start (caused by Amare coming back and Diaw being out of shape) and they're 29-3. Really what more do you want?

[Quick6]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

Nash is above everyone else? why isnt Nash's team above everyone else? and why was his former team immediately better and how did they become a contender immediately after Nash left?

OK it's getting it's just getting tiring. Nash is above everyone else cause he took a terrible team and made them instant contenders overnight. No other player in the NBA could have done what Nash has done in Phx. Last year it was widely held that the Suns would win it all, until Amare went down. They will be at the top after June and you'll have to eat crow. The the eight losses were by a total of 40 points (40 points you see bigger point differentials in a single game), with 3 of those games coming in overtime. Yeah these Suns SUCK!

[Quick6]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

I really, really dislike the fact that Nash has won two MVPs in a row.

Only cause you really really don't know basketball. I have some polish doughnut tree seeds for you. (Cheerios)

[thelwig14]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

Only cause you really really don't know basketball. I have some polish doughnut tree seeds for you. (Cheerios)

I don't agree with that sentiment. If someone says that they dislike the fact that Nash has won two MVP's in a row, you have to respect why they said it. I do because Nash is one of the worst defenders in the NBA and is statistics are bloated due to the style of basketball Phoenix plays. Nash is awesome, there is no doubt, but it is rather easy to see the anti-Nash arguments as long as they also understand he is great, but just has faults.

And you made the argument that Phoenix was awful and Nash single handedly took them to the next level. It can also be said that his teammates and their style of basketball took Nash to a whole level. It goes both ways.

People tend to forget that Terry takes his lunch money, when Nash was in Dallas Mike Bibby bent him over repeatedly, etc.....

Nash is awesome, there is no doubt, but until he wins it all, I don't you can win it all with him at the point because he will do well, but you are guaranteeing the other point will go off and create havoc.

[Pointguard]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

Dirk is always in the discussion. No whether he's in the discussion as a top 2-3 candidate, that can be debated.

He was #3 two years ago and #2 last year (If I remember corectly).

He's no doubt a top 3 candidate. There should be any debate about that. His team is by far a top 2 team, right now on pace for 66 wins, and he's playing the best basketball of his career right now. The only debate right now is if he's going to win it. I guarnetee he'll finish top 3, most likely its going to be Nash or Dirk.

[Pointguard]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

The only reason it might even be CLOSE this year, is because Marion is JUST hitting his stride. For the first time in a long time, Marion is not averaging 20 and 10. But besides that, he still has the edge over Howard in my book. I think Howard is an amazing player (I describe him as a pest), but Shawn's got the edge still I think.

Howard's got 19 and 7, shooting 46% FG and 39% 3PT, with 1 steal and 1 block per game. Howard has HUGE impact on the Mavericks though.

Marion, on the other hand, is at 19 and 9 (guaranteed 20 and 10 by the end of the year anyway), shooting 52% from the field, 32% from 3PT (why he continues to shoot threes is beyond me), and 2 steals/1 block a game.

It's pretty darn close, when it's usually not. I'll still give the edge to Marion though, because he doesn't have specific plays run for him, and still does all of this. Howard has the ball much more often. Then again, that's just how things go.

That's me being objective, but if you want me to be a homer, Marion all the f'n way.

While Nash is the facilitator, Marion is the glue.

I almost guarentee both players, Shawn Marion and Josh Howard, will make it this year. Though, alot of that depends on how the coaches will vote with Carmelo and him missing 15 games.

[Brandon13]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

He was #3 two years ago and #2 last year (If I remember corectly).

I think LeBron was #2 last year.

[Kalon]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

Right now, I have 5 candidates. In no order

Kobe
Lebron
Arenas
Dirk
Nash

I honestly think that IF the nuggets gel really good AI has a shot. That's probable tho.

[ZB9]

Re: Question to the House: Why Isn't Dirk in MVP Discussion?

OK it's getting it's just getting tiring. Nash is above everyone else cause he took a terrible team and made them instant contenders overnight. No other player in the NBA could have done what Nash has done in Phx. Last year it was widely held that the Suns would win it all, until Amare went down.

that was 3 years ago when Nash took over the terrible Phoenix team. He won an MVP 3 years ago for that. That is not a factor any more. The Suns have a good coach and a loaded roster now.

and no other player could do what Duncan is doing in SA or what Dirk is doing in Dallas either. Take those two players off of their teams and both of those teams would probably struggle to make the playoffs as well as Phoenix without Nash.

btw, if Nash is carrying that team alone and their roster is so terrible without Nash, then I guess no one else from the Suns except for Nash should ever be considered for the all-star game? and if Dirk's supporting cast is the main argument against Dirk then Dallas should have more than one all-star

They will be at the top after June and you'll have to eat crow.

i doubt you will eat any crow if they arent

The the eight losses were by a total of 40 points (40 points you see bigger point differentials in a single game), with 3 of those games coming in overtime. Yeah these Suns SUCK!

including 0-2 against Dallas so far this year..and they were eliminated by Dallas in the playoffs last year. Dirk has scoreboard on Phoenix right now.

as far as the Suns winning the championship, there is obviously a long way to go and Phoenix is going to have to improve their rebounding quite a bit by playoff time for them to win the west. imo, They will not be able to win the west or a championship if they are outrebounded. and you have to hope that Nash doesnt break down in the playoffs like he usually did for Dallas and like he did last year for the Suns. although, having a healthy Amare back does help. we'll see what happens. The West is obviously really good this year, again. Phoenix obviously has a shot, but they will have to beat Dallas and/or SA which they havent had much success with over the past couple of years.

my point is that there are other teams and other players besides the Suns and Nash. Him winning 3 straight MVPs would be ridiculous imo. If the Suns had been dominating in the past couple of seasons and winning any championships then i could see them dominating the biggest award in the NBA. but not when the Suns havent even been the best team in the west over the past 3 seasons. SA and Dallas have been the class of the West in the past 3 seasons and again if you take Duncan off of the Spurs and Dirk off of the Mavs both teams would probably struggle to make the playoffs. and dont act like the Suns are only Nash. The Suns do have a loaded team with one of the best coaches in the league and a system that puts up big offensive stats.

and again, before someone comes back with "well the Mavs havent won any NBA championships either" my response is that Dallas hasnt had any MVPs either. Hell, Dallas hasnt even had any more than ONE player on the all-star team in the last three seasons combined.