Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

Regarding moving the stick 30% vs going 100% whilst keeping the analogue 1 / 0 system as opposed to a 360 volleyball system:



Final point, going into the coloured / safe zones makes your counters deliver with damage whereas staying in the centre zone keeps them regular.

Where the colour starts, your 1 / 0 system kicks in.

Not sure if this is a good solution but it could very well be an improvement in terms of giving us more control.

Also, really struggling to remember if we are forced to go through centre line when switching so can't answer your question Solid. I do recall being annoyed that punches force your head back to centre though.

If we go with the 4 direction system, the amount we move the stick should correspond to how far our character's head moves, a quick flick should be a 100% movement to the edge of that character's head zone so a slip.

Can we have GPD see this please???(Posting again because I think we all can agree this is much better than the current system)

I think this is a very fair compromise. It’s still more movement and control but isnt changed drastically. Also need to remove when punches knock you back to centerline. If you get staggered sure but if you roll with /away from a punch you should be able to still use head movement.

To compensate for the buff to head movement just make it so that you’re at a huge disadvantage in terms of GA. Also chaining sways should take some long term stamina (head movement rating would dictate how quickly stamina depletes)

[MalformedDC2009]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

SUGATA had mentioned that he thought teh deadzone was too wide.

Maybe it would indeed improve things. Or maybe this deadzone was already optimized against accidental inputs, too. I have no idea.

Yes exactly, the dead zone is too wide. If they can set it at say 30% (where 100% is going all the way over) that would make people very happy.

And add diagonal directions that can make things feel more natural, adding to the ways to beat certain strikes. This also has the advantage of giving us more control and range of motion. A good compromise for 360 degree head movement I think.

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[TheGentlemanGhost]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

Y'all are gonna hate me, but, oddly enough... you know what those gifs showed me...UFC 3 RS flicking lol. Maybe two of them looked more like UFC's 360 movement. But look at the first one, it's basically like flicking the left and right direction on the RS during a combo.

This new system is also VERY convenient for countering combos. If you simply want head movement like we have irl, I feel like we have it. Some animations my look a little off, but we can pretty much do what the gifs show.

There wasn't a lot of lean backs like you can do way better with UFC 2's system in those gifs though. Plus leaning back sways that work with 360 is one of those things I think only the fighters with high head movements should do.

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[Serengeti1]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

Y'all are gonna hate me, but, oddly enough... you know what those gifs showed me...UFC 3 RS flicking lol. Maybe two of them looked more like UFC's 360 movement. But look at the first one, it's basically like flicking the left and right direction on the RS during a combo.

This new system is also VERY convenient for countering combos. If you simply want head movement like we have irl, I feel like we have it. Some animations my look a little off, but we can pretty much do what the gifs show.

There wasn't a lot of lean backs like you can do way better with UFC 2's system in those gifs though. Plus leaning back sways that work with 360 is one of those things I think only the fighters with high head movements should do.

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Yup. A few pretty bad examples honestly. A lot of it was just swaying to the side and ducking. Some were a better representation but yeah. I've come to the conclusion that barely anybody even understands head movement in this thread tbh. I don't know why nobody said this earlier. I also think a lot of us have different definitions of what 360 head movement is. Every fighter is capable of moving their head at all kinds of angles. Some are better at chaining slips than others. Most obviously aren't nearly as good as Cody. But only having Silva and Cody having 360 head movement does not make sense (at least under my definition). 360 head movement to me just means full angular control. And I'm pretty sure every human being has this. lol.

I'm feeling like this thread is a lost cause at this point though. Barely anybody can agree on anything. Most importantly though... We all pretty much agree there is at the least a decent amount of room for improvement with the head movement.

[GameplayDevUFC]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

SUGATA had mentioned that he thought teh deadzone was too wide.

Maybe it would indeed improve things. Or maybe this deadzone was already optimized against accidental inputs, too. I have no idea.

I haven't had a chance to look at the dead zone, but at most it will buy you one extra frame. And even then, it would probably only buy you one extra frame some of the time.

[emmdeekay]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

How can you look at these gifs and just go "Nah. We don't want that in the game. Nahhhh. Nope. Would be lame. Nah. Not even real. Only Anderson Silva uses head movement."


