Wait so what the hell happens to Page if he loses to Evans? What the hell happened here, this is highly disappointing.
Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
Wait so what the hell happens to Page if he loses to Evans? What the hell happened here, this is highly disappointing. -
Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
No its the exact same thing. The last time Rua looked real good was 2006, early 2007. The last time Chuck looked real good was late 2006. Rua has blown out his knee at least once, and probably twice. He hasn't looked the same since, so why should we assume that this time will be different?
These guys are professional athletes in tip top condition, 9 months is a long time to recover and rehabilitate an athlete's conditioning issues. Some of you guys might be right and he gasses again, but it's not a sure thing. Most likely is that his cardio is much closer now to his pride days if not fully recovered.
I just don't understand how a lot of you are so sure that Shogun's cardio will be bad again. Does it take THAT long to regain your old fitness??
I don't think so.
edit: and no Liddel's old age and Shgun's cardio problems iare not the same thing.
You can't recover from old age, once you get there, you can't get it back
Shogun's problems can be corrected with good training.Last edited by phillyfan23; 05-31-2009, 12:11 AM.Comment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
The reason why he looked so bad in his first 2 UFC fights were cardio due to the blown out knees ( both took a year total to recover). But it's going to be 9 months after his last bad cardio outing ( Vs Coleman) to the fight in october.
These guys are professional athletes in tip top condition, 9 months is a long time to recover and rehabilitate an athlete's conditioning issues. Some of you guys might be right and he gasses again, but it's not a sure thing. Most likely is that his cardio is much closer now to his pride days if not fully recovered.
I just don't understand how a lot of you are so sure that Shogun's cardio will be bad again. Does it take THAT long to regain your old fitness??
I don't think so.
edit: and no Liddel's old age and Shgun's cardio problems iare not the same thing.
You can't recover from old age, once you get there, you can't get it back
Shogun's problems can be corrected with good training.USC Trojans -- Washington Nationals -- Jacksonville JaguarsComment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
No its the exact same thing. The last time Rua looked real good was 2006, early 2007. The last time Chuck looked real good was late 2006. Rua has blown out his knee at least once, and probably twice. He hasn't looked the same since, so why should we assume that this time will be different?Comment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
Rua's cardio problems are because his injuries. He can't train the same as he used to, there for it is the exact same thing. This isn't golf we are talking about here, a blown out knee is a lot to recover from in MMA. Can it happen? Yes. Rua has the surgery in late 2007. He had 18 months off before his next fight. You would think that would be enough time for him to get his cardio back. But he didn't. Who knows how is cardio was for the Chuck fight, Glass jaw couldn't hang with him.
but you know that you just contradicted yourself in your last post?
Check the bolded part....you said that blown out knees are recoverable in MMA, so if it's the same thing, a fighter at the age of 40 can recover his 33 year old form?
You're telling me it's possible that Chuck Liddell's chin get more durable, his reflexes faster, his punches crisper just with proper training ?
With proper training, an athlete CAN recover 100 percent of all his tools, fitness,etc prior to injury. A 40 year old athlete can train until the cows come home, eat the best supplements and he will NEVER regain his tools, fitness,etc prior to aging. NEVER......
You still want to tell me that Shogun's case is the same with Liddel's ??Last edited by phillyfan23; 05-31-2009, 03:23 AM.Comment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
how do you know he can't train the same as he used to now that his knees are 100 percent or close to 100 percent healthy? The injuries messed up his training routine because he couldn't stress out those knees in rehab. But now that he's healthy, he can get back to his old routine and should get back into fitness form.
but you know that you just contradicted yourself in your last post?
Check the bolded part....you said that blown out knees are recoverable in MMA, so if it's the same thing, a fighter at the age of 40 can recover his 33 year old form?
You're telling me it's possible that Chuck Liddell's chin get more durable, his reflexes faster, his punches crisper just with proper training ?
With proper training, an athlete CAN recover 100 percent of all his tools, fitness,etc prior to injury. A 40 year old athlete can train until the cows come home, eat the best supplements and he will NEVER regain his tools, fitness,etc prior to aging. NEVER......
You still want to tell me that Shogun's case is the same with Liddel's ??USC Trojans -- Washington Nationals -- Jacksonville JaguarsComment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
Rua's had 18 months to get ready for Coleman. He couldn't/wouldn't do it. Why are you assuming he can now? And as for 40 year olds, I am saying Chuck isn't getting better, and neither is Rua. That is how it is the exact same thing. They both have looked like crap since the start of 2007. So assuming Rua is going to magically turn it around, is like assuming Chuck can too. If Rua had looked good in any of his fights in the UFC, post injury, I would say yeah he can come back from this. But he hasn't, so there for I am going to go with what I have seen the last two years, and that is a fighter that for some reason looks over the hill at 27.
do you know that in the first 12 out of 18 months he was very inactive . I heard reports that for the first year he was doing verynmlight workouts and because of this his cardio suffered since he went off his routine for so long. He had 2 injuries, big time. In the NFL they say a blown knee like that takes more than 1 season to fully recover, this guy had 2.
Chuck has ZERO chance of regaining his form.
Rua has a legit chance to regain his form and if it happens it's not because it's by magic, but rather by natural progression.
