Did EA/Tiburon stumble into another generation?

[GiantBlue76]

Quote: Originally Posted by Crimsontide27

Certainly you will understand If I leave some names and exact dates out of this, but hopefully this gives you some insight. The gamechanger program has never, not even at the conception phase, been about making a better product. The entire game changer program was initially pitched as a program that could have far reaching positive effects on social media. For quite awhile, EA had employed some previous QA testers, IE...pretty much minimum wage job to fans, to create forum accounts across the internet and basically run crowd control on all the negativity. This is what lead to the Gamechanger program. What better way to run damage control than to allow select high visible posters from main stream sites access to their favorite game during the development process. Bring people in to meet the team, get tours of the studios, free products, early access, couple of times had the opportunity to meet some professional athletes, free hotel and airfare to Orlando etc. In return, you build loyalty and are given a rare opportunity to live out your passion. I would disagree with you that the Gamechanger program has "failed" against Tiburon, and quite honestly has done everything they wanted. There are a few passionate gamechangers that want to bring ideas to the table and they don't last long. If you criticize or critique a game, it very well could be your last time down there. There is a poster on this forum that has submitted multiple apps to be a gamechanger and copys / pastes his posts in direct IMs to other developers to demonstrate just how much he can do for them. This is the culture it has created. While he will defend Madden tooth and nail, he is only doing it because he wants the perks associated as a gamechanger, not because he really wants to be part of a better product. At the end of the day, Gamechangers are not about bringing a better product, they are only there to be a cheap marketing tool , to deflect any criticism, and to hype the product up prior to release. Don't take my word for it, look at previous history. Prior to every release since Community days / Gamechangers, you cant get rid of them pre-release. They come down to Orlando, spend a few days with the team and play maybe a combined total of 4-5 games and hit social media when they return. It generates hype and hysteria. As soon as the game is released you find out that they were just excited to be part of an experience, and hyped up the game for the sole purpose of personal gain. Being able to have access to pre-release footage, videos, insights etc, and being able to monetize those tools via social media, has created an environment to where the gamechangers look out for themselves for the most part, not those that they are supposed to represent. How many times have you seen Gamechangers post prior to release and then disappear from the map post release? And to the question about what has come from their site? Not much. Everything that Tiburon could ever want to know can be found on any of the numerous sports game sites, but I can tell you one of the most notable changes that came from a thread from OS! For years the company followed the thread of the When , where , and how did you get it thread. The initial thought process was to find out what companies were breaking street dates and fine them, however. One clever guy thought outside the box and asked if there was a way they could capitalize financially off of this trend, as there seemed to be a large demand for it, as they noticed people would even drive out of state to get the game a few days early. Thus Season Pass was born!!

I remember a certain game Changer who was banned from here telling me I knew nothing when I stated how the game hangers were a marketing tool. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that. It's the same reason another group of critics were brouGht in. To bring them into the circle and stop the negative exposure. It's much less expensive than hiring good programmers to make a quality product. Tiburon got royally embarrassed today. Like I said before, the jig is up now. Tiburon made this bed and they get to lay in it. They blew an amazing opportunity and you can bet that 2k is loving this. They are making people who don't even follow the nba want to buy their game, while madden is forcing nfl addicts to go without.

By the way, this was the best post ever and thanks for sharing with us.

[CT Pitbull]

baby steps with new devs once again..blah blah blah..


We are tired of waiting. SPEND the money and FIX the damn game already. Regardless if it is because of past mistakes in development or not. There is NO denying that the Madden franchise is the laughing stock of next generation games. The sad part is that they are soooo far behind other titles that this WILL NOT change unless EA Sports takes an "all hands on deck" approach to play catch up.


And even if they do that who knows if the talent is there to make it happen. Time for them to think "outside the box".

[secondsolution]

The problem with the game changers is that they don't do what EA has told us they are suppose to do. From what I can tell they are purely marketing tools, I follow a few of them on twitter and the majority consistently retweet articles on their website that they have written that contains all of the buzz words and essentially ZERO criticism. After Madden 13 and the way the game shipped I have refused to believe a word that they say.

As for EA, I think it is absolutely ridiculous that they are acting like they have achieved some sort of feat by releasing a game that appears to be a shinier version of current gen. The way they have gone about marketing this release is absolutely ridiculous! I waited for a proper gameplay video until it became apparent that it wasn't coming. From a consumers perspective all that did was convey a lack of confidence by them in their own product.