Reading this thread makes me feel like i'm smashing my own head into a brick wall repeatedly.

There's been 4 previous MMA games that have used 360/analog head movement in one form or another and I think UFC 3 feels miles better than them all.

I'm not convinced you can replicate complete 360 head movement in a way that would be useful, consistent and rewarding.

Just because 4 people are in every thread posting pages of gifs and patting each other on the back doesn't really change my opinion.

[Serengeti1]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

I'm not convinced you can replicate complete 360 head movement in a way that would be useful, consistent and rewarding.

Some people really do just want to watch the world burn huh

[Nugget7211]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

Some people really do just want to watch the world burn huh

You understand that this isn't helpful? And is why a bunch of people don't voice dissenting opinions on here very much?

Like, he disagrees with you, so you respond with something that could be read as "You just want this game to suck and want bad features in it out of spite." I'm aware you're probably being sarcastic or cute or whatever, but in a format without tone, people will read tone into it, and it'll come across really badly.

To be clear, this isn't the worse example of it, nor do I mean to attack you as a person, I've had a few conversations with you and you seem like a decent dude, but this kind of thing really bothers me since it only hurts the discussion

[Serengeti1]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

You understand that this isn't helpful? And is why a bunch of people don't voice dissenting opinions on here very much?

Like, he disagrees with you, so you respond with something that could be read as "You just want this game to suck and want bad features in it out of spite." I'm aware you're probably being sarcastic or cute or whatever, but in a format without tone, people will read tone into it, and it'll come across really badly.

To be clear, this isn't the worse example of it, nor do I mean to attack you as a person, I've had a few conversations with you and you seem like a decent dude, but this kind of thing really bothers me since it only hurts the discussion

I'm playing around. If people are that sensitive that isn't my problem tbh. No offence was intended. We're all adults and I think we all understand that we're just debating mechanics of a video game. No need to feel offended by anything or feel like our character is being attacked. Solid has the worst opinions known to mankind but he's a real cool dude lol.

EDIT: But for the record, I of course understand that most people's opinions are reasonable and we just have different perspectives. It's just a bit of banter. No harm meant at all. I actually really like this forum because of the mature discussion and no personal attacks. None of this is personal though and I think nearly everyone realises that. I certainly don't dislike anyone any more than the next person because they have a different opinion to me. Just to clear that up.

That's also the first and only time I've posted something like that by itself. I can get a little aggressive/assertive sometimes... but that's just because I'm passionate and opinionated. Never anything personal though. It gets a bit boring when we're all talking like robots tbh. Regardless, what you're saying has been noted.

[Phillyboi207]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

Regarding moving the stick 30% vs going 100% whilst keeping the analogue 1 / 0 system as opposed to a 360 volleyball system:



Final point, going into the coloured / safe zones makes your counters deliver with damage whereas staying in the centre zone keeps them regular.

Where the colour starts, your 1 / 0 system kicks in.

Not sure if this is a good solution but it could very well be an improvement in terms of giving us more control.

Also, really struggling to remember if we are forced to go through centre line when switching so can't answer your question Solid. I do recall being annoyed that punches force your head back to centre though.

If we go with the 4 direction system, the amount we move the stick should correspond to how far our character's head moves, a quick flick should be a 100% movement to the edge of that character's head zone so a slip.

Can we have GPD see this please???(Posting again because I think we all can agree this is much better than the current system)

I think this is a very fair compromise. It’s still more movement and control but isnt changed drastically. Also need to remove when punches knock you back to centerline. If you get staggered sure but if you roll with /away from a punch you should be able to still use head movement.

To compensate for the buff to head movement just make it so that you’re at a huge disadvantage in terms of GA. Also chaining sways should take some long term stamina (head movement rating would dictate how quickly stamina depletes)

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

Sorry. I think my question was unclear. I meant: do you think there would be a fifference in the speed of the INPUT? It seems fast enough to flick the stick to the end very quickly, quicker than the fighters would be able to respond to. So, the speed of the input wouldn't actually vary in this regard.

