The LeBron James Thread

[wwharton]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

I point this years problem with taking over the game because of the zone. When a team plays zone on you. Your suppose to move the ball around. Your just not going to have the same chance Jordan had to take over the game. In a man to man defense the chances (isolation) are move likely to take over the game. Zone defenses totally take away this factor. Back in the day you could probably get away with more hero ball compared to now days. When ball movement is so much more important. The illegal defense kept defenses from closing driving lanes down.

Also this is not an excuse. LeBron had severally chances to prove himself clutch in this years finals. I'm just bring up a point that we should consider. The game is totally different for starsupers now a days compared to back then.

This just is not true, jeebs. Just bc a player can't Iso at the wing or top of the key, watch the clock wind down like it's a movie and play one on one doesn't mean a star can't shine against a zone.

Any player that knows how to move without the ball should be able to shine against a zone. You know your spots, and you can move to them and be ready to shoot or drive as soon as you catch the ball. It's also impossible to keep your best defender on the best offensive player which should make it even easier. It's not the zone's fault that James couldn't back down JJ or Terry. Even if you're not moving to your spot for jumpers, you can post up on the high or low post and completely destroy a zone if you've got a superstar basketball IQ.

The zone didn't just start in the NBA today but few teams play it much... there's a reason for that. It was a great move to go zone against this year's Heat, but without the right pieces AND playing against many teams, it's a very, very bad idea.

[Yeah...THAT Guy]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Who said he's Rondo? And no, he doesn't have one of the best mid range shots in the game. I could name a ton of players I rather have taking a mid range shot with the clock going down. Driving to the rim is a different story though.

I think he's actually #7 in the league in mid-range efficiency from wingmen. #1 is Jason Terry. (from 16-23 feet)

[1Rose]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Lol. Wasn't trying to do that, and I definitely see where you are coming from though.

Regardless, whatever defense was out there, whether they were throwing the man to man out there, or switching to the zone, LeBron really wasn't doing much of anything regardless.

I was simply referring to how easy the stars have it, how many calls they get, the flopping and ticky tack fouls given to the big name players, and no hand checking that used to be allowed...etc, etc.

[Altimus]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Ton was over exaggeration on my part. But still, LBJ has a lot of work to do with his shot and back to the basket game which is non-existent.

With that he's young, as I said, let his career play on.

[Yeah...THAT Guy]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Ton was over exaggeration on my part. But still, LBJ has a lot of work to do with his shot and back to the basket game which is non-existent.

With that he's young, as I said, let his career play on.

Definitely true. I think some of the success in his mid-range game is due to teams being willing to let him shoot mid-range shots as long as he isn't getting to the rim. I'll give him credit for improving his shot a good amount since he came into the league, but despite having a higher percentage, I don't think his shot is anywhere near Kobe's. Defenses don't want to give Kobe a mid-range shot and he makes them anyway, whereas a lot of defenses will give LeBron the mid-range.

And I don't think it's even necessary for me to go into his back to the basket game...

[da ThRONe]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Ton was over exaggeration on my part. But still, LBJ has a lot of work to do with his shot and back to the basket game which is non-existent.

With that he's young, as I said, let his career play on.

As far as LeBron's mid range game he just needs to use it more. Sure it can be improved, but his post game needs the most work.

I'm sorry I have been a big supporter of Lebron(was even called an apologist), but his age can't justify his "taking my ball and going home" attitude. Because at the end of the day this is what killed the Heat.

[mKoz26]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

First of all, Kerr said it not me. Where was his shot throughout the Finals? But that's beside the point. His opinion of LBJ being closer to Pippen's game than Jordan is correct I believe. Not talking about talent VS talent. I've always taught that LBJ was closer to Magic over anyone else.

I never said he has no mid range shot so check your facts. His mid range shot leaves much to be desired.

Also I never said I'd take a ton of players over LBJ, just over a final possession mid range shot. One that comes immediately to mind is Carmelo.

You said Kerr was pretty spot on. What I take from that is that you agree with what he said. If not, I'd expect that you clarify, or, as has happened, you may confuse someone.

The "where was LeBron's shot in the Finals" argument is not going to prove anything about his shot alone because the Finals are an incredibly small sample size. If you want to talk about his Finals play, that's different. But we're talking about his mid-range shot.

"I could name a ton of players I rather have taking a mid range shot with the clock going down."

^That's just a way to make things subjective. The objective way shows that LeBron is very efficient from mid-range. You just wouldn't remember it because you believe impression that the Finals left you, rather than the entire 82 game sample size he just gave you.

BTW Carmelo shot 2% lower than LeBron this year when he was with DEN and 5% lower when he was with NYK.

[jeebs9]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

This just is not true, jeebs. Just bc a player can't Iso at the wing or top of the key, watch the clock wind down like it's a movie and play one on one doesn't mean a star can't shine against a zone.

Any player that knows how to move without the ball should be able to shine against a zone. You know your spots, and you can move to them and be ready to shoot or drive as soon as you catch the ball. It's also impossible to keep your best defender on the best offensive player which should make it even easier. It's not the zone's fault that James couldn't back down JJ or Terry. Even if you're not moving to your spot for jumpers, you can post up on the high or low post and completely destroy a zone if you've got a superstar basketball IQ.

