Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

[Keirik]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

Just look at the video at the top of this page.

What I see is pretty clear. Two officers (including gunman) are subduing Oscar, with the big guy having his knee on Oscar's head. He wasn't going anywhere. The second officer (gunman) then proceeds to grab his sidearm, stand up, point and aim, and then he fires.

That is murder.

Are you sure about that? You may want to re-do your research, as your statistics are way off.

actually, you're taking things on face value way too much. Great, one video shows one thing. I've already shown you that watching a video is not a reliable means of proving anything. Different angles show completely different things. Common misconception is to just look at one video and draw conclusions from it.

I meant to say hundreds die each year,not thousands. That's what multitasking will do to you.

Nice try though.

[Cebby]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

I've already shown you that watching a video is not a reliable means of proving anything. Different angles show completely different things.

There's not really anything that else that could be shown. It's not like there's another angle where the dead guy pulls out a hand grenade.

[JohnnytheSkin]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

How's the fight against the Marxist Admiral State going?

That was unnecessary and totally off topic...

[Keirik]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

There's not really anything that else that could be shown. It's not like there's another angle where the dead guy pulls out a hand grenade.

you dont need a second angle to show a guy trying to pull out a grenade. Why not try to be serious here? Obviously this thread is full of naive people who dont know the law at all. All that needs to be justified is for the officer to have seen his hand reaching for something, whether it's somewhere on his own person, or trying to reach for another officer's gun.

Again, how ridiculous is it to say "you dont need another angle"? Why not? Another angle could show things not seen on this one. Something clearly seen in one angle could be completely different in other.

Also, this was not murder at all. At the very most, it's manslaughter, not murder. Where's the premeditation?


I'd love to see most of the people here take a walk in a police officer's shoes for 5 minutes, then try judging how fast of a decision must be made. It's also very very easy to mistake a taser for a service weapon in the heat of the moment. It's one of the reasons a lot of departments dont use them in the first place.

[RAZRr1275]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

you dont need a second angle to show a guy trying to pull out a grenade. Why not try to be serious here? Obviously this thread is full of naive people who dont know the law at all. All that needs to be justified is for the officer to have seen his hand reaching for something, whether it's somewhere on his own person, or trying to reach for another officer's gun.

Again, how ridiculous is it to say "you dont need another angle"? Why not? Another angle could show things not seen on this one. Something clearly seen in one angle could be completely different in other.

Also, this was not murder at all. At the very most, it's manslaughter, not murder. Where's the premeditation?


I'd love to see most of the people here take a walk in a police officer's shoes for 5 minutes, then try judging how fast of a decision must be made. It's also very very easy to mistake a taser for a service weapon in the heat of the moment. It's one of the reasons a lot of departments dont use them in the first place.

Mistaking a taser for a gun should not happen. Your killing someone right there if you make that error. You have to know where your weapons are. I don't know what it's like to be a cop but I know this. You just can't make mistakes like that.

[Cebby]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

Again, how ridiculous is it to say "you dont need another angle"? Why not? Another angle could show things not seen on this one. Something clearly seen in one angle could be completely different in other.

What in the world could be seen in another angle? Nobody is doubting what was seen in the video. There is nobody saying that the officer did not stand up, take out his gun, and shoot the man in the back.

Also, this was not murder at all. At the very most, it's manslaughter, not murder. Where's the premeditation?

1. Only first degree murder requires premeditation.

2. This is, at the least, manslaughter. There's no way this is anything less than manslaughter.

If there's a legitimate argument that he thought the gun was a taser, it's manslaughter, but if he knew it was a gun, it should be murder 2. I think even the cops here can agree with that.

[PVarck31]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

How's the fight against the Marxist Admiral State going?

What is this supposed to mean?

[RAZRr1275]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

What is this supposed to mean?

D8 was talking about some legal thing that he deemed unconstitutional that he wanted to stop I believe. That's a reference to that

[JohnnytheSkin]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

D8 was talking about some legal thing that he deemed unconstitutional that he wanted to stop I believe. That's a reference to that

Pretty much...love or hate the things another user posts, to toss something random out, slamming that guy, in an unrelated thread (most of this was in the Off Topic thread) seems a bit out of line.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

Son moved to Nevada

01-13, 21:36 PST Oakland -- Johannes Mehserle, the former BART police officer who shot and killed an unarmed man on an Oakland train platform on New Year's Day, was arrested in Nevada today in connection with the shooting, The Chronicle has learned.

Mehserle, 27, was taken into custody in Douglas County, Nevada, said Deputy Steve Velez of the Douglas County Sheriff's Office. The arrest was also confirmed by David Chai, chief of staff to Oakland Mayor Ron Dellums.

Mehserle was arrested in connection with an investigation by the Oakland Police Department into the shooting of Oscar Grant, 22. An Alameda County judge signed an arrest warrant, and Mehserle surrendered without incident, authorities said.

