Pass Coverage, Pass Reaction, Interception Sliders

[fistofrage]

The interception slider appears to be the brain. Nothing else matters if you get this out of whack. I tried to lower it as well as QB accuracy because I wanted to see passes off the mark, but if you lower the INT slider everyone is running wide open.

The tackle slider is the overall defensive ability slider as well. I tried lowering this because I wanted to see more broken tackles, but it effects how the line plays and engages as well. You lower this and on run plays, the D-line basically takes a step back and engages, leading to an over-powered run game.

I'm just going to play default Madden with some penalty adjustments with fumbles at 40 so I see a few and that's it. You move these sliders around and things break down quick.

[KingV2k3]

Quote: Originally Posted by Macksport

pass reaction makes defense commit to run or pass...the lower your slider goes the more they are committed to the run ...pass coverage is zone recognition....the only way to affect man coverage is with pass and catch slider along with pass blocking....

I'm also in this camp...

The Pass Reaction and Pass Defense sliders seem to be a "mashup" of the former Pass Reaction AND Run Reaction sliders for the former with the latter being the Pass Defense AND Run Defense sliders...

Lower values = more Run Reaction or Run Defense versus less Pass Reaction or Pass Defense and higher values = more Pass Reaction or Pass Defense versus less Run Reaction or Run Defense...

That's the primary reason most sets have those locked on 50...

Although:

How the HUM sets those sliders also affects how the CPU calls plays...

If the AI "Thinks" you're more prepared to defend the pass or run, they'll play to your (opposite) "weakness"...

That's another reason why they're best off at default...

Another option to get tighter Man Coverage / less separation is with the DPI penalty slider...

Higher values will make Coverage / Ball Reaction tighter / faster, but the "unintended consequence" is that:

1) There's only one set of penalty sliders, so the effect is "Universal"

2) At values above 55 (and possibly 60) the CPU QB will not "perceive" that there's enough separation to risk deep passes...or passes into that tight coverage...

As a result, the CPU QB can become "Captain Checkdown" or take sacks from capitulating too long in the pocket...waiting for an "acceptable" amount of separation for the CPU QB AI...

That's been my experience, anyway...



Lastly:

Yes, the INT slider has a "Universal Ball Awareness" aspect and the TAK slider has a "Universal Strength and Speed of Pursuit" aspect, in addition to the obvious things they're listed as controlling...

The problem remains:

"Too Many Things Tied to Too Few Sliders"...

If they'd give us back the "Full Twelve" and perhaps separate, full penalty slider sets for both sides of the ball...

Well, all of this "Fine Tuning" would be a heck of a lot easier and more effective!

[charter04]

Quote: Originally Posted by KingV2k3

I'm also in this camp... The Pass Reaction and Pass Defense sliders seem to be a "mashup" of the former Pass Reaction AND Run Reaction sliders for the former with the latter being the Pass Defense AND Run Defense sliders... Lower values = more Run Reaction or Run Defense versus less Pass Reaction or Pass Defense and higher values = more Pass Reaction or Pass Defense versus less Run Reaction or Run Defense... That's the primary reason most sets have those locked on 50... Although: How the HUM sets those sliders also affects how the CPU calls plays... If the AI "Thinks" you're more prepared to defend the pass or run, they'll play to your (opposite) "weakness"... That's another reason why they're best off at default... Another option to get tighter Man Coverage / less separation is with the DPI penalty slider... Higher values will make Coverage / Ball Reaction tighter / faster, but the "unintended consequence" is that: 1) There's only one set of penalty sliders, so the effect is "Universal" 2) At values above 55 (and possibly 60) the CPU QB will not "perceive" that there's enough separation to risk deep passes...or passes into that tight coverage... As a result, the CPU QB can become "Captain Checkdown" or take sacks from capitulating too long in the pocket...waiting for an "acceptable" amount of separation for the CPU QB AI... That's been my experience, anyway... Lastly: Yes, the INT slider has a "Universal Ball Awareness" aspect and the TAK slider has a "Universal Strength and Speed of Pursuit" aspect, in addition to the obvious things they're listed as controlling... The problem remains: "Too Many Things Tied to Too Few Sliders"... If they'd give us back the "Full Twelve" and perhaps separate, full penalty slider sets for both sides of the ball... Well, all of this "Fine Tuning" would be a heck of a lot easier and more effective!

Forget 12. My dream is to have as many as NBA 2k. Unfortunately Tiberon has taken a stance of not giving the user control for whatever reason.

I'm still not sure why they seem so hell bent on limiting user control as much as possible

[Trojan Man]

Quote: Originally Posted by charter04

Forget 12. My dream is to have as many as NBA 2k. Unfortunately Tiberon has taken a stance of not giving the user control for whatever reason. I'm still not sure why they seem so hell bent on limiting user control as much as possible

I think the decision to limit sliders so severely is a tacit admission that they don't know well enough what does what within the game.

It's clear that certain sliders for some time have had lots of unintended secondary effects, likely stemming from the fact that the game hasn't received a totally clean overhaul in a really long time.

If it's obvious to us that several of the sliders we have effect too many different things, then maybe they're not capable of creating sliders that only have one, specific, precise effect at this point. Like an interception slider that ONLY modifies the attempts at picks and their success rate. Or a tackle slider that ONLY modifies the chance of making or breaking a tackle.

To get more sliders and more precise delineations of the effects of those sliders, they'd likely have to start fresh code-wise, and that's not happening any time soon.

[KingV2k3]

Quote: Originally Posted by charter04

Forget 12. My dream is to have as many as NBA 2k. Unfortunately Tiberon has taken a stance of not giving the user control for whatever reason. I'm still not sure why they seem so hell bent on limiting user control as much as possible

Indeed.

Now that you mention it, Current Gen Madden has less user control / input than the NBA2k series you mention, as well as The Show, NCAA and PS2 era Madden...

The irony being, the game that needs the most "help" has the least means to that end...

I tend to think Trojan Man nailed it:

The "Code Pile" can't support a slider overhaul until the game undergoes one...

[fistofrage]

Quote: Originally Posted by KingV2k3

Indeed. Now that you mention it, Current Gen Madden has less user control / input than the NBA2k series you mention, as well as The Show, NCAA and PS2 era Madden... The irony being, the game that needs the most "help" has the least means to that end... I tend to think Trojan Man nailed it: The "Code Pile" can't support a slider overhaul until the game undergoes one...

The developers don't even really know what the sliders do. At least they didn't in 2013 and 2014 and this is just more code piled up like you guys said. I doubt slider testing is even done because every year we have had broken or reversed sliders.

I bet if you ask the developers and said what does the INT slider do, they would look at you funny and say its the odds the defender hold onto a pick. I don't even know if they are fully aware that it does so many other things, if they were, it wouldn't be called the interception slider.

[eastcoast49ers]

Quote: Originally Posted by fistofrage

The developers don't even really know what the sliders do. At least they didn't in 2013 and 2014 and this is just more code piled up like you guys said. I doubt slider testing is even done because every year we have had broken or reversed sliders. I bet if you ask the developers and said what does the INT slider do, they would look at you funny and say its the odds the defender hold onto a pick. I don't even know if they are fully aware that it does so many other things, if they were, it wouldn't be called the interception slider.

Also just wish the penalty sliders only affected frequency of penalties and not a million other things.

[bcruise]

Quote: Originally Posted by eastcoast49ers

Also just wish the penalty sliders only affected frequency of penalties and not a million other things.

We've been specifically told that by the devs about this year's game and everyone chooses to ignore it.