The zone didn't just start in the NBA today but few teams play it much... there's a reason for that. It was a great move to go zone against this year's Heat, but without the right pieces AND playing against many teams, it's a very, very bad idea.

WTF!!! I just had a whole reply to this post get deleted twice now!!! I'm not even going to try to re type that again!! /rant

edit: Is this the longest thread on OS. 1000 pages!!

[wwharton]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

As far as LeBron's mid range game he just needs to use it more. Sure it can be improved, but his post game needs the most work.

I'm sorry I have been a big supporter of Lebron(was even called an apologist), but his age can't justify his "taking my ball and going home" attitude. Because at the end of the day this is what killed the Heat.

I agree. He's not completely in his prime as a basketball player but he's a "grown *** man" as Ced would say. He acts like a 12 year old far too often.

[1Rose]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

This just is not true, jeebs. Just bc a player can't Iso at the wing or top of the key, watch the clock wind down like it's a movie and play one on one doesn't mean a star can't shine against a zone.

Any player that knows how to move without the ball should be able to shine against a zone. You know your spots, and you can move to them and be ready to shoot or drive as soon as you catch the ball. It's also impossible to keep your best defender on the best offensive player which should make it even easier. It's not the zone's fault that James couldn't back down JJ or Terry. Even if you're not moving to your spot for jumpers, you can post up on the high or low post and completely destroy a zone if you've got a superstar basketball IQ.

The zone didn't just start in the NBA today but few teams play it much... there's a reason for that. It was a great move to go zone against this year's Heat, but without the right pieces AND playing against many teams, it's a very, very bad idea.

And all this...

[Drewski]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Ton was over exaggeration on my part. But still, LBJ has a lot of work to do with his shot and back to the basket game which is non-existent.

With that he's young, as I said, let his career play on.

His back to the basket game needs to be what he spends from now until he can post up Jason Kidd (lol?) working on. His mid-range game has definitely -improved- but still not his most efficient weapon (which is driving, drawing fouls, finishing at the rim, and passing). He's clearly young and has the time to correct these fundamental flaws (having no post game, when you want to be KING James, simply is unacceptable). Common rudiments to his game, he is simply missing entirely. I could see if he had a limited arsenal in the post, but it's non-existant (like rings on his fingers OHHHH ). He clearly needs to find a way to get points against any defense that is going after him (what elite players do, I don't think you'd ever see Jordan punk out because Jason Kidd was covering him in a zone scheme, come on MAN), once he has a few go to things besides power through the middle of a defense, he'll be a much more sound player. Can't rely on what he relies on, a spotty 3 ball, a deceptively effective (I guess, but I don't know of many people who applaud James' mid range game, even if he's 7th in the league statistically) mid range, and driving.

Needs some footwork. Needs some post work. Needs some go to cards. Same point thats been hammered down to dust over and over in this thread by me and many others.

[Altimus]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

You said Kerr was pretty spot on. What I take from that is that you agree with what he said. If not, I'd expect that you clarify, or, as has happened, you may confuse someone.

The "where was LeBron's shot in the Finals" argument is not going to prove anything about his shot alone because the Finals are an incredibly small sample size. If you want to talk about his Finals play, that's different. But we're talking about his mid-range shot.

"I could name a ton of players I rather have taking a mid range shot with the clock going down."

^That's just a way to make things subjective. The objective way shows that LeBron is very efficient from mid-range. You just wouldn't remember it because you believe impression that the Finals left you, rather than the entire 82 game sample size he just gave you.

BTW Carmelo shot 2% lower than LeBron this year when he was with DEN and 5% lower when he was with NYK.

My mistake, I agree with Kerr's take on the player comparison then him saying he has no mid range shot. I'm not saying he isn't efficient, it's just this. When defenses prepare for him, they want him to take those shots. There's something to be said with that.

[Altimus]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

As far as LeBron's mid range game he just needs to use it more. Sure it can be improved, but his post game needs the most work.

I'm sorry I have been a big supporter of Lebron(was even called an apologist), but his age can't justify his "taking my ball and going home" attitude. Because at the end of the day this is what killed the Heat.

LBJ shrunk mentally. LBJ needs to go away from his inner circle and get some true guidance on life and the game.

It doesn't justify it but there is plenty of time for improvement!

[airjoca]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Does LeBron need a "Phil Jackson"?

[jeebs9]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

This just is not true, jeebs. Just bc a player can't Iso at the wing or top of the key, watch the clock wind down like it's a movie and play one on one doesn't mean a star can't shine against a zone.

Any player that knows how to move without the ball should be able to shine against a zone. You know your spots, and you can move to them and be ready to shoot or drive as soon as you catch the ball. It's also impossible to keep your best defender on the best offensive player which should make it even easier. It's not the zone's fault that James couldn't back down JJ or Terry. Even if you're not moving to your spot for jumpers, you can post up on the high or low post and completely destroy a zone if you've got a superstar basketball IQ.

The zone didn't just start in the NBA today but few teams play it much... there's a reason for that. It was a great move to go zone against this year's Heat, but without the right pieces AND playing against many teams, it's a very, very bad idea.

LBJ shrunk mentally. LBJ needs to go away from his inner circle and get some true guidance on life and the game.

It doesn't justify it but there is plenty of time for improvement!

Totally agree...