I'm holding out hope that the game will 'feel' great, I know I wasn't impressed by next gen FIFA when I watched videos but noticed instant improvement when I played it.

[kc10785]

First time commenting on Next Gen since E3 but I just went through all these comments in this section and it actually made me sad and disappointed about this situation. People get the misconception that a lot of people on here just like bashing EA and clearly from the comments that's been posted yesterday that's not the case.

If EA understood the situation clearly they would have understood that we all was cheering for them. They came out and said at E3 these certain features like living world's, powerful graphics, true step, and OL/DL interactions will be there focus this time around. If they would have nailed those things a lot of the CG BS would have been forgiven and a lot of faith would have been restored from a lot of people in this community. A lot of people are pissed off because mainly the game should be way more afvance then where we at right now but the most insulting thing is they think we are ignorant as gamers. There marketing strategies showing chop up trailers, removing the MNF clip, hiding gameplay videos tell after the game hit the shelves, and promising us stuff this year then turn around and say give us another year is a back slap. I know admins don't want us to go the 2k14 vs Madden comparing route but how can we ignore the effort that is being shown from these two companies. I hated the old 2k football games but I can only imagine how great of a football game we would have today if they was able to produce with that effort.

Im sorry for this rant but I feel as a football lover to the core and a sports gamer they let me and a lot people down with this crap. You had us EA in the palm of your hands and let it slip through once again.

Sent From The Computer Lab at Professors X School of The Gifted

[TheRealHST]

Quote: Originally Posted by Crimsontide27

Certainly you will understand If I leave some names and exact dates out of this, but hopefully this gives you some insight. The gamechanger program has never, not even at the conception phase, been about making a better product. The entire game changer program was initially pitched as a program that could have far reaching positive effects on social media. For quite awhile, EA had employed some previous QA testers, IE...pretty much minimum wage job to fans, to create forum accounts across the internet and basically run crowd control on all the negativity. This is what lead to the Gamechanger program. What better way to run damage control than to allow select high visible posters from main stream sites access to their favorite game during the development process. Bring people in to meet the team, get tours of the studios, free products, early access, couple of times had the opportunity to meet some professional athletes, free hotel and airfare to Orlando etc. In return, you build loyalty and are given a rare opportunity to live out your passion. I would disagree with you that the Gamechanger program has "failed" against Tiburon, and quite honestly has done everything they wanted. There are a few passionate gamechangers that want to bring ideas to the table and they don't last long. If you criticize or critique a game, it very well could be your last time down there. There is a poster on this forum that has submitted multiple apps to be a gamechanger and copys / pastes his posts in direct IMs to other developers to demonstrate just how much he can do for them. This is the culture it has created. While he will defend Madden tooth and nail, he is only doing it because he wants the perks associated as a gamechanger, not because he really wants to be part of a better product. At the end of the day, Gamechangers are not about bringing a better product, they are only there to be a cheap marketing tool , to deflect any criticism, and to hype the product up prior to release. Don't take my word for it, look at previous history. Prior to every release since Community days / Gamechangers, you cant get rid of them pre-release. They come down to Orlando, spend a few days with the team and play maybe a combined total of 4-5 games and hit social media when they return. It generates hype and hysteria. As soon as the game is released you find out that they were just excited to be part of an experience, and hyped up the game for the sole purpose of personal gain. Being able to have access to pre-release footage, videos, insights etc, and being able to monetize those tools via social media, has created an environment to where the gamechangers look out for themselves for the most part, not those that they are supposed to represent. How many times have you seen Gamechangers post prior to release and then disappear from the map post release? And to the question about what has come from their site? Not much. Everything that Tiburon could ever want to know can be found on any of the numerous sports game sites, but I can tell you one of the most notable changes that came from a thread from OS! For years the company followed the thread of the When , where , and how did you get it thread. The initial thought process was to find out what companies were breaking street dates and fine them, however. One clever guy thought outside the box and asked if there was a way they could capitalize financially off of this trend, as there seemed to be a large demand for it, as they noticed people would even drive out of state to get the game a few days early. Thus Season Pass was born!!

Glad you pointed this out for those who dont know. Most of us knew this and these guys still do this no matter where you are (Twitch, Youtube, here). Its painfully obvious and I usualy ignore them.

[ch46647]

Many great posts in this thread, and having been around here for years and seeing things develop I completely agree.

Unfortunately, there is just nothing that we as consumers can do other then not buy the game. I have bought every Madden since 92' but finally stopped this year. Many of my friends stopped years ago as they said the game had gone down hill, but I guess I just wanted to keep believing in EA.