Shogun's case is not the same as Liddel's.....not even close. You even said in your post he could recover, but now you change your stance and say it's impossible to cover your tracks.
let me ask you this....give me a percentage
what's the chance of Liddell regaining his prime form/close to it from 6 years ago ?
what's the chance of Rua regaining his form/close to it from 3-4 years ago?Last edited by phillyfan23; 05-31-2009, 10:57 AM.Comment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
do you know that in the first 12 out of 18 months he was very inactive . I heard reports that for the first year he was doing verynmlight workouts and because of this his cardio suffered since he went off his routine for so long. He had 2 injuries, big time. In the NFL they say a blown knee like that takes more than 1 season to fully recover, this guy had 2.
Chuck has ZERO chance of regaining his form.
Rua has a legit chance to regain his form and if it happens it's not because it's by magic, but rather by natural progression.
Shogun's case is not the same as Liddel's.....not even close. You even said in your post he could recover, but now you change your stance and say it's impossible to cover your tracks.
let me ask you this....give me a percentage
what's the chance of Liddell regaining his prime form/close to it from 6 years ago ?
what's the chance of Rua regaining his form/close to it from 3-4 years ago?
Chuck 0%
Rua 5%
If Rua wasn't such a bad *** in Pride he wouldn't even be considered for this fight. Keith Jardine beat Forrest Griffin in 2006, He too has beat Glass Joe Liddell. Why doesn't he get a title shot? Based off of his performance in the UFC Rua has not shown any signs of being a title contender. If someone like Mark Munoz had a 2 years like Rua after he came over, no way would he even still be in the UFC. Rua is getting by off his distant past, not what he has shown in the last few months.
Rua had over the 1 year to recover from his latest surgery, and he gassed just as fast as a 43 year old Mark Coleman. How much longer do we need to give him?USC Trojans -- Washington Nationals -- Jacksonville JaguarsComment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
No you failed to read the entire post. I am saying Rua had over 18 months, post surgery, to get ready for Coleman. He had the surgery, elective surgery, right after the Griffin fight.USC Trojans -- Washington Nationals -- Jacksonville JaguarsComment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
Chuck 0%
Rua 5%
If Rua wasn't such a bad *** in Pride he wouldn't even be considered for this fight. Keith Jardine beat Forrest Griffin in 2006, He too has beat Glass Joe Liddell. Why doesn't he get a title shot? Based off of his performance in the UFC Rua has not shown any signs of being a title contender. If someone like Mark Munoz had a 2 years like Rua after he came over, no way would he even still be in the UFC. Rua is getting by off his distant past, not what he has shown in the last few months.
Rua had over the 1 year to recover from his latest surgery, and he gassed just as fast as a 43 year old Mark Coleman. How much longer do we need to give him?
we both agree Lidell has 0 chance.
Looks like you don't think they're the same cases after all.....Comment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
Some QBs get their ACLs torn mid-season and by the first game of the next season , looks like they didn't miss a beat.
Another QB ( Mcnabb) took nearly 2 years before looking like his old self again.
You also say that Shogun of UFC doesn't deserve a title shot, that i agree with ( eventhough there is no one else right now) But Shogun of MMA is definitely deserving and his Pride GP win should play a role in that.
You telling me if Dana White signs Fedor Emilianenko tomorrow, he will have to " contend " for the title shot like a Cain Velasquez will fighting cans first and working his way up?
If fedor walks in the UFC today , his FIRST fight will be for the title because his history as an MMA fighter is much more important than his history as a UFC fighter. Same deal with Shogun. You don't win that Pride GP the way he won it unless you're a special fighter.Comment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
some people recover longer man.....
Some QBs get their ACLs torn mid-season and by the first game of the next season , looks like they didn't miss a beat.
Another QB ( Mcnabb) took nearly 2 years before looking like his old self again.
You also say that Shogun of UFC doesn't deserve a title shot, that i agree with ( eventhough there is no one else right now) But Shogun of MMA is definitely deserving and his Pride GP win should play a role in that.
You telling me if Dana White signs Fedor Emilianenko tomorrow, he will have to " contend " for the title shot like a Cain Velasquez will fighting cans first and working his way up?
If fedor walks in the UFC today , his FIRST fight will be for the title because his history as an MMA fighter is much more important than his history as a UFC fighter. Same deal with Shogun. You don't win that Pride GP the way he won it unless you're a special fighter.USC Trojans -- Washington Nationals -- Jacksonville JaguarsComment
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Re: Machida vs Shogun...UFC 104
Ok let say this. Fedor comes to the UFC, but for some reason they have him fight a Shane Carwin, or Cain Velasquez type, and he loses. then 18 months later he fights Randy Couture and he gasses in the 2nd round and overall looks like ****. Then he beats a big name fighter who is 1-3 leading into the fight and is way past his prime, the 2nd past his prime fighter he has faced in a row. At that point Fedor doesn't deserve a title shot. If the UFC gave Rua the title shot when he came in instead of having him fight Forrest I would have agreed with it. But taking into consideration what has happened the last 2 years It doesn't make sense. I think Rua has lost his ability. We shall see when he goes up against someone 1000% faster then Chuck or Coleman.Comment
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