If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

[ZHunter1990]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Come on guys. Can we just be honest with ourselves, and each other for a minute here...

Holding L2 + Back to generate some magical "Grapple Advantage" that somehow gives you the ability to shoot better takedowns, for no discernible reason, is a craaaazy goofy mechanic.

How can you be a legit MMA fan, and be like "Yeah, Takedowns are perfect right now!" with such an unrealistic, video gamey, mechanic in place?

We need to get rid of that silly system ENTIRELY. Takedowns need to be all about timing, not building up some invisible takedown meter before attempting a takedown..

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As a side note, I really really wish we had Intercepting Knees in this game!

It is actually L2 and forward,

I feel the need to chime in here as I am partly responsible for the mechanic working this way.

If you have spent any time doing/watching BJJ or wrestling you will notice that they keep a very low base and head leaned forward. This is because the level change for a takedown is much less telegraphed when you are already halfway there, it's also much easier to sprawl in this position as well.

Of course this isn't wrestling or BJJ so fighters dont generally run around in the same stance however, this stance is masked in MMA often by wrestlers by throwing ducking overhands and weaving under punches(Edgar and Mendes do this well)

Think about the takedown as having two parts, setting up the takedown and execution.

You mention "building up an invisible takedown meter" but dont realize that this same concept was in UFC1 you just didnt realize it. When someone threw a kick, they had less time to deny the takedown. Same exact concept but without the meter showing.

The GA makes it possible to scale takedown difficulty and timing takedowns. As opposed to having one flat timing window for takedowns.

[Haz____]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Higher percentage takedowns when the opponent is throwing a kick makes sense.

Swaying 3 strikes in a row, building up an invisible grapple meter, and scoring an auto takedown - thanks to your magic "Grapple Advantage", does not make sense.

That's not a representation of level changing at all.

[Morgan Monkman]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

It is actually L2 and forward,

I feel the need to chime in here as I am partly responsible for the mechanic working this way.

If you have spent any time doing/watching BJJ or wrestling you will notice that they keep a very low base and head leaned forward. This is because the level change for a takedown is much less telegraphed when you are already halfway there, it's also much easier to sprawl in this position as well.

Of course this isn't wrestling or BJJ so fighters dont generally run around in the same stance however, this stance is masked in MMA often by wrestlers by throwing ducking overhands and weaving under punches(Edgar and Mendes do this well)

Think about the takedown as having two parts, setting up the takedown and execution.

You mention "building up an invisible takedown meter" but dont realize that this same concept was in UFC1 you just didnt realize it. When someone threw a kick, they had less time to deny the takedown. Same exact concept but without the meter showing.

The GA makes it possible to scale takedown difficulty and timing takedowns. As opposed to having one flat timing window for takedowns.

In EA UFC 1 if you threw a kick all you had to do was hold the R2 and down soon as you kicked and they were never going to get you down.

The machinic is wacky whether or not you were trying to emulate real life.

You never see guys stand stil, bob there heads back and forth while getting punched, to attain a takedown.

[Morgan Monkman]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Grapple Advantage isn't working.

Its not good for this game and doesn't represent MMA realistically.

I mean look at all the baby punches Daniel Cormier landed on anderson silva the other weekend, by this games logic he should have been able to transition to full guard no problem and KO Anderson with 3 punches.

[ZHunter1990]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Higher percentage takedowns when the opponent is throwing a kick makes sense.

Swaying 3 strikes in a row, building up an invisible grapple meter, and scoring an auto takedown - thanks to your magic "Grapple Advantage", does not make sense.

That's not a representation of level changing at all.

There are no auto takedowns, you always have at least a small chance to stop takedowns.

Shouldn't making someone miss a strike(s) make takedowns easier? Have you never seen wrestlers do this in MMA?

[Haz____]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Grapple Advantage isn't working.

Its not good for this game and doesn't represent MMA realistically.

I mean look at all the baby punches Daniel Cormier landed on anderson silva the other weekend, by this games logic he should have been able to transition to full guard no problem and KO Anderson with 3 punches.

LOl!!!!!

[ZHunter1990]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

In EA UFC 1 if you threw a kick all you had to do was hold the R2 and down soon as you kicked and they were never going to get you down.

The machinic is wacky whether or not you were trying to emulate real life.

You never see guys stand stil, bob there heads back and forth while getting punched, to attain a takedown.

