The LeBron James Thread

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  • jeebs9
    Fear is the Unknown
    • Oct 2008
    • 47568

    #8866
    We're going through this again...i thought we moved on lol

    Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
    Hands Down....Man Down - 2k9 memories
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IHP_5GUBQo

    Comment

    • ex carrabba fan
      I'll thank him for you
      • Oct 2004
      • 32744

      #8867
      Re: The LeBron James Thread

      Jamison a Robin [at the time when he joined Cleveland]? On which planet. Numbers mean little to nothing. He and Gilbert racked up numbers and played me first ball 24/7 in those days in Washington. I think some people get caught up in what ex-Cavs players had been in the past on previous teams [Shaq/Jamison] compared to the state that they were actually in once they joined the Cavs.

      Gil/Jamison/Butler were skilled players just not winners. That Washington team was the epitome of loserville. Jamison was not trash by any means, but he certainly wasn't a Robin on a championship team with no other help besides Mo Williams.

      Now if LeBron had gotten Jamison two years prior [2007-2009 were his best years], I do believe Jamison could have been a hell of a lot more effective. When Cleveland got him he was just entering that period of going downhill. Not to mention the fact that Cleveland only had him for half a year.

      On the topic of Mo Williams, he can thank LeBron for that one All-Star appearance of his career. He was certainly a hell of a shooter... but that's where it ends. I mean when his shot was off, what else could he really do? Get to the FT line? No. Create offense for others? No. Create shots for himself? No. Run an effective half court set? No. Play decent defense? No.
      Originally posted by Jasong7777
      Lebron doesn't make his teammates better. He never has. Matter of fact, it's quite the opposite. Wade and Lebron are useless off the ball. They both need the ball to be effective.
      LeBron has done more with less than any other player not named Steve Nash in the past decade. Please tell me someone who has done more than James with less? There is not one player you can name that could have taken the same Cavs team to the finals as James had against the Spurs.

      There is not one player that could have taken the Cavs team to back to back 60+ win regular seasons. Not one.

      Comment

      • Muzyk23
        MVP
        • Feb 2003
        • 4192

        #8868
        Re: The LeBron James Thread

        ^^ there was that guy named Allen..uhh..ehmmm..eeee..Iverson I think

        that year, in the playoffs the only guy not injured on the team was a rookie called Raja Bell..and there was that guy named Jumaine Jones, he actually started in the finals..
        NBA

        Comment

        • jeebs9
          Fear is the Unknown
          • Oct 2008
          • 47568

          #8869
          Re: The LeBron James Thread

          Aaron Mckie, Tryone Hill, Matt Geiger, Eric Snow... I can't think of anyone else. But those guys stand out in my mind.
          Hands Down....Man Down - 2k9 memories
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IHP_5GUBQo

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          • BATMON
            Banned
            • Oct 2010
            • 1445

            #8870
            Re: The LeBron James Thread

            Jamison was over the hill when he joined Cleveland and was starting to decline when he joined the Wizards.

            Comment

            • Muzyk23
              MVP
              • Feb 2003
              • 4192

              #8871
              Re: The LeBron James Thread

              Originally posted by jeebs9
              Aaron Mckie, Tryone Hill, Matt Geiger, Eric Snow... I can't think of anyone else. But those guys stand out in my mind.
              I hope you sensed that I was pretending not remebering all those names.

              I still keep like 3 VHS tapes of 2000\2001 Philly regular season and playoffs footage. I sincerely enjoyed the ride.
              NBA

              Comment

              • ex carrabba fan
                I'll thank him for you
                • Oct 2004
                • 32744

                #8872
                Re: The LeBron James Thread

                Originally posted by Muzyk23
                ^^ there was that guy named Allen..uhh..ehmmm..eeee..Iverson I think

                that year, in the playoffs the only guy not injured on the team was a rookie called Raja Bell..and there was that guy named Jumaine Jones, he actually started in the finals..
                AI was a warrior and is in the discussion, but I would say Cleveland's success trumps his.. not to take anything away from your boy.

                I would say Jason Kidd is the one guy who can be argued, but as far as regular season domination goes, James has him beat in that category. Obviously Kidd has James beat in the making it to the finals two years in a row.. Comparing the support players, they seem to be pretty even.

                Point being, I would say LeBron does make teammates better. Saying he never has? I mean that's just not smart to say.

                Originally posted by BATMON
                Jamison was over the hill when he joined Cleveland and was starting to decline when he joined the Wizards.
                That would be the Shaq that LeBron played with. I wouldn't say Jamison was over the hill, but yes, I wouldn't call the Jamison that LeBron played with a true Robin. He was on the downhill of his career at that point... If they had a piece or two more, then Jamison could have helped tremendously. However depending on Jamison and Mo to be James' right hand men, well that just is a mismatch when you look at Boston.

                Comment

                • ex carrabba fan
                  I'll thank him for you
                  • Oct 2004
                  • 32744

                  #8873
                  Re: The LeBron James Thread

                  Originally posted by Muzyk23
                  I hope you sensed that I was pretending not remebering all those names.

                  I still keep like 3 VHS tapes of 2000\2001 Philly regular season and playoffs footage. I sincerely enjoyed the ride.
                  BTW I would kill for full games on VHS of AI during that era. I'm talking a complete library. Especially that playoff run when they went to the Finals.

                  Comment

                  • Altimus
                    Chelsea, Assemble!
                    • Nov 2004
                    • 27283

                    #8874
                    Re: The LeBron James Thread

                    Originally posted by ex carrabba fan
                    BTW I would kill for full games on VHS of AI during that era. I'm talking a complete library. Especially that playoff run when they went to the Finals.
                    I'd love a Ultimate Iverson blu ray or whatever. Would be a day 1 buy for me.

