2018 Off-Season Thread

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

I just really struggle to see where Toronto gets much better from this, I don't think this is a huge upgrade. Kawhi is the better player, better defender, he has a better outside shot, but are we ignoring that DeRozan offensively has been nearly just as good, if not as good/better? Kawhi has hit 20ppg in two seasons, DeRozan has done it for 5 consecutive years now and 17+ in 8 straight seasons, where Kawhi is still only at 2 that are 17+... He's one of the most consistent scorers in the league, and he's arguably better with the ball in his hands and just as good if not better of a play-maker... We poke fun at DeRozan come playoff time and chalk him up as a not so good player, but even his playoff scoring is among the best in the league.. IDK I don't think he is getting his due here.

Even the trade machine (I know so accurate) says that Toronto's win percentage isn't effected by this trade.. IDK I just don't see why they made this move unless they honestly believe they can get him to stay.

[Majingir]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

Will take some getting used to

[King_B_Mack]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

I will say this for Toronto, this was a bold move and I have to give Masai credit for having the stones to make it. There's a lot of GMs out there who are content to be conservative and never take any risks whatsoever on anything.

At the same time though, they better pray every single night that Kawhi likes it there and stays with them. Because if he bolts the only way they'll ever get another star in Toronto again is if they draft him or manage to trade for one. Players talk in this league and they pay attention to what goes on with other franchises. DeMar saying he was lied to and shipped out the way he was after how much he loved and repped that team is going to leave a label on them that will take a long time to shake if they ever do. It's been 20 years and the Bulls STILL have to deal with the treating players bad/don't take care of their guys label stemming from the Jordan years. It's gonna be rough if Kawhi leaves.

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

How? Teams didn't want to give San Antonio anything of value for the dude, but they're going to give Toronto something at the deadline?

I don't think teams didn't want to give San Antonio something of value though, it's that San Antonio didn't want to trade him in the conference without getting away with murder and didn't want to move him to Boston for anything other than a "star".. Toronto is in a different situation entirely because if he's not staying they are basically in a position where they need to hit the rebuild button. They surely wouldn't let him walk for nothing and keep going with Lowry, Ibaka, etc while they have pieces like Van Vleet, OG, a new coach, already in a good position to start fresh. In their case, young players and future assets would be something they are interested in where that didn't seem to be the case with San Antonio.

I don't think any team will give up much at the deadline unless it's for a "go all in" on this season desperation trade. But does it have to be at the deadline? Isn't Kawhi trade-able before the season even starts? Chris Haynes already saying he has no desire to play in Toronto, I wouldn't be shocked really if he never plays a game for them.

[ojandpizza]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

I will say this for Toronto, this was a bold move and I have to give Masai credit for having the stones to make it. There's a lot of GMs out there who are content to be conservative and never take any risks whatsoever on anything.

At the same time though, they better pray every single night that Kawhi likes it there and stays with them. Because if he bolts the only way they'll ever get another star in Toronto again is if they draft him or manage to trade for one. Players talk in this league and they pay attention to what goes on with other franchises. DeMar saying he was lied to and shipped out the way he was after how much he loved and repped that team is going to leave a label on them that will take a long time to shake if they ever do. It's been 20 years and the Bulls STILL have to deal with the treating players bad/don't take care of their guys label stemming from the Jordan years. It's gonna be rough if Kawhi leaves.

Vince Carter is my favorite player to ever play in the NBA, but I don't think it's a stretch to call DeRozan the greatest Raptor after everything he's done and for how long, he holds most of their team records now as well.. And they do this to him?.. You're right, players will definitely take notice of that.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

Uh oh, here we go overhyping a player fresh off a trade. Happens every time.

[J_Posse]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

Damn I dont like losing Danny

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Meh. He had regressed as a three - point specialist and we have a logjam with guards (DeRozan, White, Walker & Forbes).

I'm shocked they couldn't get Saikam or OG in the package. A dud of a trade but at least Leonard and his "group" are finally gone.

Hope he looks like a shell of the guy he was and wishing nothing but losses....

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[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

Players took note about “Loyalty” years ago, so this trade won’t do anything to change their opinion about the subject in the first place.

