Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

[Haz____]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

How about a middle ground.

What do you guys think about getting rid of stamina, and health bars, but bringing back the simple "Paper Doll" hud to reflect damage.

[Trillz]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

How about a middle ground.

What do you guys think about getting rid of stamina, and health bars, but bringing back the simple "Paper Doll" hud to reflect damage.

that would be best but i dont think they are going to make a visual change like that now.

[Solid_Altair]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

I bet there are plenty but it's irrelevant.

The only example we need is real life, since that's what the game is being modeled after. Hardware related limitations notwithstanding.

I understand that you say your aspirations don't go further than "If the replays look realistic, that's good enough for me", but I doubt that's entirely true.

Would you be in favor of automated take-down defense (based on stats & fatigue)? If not, why not? You won't be able to tell the difference as a spectator, right?

That was my point.

I had said "if the gameplay is good and it looks realistic".

[Sivo]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

The biggest problem i can see for removing meters is that for the casual player they wont pick up on damage cues unless they are that obvious that they look ridiculous, same thing with stamina. With regards to block they will rock someone and just think the opponent is able to fully absorb they're shots with block without any effect.(atleast seeing the block meter you see the amount u have removed know atleast u see u did something) This seems like a casual v hardcore argument.

Fairest choice seems to be make it an optional extra in all game modes not sure if that could work with ultimate team. Have the default set to meters on but allow people to have theirs turned off regardless of the opponents and have an option to matchmake with others with the hud turned off.

So default is meters turned on, option for meters on or off and an option to matchmake with others with no meters(whetheer the matchmaking would split the player base too much i doubt it as i feel only a percentage of hardcore player would use this setting)

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

That was my point.

I know that was your point. I'm saying that what Haz brought up and your point by extension are irrelevant to this specific issue.

What other games do or don't do doesn't matter. The only thing that matters as a reference is real life MMA because that is what UFC3 is trying to simulate.

I had said "if the gameplay is good and it looks realistic".

Altair my friend, you're avoiding the question..

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

The biggest problem i can see for removing meters is that for the casual player they wont pick up on damage cues unless they are that obvious that they look ridiculous, same thing with stamina. With regards to block they will rock someone and just think the opponent is able to fully absorb they're shots with block without any effect.(atleast seeing the block meter you see the amount u have removed know atleast u see u did something) This seems like a casual v hardcore argument.

So you're saying casual players will be somewhat ineffective offensively? Newsflash, they already are. They'll be able to beat other people who aren't able to pick up on subtle changes in their opponents conditioning, but lose to someone who's able to pace themselves and accurately gauge their conditioning.

Separating by skill normal players from the elites is just the nature of competition. I don't see why that's something we'd want to avoid.

Besides, there's more than just meters that separate casual players from the elites of a game. As a matter of fact, one could argue that you'd get destroyed harder with meters on because all the factors that make a player good only get amplified with perfect information.

That said, all that is irrelevant. You don't have accurate information on your opponents stamina or ability to block in real life.

[Solid_Altair]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

I know that was your point. I'm saying that what Haz brought up and your point by extension are irrelevant to this specific issue.

What other games do or don't do doesn't matter. The only thing that matters as a reference is real life MMA because that is what UFC3 is trying to simulate.



Altair my friend, you're avoiding the question..

I was correcting a reference. Does the question remain without the wrong version? Or does the correction answer question?

[Sivo]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

Besides, there's more than just meters that separate casual players from the elites of a game.

I agree with this but (i'm making a big assumption here because this is what i used to do before i started paying more attention to character animations and mechanics) most casual gamer's use meters as a way of seeing how much damage they are doing or receiving in most games and without them allot of casual gamer's will be adding another layer of confusion to a game that has one of the steepest learning curves u can have and adding no meters in online play as a default will just confuse players even more. These games can't sell enough copies to just hardcore players and u have to cater to casuals in some areas.

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

I was correcting a reference. Does the question remain without the wrong version? Or does the correction answer question?

The question remains.

Would you be in favor of automated take-down defense (based on stats & fatigue)?

Why or why not?

On top of that I'll add the following question.

Would you be in favor of the game showing accurate scorecards in between rounds so that the players know whether or not they're winning the fight?

Why or why not?