Douglas County sheriff's officials refused to disclose what crime Mehserle was accused of committing in the arrest warrant. Deputy Velez said Sheriff Ron P. Pierini would make a statement on Wednesday.

Alameda County District Attorney Tom Orloff was also expected to announce details of the arrest Wednesday.

Efforts to reach attorneys for Mehserle were unsuccessful.

The arrest comes on the eve of a scheduled protest at 4 p.m. Wednesday outside Oakland City Hall, the latest in a series of demonstrations in which BART has been accused of mishandling the shooting investigation.

On Monday, BART police turned over the results of their preliminary investigation to Orloff's office. The separate investigation by Oakland police was launched last week. The state Attorney General is also monitoring the case.

BART officers had detained Grant and several other passengers at about 2 a.m. on Jan. 1 as they investigated a fight aboard a train from San Francisco.

Grant was lying face-down when Mehserle pulled his service weapon from his holster and fired one shot into his back.

Mehserle resigned last Wednesday rather than answer questions from BART investigators.

His departure came the same day Grant was buried and a peaceful protest at the Fruitvale BART Station erupted into violence in downtown Oakland. Demonstrators set cars on fire and broke windows at dozens of businesses. By night's end, police arrested 105 people.

Chronicle Staff Writers Jaxon Van Derbeken and christopher heredia contributed to this report. E-mail the writers at [email protected] and [email protected].

[ChubbyBanana]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

Mehserle resigned last Wednesday rather than answer questions from BART investigators.

I love the Media.

I also love how the article doesn't say where he was arrested. Was he living in a hotel, or was he staying with friends/family? The former could be taken as being on the "run", while the latter could be taken as getting away from the city and the rioting.

Demonstrators set cars on fire and broke windows at dozens of businesses. By night's end, police arrested 105 people.

I still don't get this part...

How does this stop the violence? How does this "avenge" the shooting? What is the point of this Rioting? Is it because the "man" is holding them down? Anyone?

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

1. The media? Come on now, don't deflect. That article was fine. He wasn't on the run, I think that's fairly obvious. He wanted to get away from the circus the Bay Area now is. If he was on the run, best believe the media would run with that.

2. People don't like it when innocent people are killed. No surprise. People are also ******** for the most part. No surprise. I understand why emotions are high, to me it's simple. When cops have gotten off in the past, some people feel frustrated and don't know how to express it properly. They probably feel like there's no hope for "justice".

It'll be so interesting to see what charges the guy gets. I mean come on, he was barely arrested now?!? That in itself is somewhat pathetic, and still no charges.

[ChubbyBanana]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

1. The media? Come on now, don't deflect. That article was fine.

I'm not deflecting anything. I'm stating a fact that I love the way the media words things. The wording in that article tends to lead the reader to believe the guy is a douche bag. He may have resigned after being asked to answer some questions, but that doesn't mean he resigned as a direct result of the questions being asked. The fact he cooperated with authorities in Nevade makes me question that line even more.

2. People don't like it when innocent people are killed. No surprise. People are also ******** for the most part. No surprise. I understand why emotions are high, to me it's simple. When cops have gotten off in the past, some people feel frustrated and don't know how to express it properly. They probably feel like there's no hope for "justice".

I just don't understand the violence part of it. I'm not really upset at the protesting. Peaceful protest would be much more effective IMO. Violence just brings up a negative conotation on the protestors.

I mean come on, he was barely arrested now?!? That in itself is somewhat pathetic, and still no charges.

Most Law Enforcement Involved Shootings I've dealt with in the past haven't had an arrest this quickly. Usually the officer just gets put on paid administrative leave pending the completion of the investigation. Unless there is an obvious negligence on the officer's part.

[Keirik]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

What in the world could be seen in another angle? Nobody is doubting what was seen in the video. There is nobody saying that the officer did not stand up, take out his gun, and shoot the man in the back.



1. Only first degree murder requires premeditation.

2. This is, at the least, manslaughter. There's no way this is anything less than manslaughter.

If there's a legitimate argument that he thought the gun was a taser, it's manslaughter, but if he knew it was a gun, it should be murder 2. I think even the cops here can agree with that.

well, being that i actually am a cop, i suppose we can't say that "even cops here can agree with that". Every state is a bit different but here in NYS it would be considered more manslaughter rather than murder. There was no premeditation, and it would be a tough sell to say his intent was to kill. Most likely his intent was to subdue and cause serious physical injury.

The laws are sometimes worded terribly when it comes to these things and the lesser charge would be easier to convict on rather than the higher charge of murder. Either way, it's a felony and we're talking serious jail time if he's convicted.

[PVarck31]

Re: Man shot in the back by cops, while on the ground

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090114/ap_on_re_us/train_station_shooting

Former officer has been charged with murder.