                    Comment

                    • wwharton
                      *ll St*r
                      • Aug 2002
                      • 26949

                      #8875
                      Re: The LeBron James Thread

                      Jamison averaged 21 and 9 the year he was traded to the Cavs. He averaged around 20 and 8 his years in Washington. There was SERIOUS discussion about whether he or STAT would be the better fit on the Cavs the year before the trade. You can poo poo his numbers if you want, but it just looks like a way to make your argument sound better since there's really nothing else to go by. BTW, Jamison averaged 20 and 8 for his career. I'm not suggesting he was/is the same player as he used to be but lets not act like he had a foot out the door or anything.

                      Mo Williams averaged 17 and 6 his two years before going to the Cavs (when he started getting 35+ mins/game). Went to the Cavs and scoring stayed but assists dropped to 4. I'm sorry but you can not compare these guys and even an aging Shaq to what AI had with the Sixers.

                      I'd actually go as far and continue to say the team just wasn't as bad as some want to make it out to be. Of course if you want to dissect every player to sound bad you can make it out that way... bc that's really all that's happening. Lets even switch the focus (bc this wasn't the tone before about this) to say they weren't as good as Boston, Orlando or LA. Well you don't compare positions head to head. The level of the star (Lebron is the bestest in the world right?) makes up for what's lacking in other areas. This was proven when the Cavs went to the finals with what I would even call trash. So no, Jamison probably wasn't a good robin to say Gil... or Dirk. Mo probably wasn't a good robin for say Nash. But either or both were definitely good for someone on the level of Lebron... and the other role players around them weren't chopped liver either, including the inspired Shaq in the playoffs.

                      It's funny that Perkins is now thought of as this great post defender and irreplaceable piece. If he were on last year's Cavs, what would you all be calling him?

                      Comment

                      • ex carrabba fan
                        I'll thank him for you
                        • Oct 2004
                        • 32744

                        #8876
                        Re: The LeBron James Thread

                        To keep it simple:

                        1. You focus way too much on stats and not on skill sets and seem to ignore what wins in the playoffs
                        2. You exaggerate when you say people act as if "Perkins was irreplaceable". You seem to do that a lot [exaggerate]

                        Comment

                        • da ThRONe
                          Fire LesS Miles ASAP!
                          • Mar 2009
                          • 8528

                          #8877
                          Re: The LeBron James Thread

                          Question wasn't Jamison coming off the bench for the Cavs last year? And who really thought Antwan was better than Stats?

                          The Cavs team wasn't close to being championship level. Regular season hoops and post season hoops are different animals.
                          You looking at the Chair MAN!

                          Number may not tell the whole story ,but they never lie either.

                          Comment

                          • wwharton
                            *ll St*r
                            • Aug 2002
                            • 26949

                            #8878
                            Re: The LeBron James Thread

                            Originally posted by ex carrabba fan
                            To keep it simple:

                            1. You focus way too much on stats and not on skill sets and seem to ignore what wins in the playoffs
                            2. You exaggerate when you say people act as if "Perkins was irreplaceable". You seem to do that a lot [exaggerate]
                            1. No, I don't ignore anything. I've provided information involving both stats and skill sets to back an argument. You like to make light of any information that doesn't support your argument... alot.

                            2. There's a whole thread on it.

                            3. You seem to like to present a tone in a lot of your posts that really pushes the level of what's acceptable. I personally feel it's not fair to act like a mod in a discussion/debate/whatever that I'm involved in... especially since I'm not one to hold my tongue either. But I also know I've mentioned it in another case as well. In fact, I'm glad our discussion has gotten more on topic but I only even jumped into your debate here bc of your "shots" you like to throw in at the end of alot of your posts. I'm asking you nicely to just discuss/debate/argue your points without the extra at the end. I feel like everyone else respects you enough to not throw shots at you so it shouldn't be much to ask you to do the same.

                            Comment

                            • wwharton
                              *ll St*r
                              • Aug 2002
                              • 26949

                              #8879
                              Re: The LeBron James Thread

                              Originally posted by da ThRONe
                              Question wasn't Jamison coming off the bench for the Cavs last year? And who really thought Antwan was better than Stats?

                              The Cavs team wasn't close to being championship level. Regular season hoops and post season hoops are different animals.
                              No he wasn't. The thought was that Hickson should've been getting more run than Shaq (probably what you're thinking of). Either way, jumping in halfway through the season isn't a good measure of how a player could really fit in, but Mike Brown wasn't doing a good job with the rotation or the plays either way. As for Amare, the year before they were talking about trading for either and there was lots of discussion about which they should get. It came up again before Jamison was acquired and I believe they went with Jamison partly bc Lebron had been campaigning for them to get him (they also didn't want to trade Hickson).

                              Regular season and post season aren't so different that the team with the best record in the league "wasn't close to being championship level". That doesn't even make sense.

                              Comment

                              • Scott812313
                                MVP
                                • Jun 2009
                                • 1877

                                #8880
                                Re: The LeBron James Thread

                                Originally posted by Jasong7777
                                Lebron doesn't make his teammates better. He never has. Matter of fact, it's quite the opposite. Wade and Lebron are useless off the ball. They both need the ball to be effective.
                                Exactly. I've always said this same thing. People confuse assist numbers with making other players better. Take the 08 Olympic team for example, we all know the struggles the National team had the previous 3 or 4 international tournaments "led" by LeBron. Kobe comes in and was absolutely the alpha dog on that team and carried them to the gold. But since LeBron averages more assists (because he has the ball in his hand 90% of the time), he must be more able to make players around him better....
                                "In the morning he would read the Bible with another coach. Then, in the afternoon, he would go out and cheat kids who had probably saved up money from mowing lawns to buy those raffle tickets. That's Jim Tressel."

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