You don't always want to move your head at maximum speed and you don't always want to move your head as far as you can, so no.

I take it you didn't play FNC?

Every player (pretty much) would be able to be as fast as it would matter... and the whole difference would come from the stats. Am I reading you right?

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by this.

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

Decent Head movement is not something everyone posseses. It takes a lot of practice and most fighters are poor at it.

Correct.

I like the idea of guys with weaker head movement keeping the basic 4 directions and guys with higher head movement having acess to the 8 directions.

Worse head movement in real life literally means you can't do it as quickly, chain them together smoothly and/or lean as far. It doesn't mean you have less directions to move your head into.

I agree on wanting 360 head movement (I’m literally OP lol) but Derrick Lewis should not have it. I’d bet money that literally could not pull it off because he doesnt have the footwork required.

Which you can accomplish by lowering his ability to the point where it's so slow and clumsy that it's effectively useless.

I know some of you have trained and there’s no way you think the average fighter can even attempt to do what Cody did to Cruz.

Definitely not. The amount of agility and balance needed to move like that is crazy.

Unless you want the devs to add fighters literally stumbling from losing their balance trying to attempt it(which would be a waste of resources)

Would be hilarious and amazing, but a waste of resources like you said.

I'd limit Derrick Lewis' ability by so much that trying to move like that moving like that is pretty much not possible and attempting to do so would so would turn you into a sitting duck.

Y'all are gonna hate me, but, oddly enough... you know what those gifs showed me...UFC 3 RS flicking lol. Maybe two of them looked more like UFC's 360 movement. But look at the first one, it's basically like flicking the left and right direction on the RS during a combo.

First one was a bit of a bad example. I agree. The others are not.
They're not swaying left to right. They're rolling.

This new system is also VERY convenient for countering combos. If you simply want head movement like we have irl, I feel like we have it. Some animations my look a little off, but we can pretty much do what the gifs show.

Sure it's convenient, but it's not accurate.

If you feel like this is what head movement is like in real life, with all due respect, you really don't know what you're talking about..

There wasn't a lot of lean backs like you can do way better with UFC 2's system in those gifs though. Plus leaning back sways that work with 360 is one of those things I think only the fighters with high head movements should do.

I wasn't looking for lean backs, I was looking for people other than Garbrandt & Silva rolling with punches.

Btw, lean backs are actually in UFC3 and you can do them while walking, which ironically I've only seen Anderson Silva do when he got KO'd by Weidmann..

[Solid_Altair]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

I haven't had a chance to look at the dead zone, but at most it will buy you one extra frame. And even then, it would probably only buy you one extra frame some of the time.

That's what I thought, too. And there would also be the risk of making it too narrow and having too many accidents.

[TheGentlemanGhost]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

First one was a bit of a bad example. I agree. The others are not.
They're not swaying left to right. They're rolling.



Sure it's convenient, but it's not accurate.

If you feel like this is what head movement is like in real life, with all due respect, you really don't know what you're talking about..



I wasn't looking for lean backs, I was looking for people other than Garbrandt & Silva rolling with punches.

Btw, lean backs are actually in UFC3 and you can do them while walking, which ironically I've only seen Anderson Silva do when he got KO'd by Weidmann..

This debate just seems to be getting more and more muddled, you posted Mark Hunt ducking, we can duck. A few gifs showed what was done in UFC 2 but a lot showed slipping punches, which is what you can do when chaining the RS movement.

Sure we can have "360 head movement", as long as we still have the current system too. I'm just not as gung-ho about it since we do have a pretty practical evasive way to avoid shots (esp combo spam) with this system. We'll just see what else they add, I think they said they have more in mind for defense...?

The lean backs I'm talking about are when you can also stay leaned back and can still sway side to side a bit while leaning back. You can't lean back sway like that.

[MalformedDC2009]

Re: Head Movement: Final Boss Thread

There was no input lag on head movement.

You probably felt the ratings effect kicking in, which makes is take longer for lower rated fighters to get their head off the center line.

If this is the cause of the head movement input lag, why not make this the same speed for everyone, eliminating the input lag? Since all of the fighters have the same punch and kick speed anyway, why not throw this one in to be equalized as well?

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