Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

I'm convinced a lot of those 49 don't know what they are signing up for, lol. 49 is also a tiny, tiny percentage of player base.

Of course we know what we're signing up for. No opponent bars is a pretty straight forward concept.

I used to be against meters as anyone. I think it looks silly as heck with all those little meters, but with the current state of breaking block....

Then actually advocate for a better way to break block instead of the stamina/block meter band-aid that doesn't actually address the underlying problem and you yourself admittedly don't even like.

[bcelts]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

I'm convinced a lot of those 49 don't know what they are signing up for, lol. 49 is also a tiny, tiny percentage of player base.

I used to be against meters as anyone. I think it looks silly as heck with all those little meters, but with the current state of breaking block....

Do you think it is easier for your opponent to break your block by seeing your block meter or not being able to see it?

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

Do you think it is easier for your opponent to break your block by seeing your block meter or not being able to see it?

It's significantly easier to break blocks when you can see your opponents meters because you can see how close you are to breaking it and keep track of your opponents guard recovery. Formulating and executing a game-plan to reach a certain goal is always going to be easier when you've got perfect information at your disposal.

When you go in blind you might find yourself taking your foot of the gas to pace yourself when you were a single punch away from breaking their guard. That would never happen with meters.

[MMAFRoO]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

(please elaborate)

Well, i think a fighter's reaction to health events (rocked head, hurt body, damaged legs) already tell enough. If one can not tell, he can learn reading the models symptoms of being hurt. There is no need for those imo. Same goes for the block damage. Your opponent shouldn't know if he's 1 or 2 block breaking combos away from dropping you.

As for stamina you're not able to tell from your opponents body how much lower his stamina dropped or how much he kept after rounds. You can't tell if your tactics to drop his stamina work (making him miss, working body, dominating on the ground). Even with GameplayDev's stamina update post-beta readable changes in a fighter's movement only kick in at what ? 20-30% of the stamina bar ?
Opponent's stamina bar should stay.

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

As for stamina you're not able to tell from your opponents body how much lower his stamina dropped or how much he kept after rounds. You can't tell if your tactics to drop his stamina work (making him miss, working body, dominating on the ground).

Even with GameplayDev's stamina update post-beta readable changes in a fighter's movement only kick in at what ? 20-30% of the stamina bar ?

The slowdown starts earlier as far as I know. But the visual cues don't become significant until you pass a certain threshold.

Opponent's stamina bar should stay.

Again, please elaborate.

All you've said is:

"If you remove the meters you can't see their stamina"

Well.. Yeah.. That's the point. Because you're not able to tell exactly how much your opponent has left in the gastank in real life MMA either. So why exactly do we need it in the game?

[aholbert32]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

Well, i think a fighter's reaction to health events (rocked head, hurt body, damaged legs) already tell enough. If one can not tell, he can learn reading the models symptoms of being hurt. There is no need for those imo. Same goes for the block damage. Your opponent shouldn't know if he's 1 or 2 block breaking combos away from dropping you.

As for stamina you're not able to tell from your opponents body how much lower his stamina dropped or how much he kept after rounds. You can't tell if your tactics to drop his stamina work (making him miss, working body, dominating on the ground). Even with GameplayDev's stamina update post-beta readable changes in a fighter's movement only kick in at what ? 20-30% of the stamina bar ?
Opponent's stamina bar should stay.

They kick in at 50%. The more obvious ones kick in at 30%

[Dave_S]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

Of course we know what we're signing up for. No opponent bars is a pretty straight forward concept.



Then actually advocate for a better way to break block instead of the stamina/block meter band-aid that doesn't actually address the underlying problem and you yourself admittedly don't even like.

You say you know what you've signed up for, but probably no one that voted yes has experienced what ranked play will be like in UFC 3 without block meter. I have worries about how incredibly tedious the ground game could become for those that like ground and pound.

Of course I would advocate a better way to break block, but in the state of beta i don't like the idea of it. If breaking block and strikes in some positions were the same as ufc 2 I'd probably be screaming about removing block meter and redoing all those little meters from the rooftops.

I'm not trying band-aid a problem, I just don't remove band-aids before the wound has had a chance to heal.

Do you think it is easier for your opponent to break your block by seeing your block meter or not being able to see it?

I don't care about opponent breaking my block, I'm concerned with breaking theirs.

[Find_the_Door]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

Really hope they squeeze this in. Will really create a much more simulation type experience. Really no reason for them to stay.

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

You say you know what you've signed up for, but probably no one that voted yes has experienced what ranked play will be like in UFC 3 without block meter. I have worries about how incredibly tedious the ground game could become for those that like ground and pound.

Of course I would advocate a better way to break block, but in the state of beta i don't like the idea of it. If breaking block and strikes in some positions were the same as ufc 2 I'd probably be screaming about removing block meter and redoing all those little meters from the rooftops.

I'm not trying band-aid a problem, I just don't remove band-aids before the wound has had a chance to heal.

That's fair.

But let me clear something up. I don't know about everyone else, but anything I suggest on this forum doesn't necessarily have to be addressed pre-release or even before UFC4 becomes a thing.

I just want devs to be aware that I (and plenty others) don't like the idea of meters. If the meters can't be removed without fundamentally destroying the gameplay, by all means, keep them in.

If it's possible to responsibly remove them with a giant patch later down the road, that'd be great. But even if that's not possible, all I'm asking is that when they're developing the next game, try to come up with a system that doesn't rely on meters at all so that removing them makes it a more immersive and authentic MMA experience.

[bcelts]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

It's significantly easier to break blocks when you can see your opponents meters because you can see how close you are to breaking it and keep track of your opponents guard recovery. Formulating and executing a game-plan to reach a certain goal is always going to be easier when you've got perfect information at your disposal.

When you go in blind you might find yourself taking your foot of the gas to pace yourself when you were a single punch away from breaking their guard. That would never happen with meters.

I agree 100%!

[Haz____]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

In Magic the Gathering there is a card that deals 2 damage to yourself, and then you get to look at the opponents hand.

You are hurting yourself, and making it easier for the opponent to kill you, but you get access to perfect information

Even with that drawback, this card is still banned from tournaments because having perfect information is SOOO GOOD.




Just an example to show you why we need to get rid of meters. Having perfect information makes formulating gameplans way too easy, and allows you to exploit block break, & know exactly when to push offense, when to be defensive, when to shoot a takedown, when to go for a sub, etc.

[Solid_Altair]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

There is a wealth of examples from other genres that would go in the opposite direction of this.

Do you really think that counts?

[Haz____]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

There is a wealth of examples from other genres that would go in the opposite direction of this.

Do you really think that counts?

Show me 1?

I can't think of a single competitive game where you are allowed to see your opponents information.

[TheUFCVeteran]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

Show me 1?

I can't think of a single competitive game where you are allowed to see your opponents information.

Slightly different but in Infinite Warfare (they have official comp games too) you can see your enemy's health as a health bar above head. Quite useful though since it's so fast paced you can't stare at it too long else you'll get melted.

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

There is a wealth of examples from other genres that would go in the opposite direction of this.

Do you really think that counts?

I bet there are plenty but it's irrelevant.

The only example we need is real life, since that's what the game is being modeled after. Hardware related limitations notwithstanding.

I understand that you say your aspirations don't go further than "If the replays look realistic, that's good enough for me", but I doubt that's entirely true.

Would you be in favor of automated take-down defense (based on stats & fatigue)? If not, why not? You won't be able to tell the difference as a spectator, right?