[Rockie_Fresh88]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

I just really struggle to see where Toronto gets much better from this, I don't think this is a huge upgrade. Kawhi is the better player, better defender, he has a better outside shot, but are we ignoring that DeRozan offensively has been nearly just as good, if not as good/better? Kawhi has hit 20ppg in two seasons, DeRozan has done it for 5 consecutive years now and 17+ in 8 straight seasons, where Kawhi is still only at 2 that are 17+... He's one of the most consistent scorers in the league, and he's arguably better with the ball in his hands and just as good if not better of a play-maker... We poke fun at DeRozan come playoff time and chalk him up as a not so good player, but even his playoff scoring is among the best in the league.. IDK I don't think he is getting his due here.

Even the trade machine (I know so accurate) says that Toronto's win percentage isn't effected by this trade.. IDK I just don't see why they made this move unless they honestly believe they can get him to stay.

Valid point . It just depends on how good Kawhi is . I would take playoff Kawhi over playoff Derozan . Especially for those marquee matchups.

[J_Posse]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

You're selling them a bit short cause Lowry/Green/OG/Kawhi/Ibaka is a pretty nasty defensive lineup

He's selling them very, very short if Leonard is 100% and engaged. He'd automatically become the best player in the Eastern conference if healthy, plus they only lost two significant pieces to acquire him (kept OG, VanVleet, Saikam, Wright & Powell).

Also, Powell & Saikam can easily replace either Green or Ibaka defensively.

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[The 24th Letter]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

Hes upset.20180718_105749.jpg

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[ojandpizza]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

Valid point . It just depends on how good Kawhi is . I would take playoff Kawhi over playoff Derozan . Especially for those marquee matchups.

I definitely agree with that, especially with how good the SF position is in the league. Having him to match up with the likes of KD, Bron, PG, etc is a plus. But over the course of a season I don't think this alters their projected record much. Maybe if the coaching change brings about something new from that group as a whole that we didn't see over the past few years.

To me, they are a 4-5 seed in the East this year. I'll take Boston, Philly, and Indy over them. Even if the regular season records show otherwise, I still think any 3 of those teams knock them out in a playoff series.

[Majingir]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

I don't get how this will impact Raptors ability to sign FAs at all. Have guys been lining up to want to sign with them the past few years anyways? Have notable FAs met with Raptors? Raptors have to accept like many teams in the NBA that if you want a superstar, you gotta trade for them or draft them.

Would guys suddenly want to sign with them come 2020 when they have no Lowry,DeRozan,Ibaka and lots of money to spend?

Everyone knows in the NBA, you NEED an MVP to win a championship, and Kawhi is closer to an MVP than DeRozan or Lowry ever will be.


And lets all remember it's the playoffs that mean everything.
DeRozan has a true shooting % of .497 in the playoffs and a career offensive rating of 101 and defensive rating of 112 and career win share of 1.6.

Kawhi has a true shooting % of .617, offensive rating of 121, defensive rating of 102, and in his 6 years in the playoffs, he's had win shares around 3 in half of those years. And then there's the whole NBA championship thing where he was Finals MVP.

[turty11]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

did you just put norman powells name in that list like he has any value an adds anything to a playoff team? cmon J, i expect better of you after all these years.

[King_B_Mack]

Re: 2018 Off-Season Thread

Players took note about “Loyalty” years ago, so this trade won’t do anything to change their opinion about the subject in the first place.

Sure it won’t don’t much for their overall thoughts about loyalty, but if there’s specific teams you know are worse than others you’ll avoid them. If someone goes to Golden State for example, you go in knowing it’s a business and for the most part GS’ front office is going to be straight with you on what your role is and that they’re job is to do what they feel is best for the team. That’s the general expectation for any professional athlete and the franchise. However, there’s knowing that as an athlete and there’s knowing that if you sign with a certain team, they aren’t going to be straight with you. If you’re choosing teams and you can play for the one that’s generally going to be straight forward and honest with you or the one that you know for sure has a rat on it that’s going to look you in the eyes and tell you it’s sunshine and roses outside and then you walk out to Hoth from Star Wars. Which team you more likely to sign with?

That’s the spot Masai has put the Raptors in by lying to DeMar and shipping him out the way it went down.


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