You dont gain much GA at all if you are leaning forward while getting punched.

You also cannot move while swaying your head in the game and you generally dont see people planting their feet and swaying often outside of Anderson Silva.

That is a limitation on controls for the game.

[Morgan Monkman]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

You dont gain much GA at all if you are leaning forward while getting punched.

You also cannot move while swaying your head in the game and you generally dont see people planting their feet and swaying often outside of Anderson Silva.

That is a limitation on controls for the game.

But you still gain GA, am i correct?

If you generalyl don't see people swaying... why is essential to scoring a TD in this game?

Do fighters in Real life gain grapple advantage? no. why should they in a game?

[ZHunter1990]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

But you still gain GA, am i correct?

If you generalyl don't see people swaying... why is essential to scoring a TD in this game?

Do fighters in Real life gain grapple advantage? no. why should they in a game?

No, you see fighter swaying all the time, just not with their feet planted standing in one spot.

Again that is a restriction of it being a video game.

The majority of wrestle boxers have mastered head movement mixed in with changing levels for takedowns.

[Morgan Monkman]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

No, you see fighter swaying all the time, just not with their feet planted standing in one spot.

Again that is a restriction of it being a video game.

The majority of wrestle boxers have mastered head movement mixed in with changing levels for takedowns.

Hmm.

I don't think the mechanic chosen for this game to emulate that real life skill is working out.

That's just me though.

Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk

[ZHunter1990]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Hmm.

I don't think the mechanic chosen for this game to emulate that real life skill is working out.

That's just me though.

Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk

Is it the animation of leaning forward that is bothering you? Or the ability to hold it forward forever and have GA?

When I shoot for takedowns I generally dont hold forward for long at all and anyone who does is easy to telegraph.

[manliest_Man]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Come on guys. Can we just be honest with ourselves, and each other for a minute here...

Holding L2 + Back to generate some magical "Grapple Advantage" that somehow gives you the ability to shoot better takedowns, for no discernible reason, is a craaaazy goofy mechanic.

How can you be a legit MMA fan, and be like "Yeah, Takedowns are perfect right now!" with such an unrealistic, video gamey, mechanic in place?

We need to get rid of that silly system ENTIRELY. Takedowns need to be all about timing, not building up some invisible takedown meter before attempting a takedown..

----------------

As a side note, I really really wish we had Intercepting Knees in this game!

Haz, no disrespect bro, but you always make some really awsome points, you point out the issues spot on and you say the truth and say it just how i feel, but then you ruin it and miss my upvote, with all those dumb things you come up with as solutions.

Just stick to pointing bad stuff out, your solutions are really some of the worst i've seen here, but your analysis are pretty much spot on all the time.

This solution your recommend in this thread, is not as bad as your solutions on other topics, but it just reminded me something i've wanted to point out for a long time now.

[Morgan Monkman]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Is it the animation of leaning forward that is bothering you? Or the ability to hold it forward forever and have GA?

When I shoot for takedowns I generally dont hold forward for long at all and anyone who does is easy to telegraph.

Ya the animation really bothers me, as well as the idea of grapple advantage.

I just feel like TD's should be more of a battle, not just, lean forward, gain GA, success!

[Evil97]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Timing plays a huge role also. You can take down anyone in this game with timing and GA. Look for missed strikes. Just had a fight with a guy who is 978-55 in ranked. He could not stop my takedowns once I got my timing. The only offense he had was the overpowered triangle choke short deny, witch almost won him a decision.

[trainbyday1]

Re: If you commit to a strike you shouldn't be able to stuff a TD

Timing plays a huge role also. You can take down anyone in this game with timing and GA. Look for missed strikes. Just had a fight with a guy who is 978-55 in ranked. He could not stop my takedowns once I got my timing. The only offense he had was the overpowered triangle choke short deny, witch almost won him a decision.

I think take downs are perfect the way they are at the moment and the idea it's hard to get take downs is incorrect. As long as you time your take downs and use GA to get them down it's fine. I just fought TheGarlicTwitch (135-5) also known as JonoDarby who is ranked in the top 50 on the leader boards. I got 6 of 8 take downs and finished him in full mount so getting take downs is definitely achievable with GA in its current state.

I think basically strikers will say take downs are too powerful and ground fighters will say it's not powerful enough. I think take downs using GA are perfect the way they are.