[Solid_Altair]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

The question remains.

Would you be in favor of automated take-down defense (based on stats & fatigue)?

Why or why not?

On top of that I'll add the following question.

Would you be in favor of the game showing accurate scorecards in between rounds so that the players know whether or not they're winning the fight?

Why or why not?

No. That would involve less skill.

No. (Very good question.) Players can get by enough without this info. It doesn't affect specific decisions and actions as much as the bars. So, I think it's fine for the presentation to remain the same. Furthermore, by having no bars, the players have less info than the fighter (who has can have tactile clues, hear heavy breathing, and see more specofoc tired movements from the opponent) than we can at the game. Hiding the scorecards irl and in the game means the very same amount of info, unless you have a corner trying to peek over the judges' shoulders.

[RetractedMonkey]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

Topics like these really make me question if I'm interacting with adults or teenagers. At least it makes it easy to separate the rational people in this forum. You have a bunch of guys lobbying for a feature they have not playtested nor created the game around and they think there is 0% chance there will be backlash, unintended consequences, or that it simply won't be fun. Not only that, but they think an online poll on a forum of maybe 40 active members is indicative of a majority. Add then, the fact that they are aggressively spitting at dissent and writing posts begging the developers to listen. A dude literally said he didn't think there were enough visual and auditory cues as his reason and the topic creator basically called him an idiot. The maturity level needs to rise a couple notches here, gentlemen. I'm just glad you guys aren't making the game.

As for my answer, I think that would be an excellent feature. . . when it has been thoroughly playtested and designed around, not because a bunch of random dudes unable to accept other viewpoints were circlejerking about how it'll be great before implementation.

[Dave_S]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

I'm just glad you guys aren't making the game.

If I was making the game it wouldn't ship without referee interaction.

[RetractedMonkey]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

If I was making the game it wouldn't ship without referee interaction.

I really do find it odd that wasn't given a budget for this game.

[Dave_S]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

I really do find it odd that wasn't given a budget for this game.

Brian Hayes told this to Mike Bohn from mma junkie.

We’ve looked at it. It is kind of challenging. Not to say it’s impossible, but from a prioritization side, when we’re adding thousands of new animations to build a new gameplay experience, it’s not at the top of the list. We’d like to have Herb Dean tackling a dude, but we focused on gameplay for this version. It’s something we’re aware of and you’ll probably see in the future.

[DaisukEasy]

Re: Opponent's health, guard and stamina meter bars should be hidden, do you agree?

No. That would involve less skill.

It certainly does.

So my question to you is, why are you not okay with taking away a physical skill like take down defense, but you are with taking away multiple mental skills like observation, killer instinct, etc?

No. (Very good question.) Players can get by enough without this info. It doesn't affect specific decisions and actions as much as the bars.

Are you kidding me? Knowing whether or not you're ahead of the score card is the single most relevant piece of information a fighter can have. It doesn't affect a specific decision, it affects all decisions.

Going into round 5 knowing you're 0 - 4, 4 - 0 or 2 - 2 are three entirely different scenarios that affect. Depending on those scores the logical move going forward is either you're going full defense, full offense or carefully try to win the next round without messing up.

By having no bars, the players have less info than the fighter (who has can have tactile clues, hear heavy breathing, and see more specofoc tired movements from the opponent) than we can at the game.

You sure about that?

Seriously though. Correct, we can't hear breathing, we also don't have full control over our limbs. It's a game, there are limitations.

That said, we can see slowdowns in our opponents striking and movement.
We can see animations changing when they're exhausted.
We can "feel" strikes doing less damage as our opponents tire.
We can keep track of how much we're punishing their bodies and how much they're swinging at air.

We have plenty to go on.

Just because it's not literally real life isn't a justification to give everyone the equivalent of a super power.

Hiding the scorecards irl and in the game means the very same amount of info, unless you have a corner trying to peek over the judges' shoulders.

You're now literally using our argument..


Your coach gives you a rough idea of how the round went. Whether you won or lost. If your opponent is getting tired etc.

Since we don't have coaches in real life, we now have less info than the fighters. Therefore we should have 100% accurate scorecards that tell us how the round went.

Can you not see how this is the exact same argument you're making in favor of stamina meters?