The bottom line is this, EA needs to invest money into Madden like they do with their Battlefield series. If that includes finding a new studio then they need to do that as well. Madden is currently in a horrendous state and just about everyone can see that at this point, even review sites who notoriously give Madden praise are starting to turn.

I believe there are guys on the Madden Dev team who care about making a great football game, but they can only do so much with what they are given to work with by the Executives. Madden has been handcuffed ever since the exclusive license and the product is by far the most STAGNANT video game series of any series out there.

There is no doubt in my mind that if they lost the Exclusive License and competition started making football games again, you would either see a drastic improvement to the game or this iconic series would just wither away and die at the hands of competitors. All we want is a great football game on par (or better) then some of the top sports games in the market. Madden had always been the innovator in the sports gaming markets since as long as I can remember, but that all came to a screeching hault in 06 and the exclusive deal.

It really has become a complete mess, and a real shame for all people who enjoy football gaming.

[brza37]

This is an excellent thread. And that post from Crimsontide ... WOW!

One problem I have with the thread though is the overwhelming tone of apathy that I sense in it.

I've bought the game continually for a long time too because even though I expected to be disappointed I still needed to get my NFL fix so despite the shortcomings I still shelled out $60 nearly every year. After Madden 13, I decided that was the last curren-gen version I'd buy and I looked forward to the possibilities of next-gen. After these videos I'm going to skip out on Madden entirely this year. But is that enough?

Will EA really miss a few hundred sales from OSer's? Yes, their sales numbers are slowly declining despite the NFL's popularity exploding year over year. But does the NFL really recognize this widening gap in their video game product's popularity and the NFL's popularity? I doubt it.

If the NFL doesn't recognize the problems and the gap between their video game product and sales in relation to the products of other sports, will they decide not to extend the exclusive license once again? I seriously doubt that.

Now online petitions rarely do anything except attract new spam to the email inbox you used to sign the petition with. But if the NFL's inbox was filled with complaints and emails about the current product from EA, maybe that could catch the NFL's attention. Maybe they could see the financial potential that an open licensing contract could provide in video games. Maybe.

I looked into how we could contact the NFL directly and found www.nfl.biz is the official website for any interested companies/people who would like to apply for an NFL license for whatever product they would like to sell. Here's just a small excerpt from the prospective license application form:

Quote:

NFLP grants licenses to companies that will support its promotional efforts. A retail product license with NFLP requires a commitment to market products that support and enhance fans’ enjoyment of NFL football, routine payments of royalties to NFLP based on a percentage of product sales, an annual payment of an advance against royalties, an annual payment of a minimum royalty guarantee of at least $100,000 (unless otherwise determined, on a case-by-case basis, by NFLP) based on actual sales of the products, and maintenance of insurance from a licensed and admitted insurance carrier with a rating not less than A-VIII from an A.M. Best rated insurance company that must include: comprehensive commercial general liability insurance, on an occurrence form, with a combined single limit for bodily injury and property damage, including products liability (including completed-operations coverage), and including coverage for contractual liability, independent contractors, broad form property damage, personal and advertising injury, in an amount of at least Six Million Dollars ($6,000,000.00) per occurrence and at least Twelve Million Dollars ($12,000,000.00) in the aggregate. A premium/promotional product license with NFLP generally has similar requirements as a retail product license, except that royalty payments will be structured on a per-project basis. The requirements and conditions of either a retail product license or a premium/promotional product license may vary in certain instances due to the nature of the products offered and/or the prospective licensee’s business.

In all likelihood, none of us have $100k just sitting around yearly and that probably wouldn't make much of a difference anyway since EA is paying tens of millions for the exclusive license. But there is an email address listed where the applications should be sent.
[email protected]

If we all voiced our concerns with the current video game "representation" of the NFL and it's projected future and sent them to that address, maybe, just maybe someone in the NFL offices may take notice.

There is also a way to contact the NFL with negative comments under the following link then "Other" > "Negative Comments":
http://www.nfl.com/contact-us

I know the chances are slim that anything happens. In all likelihood EA has already made the NFL a lucrative offer to extend the license that will be accepted and publicized soon. But if we can all spend 10 minutes posting our complaints about the product here at OS, we can also take another minute or two to copy and paste those into an email directly to the NFL. I don't know if it will help but it can't hurt.

If we do nothing but complain here and possibly resist buying an NFL game for a year or two I do know what will definitely happen though. Nothing.

[Segagendude]

Hard for me to say. While I can appreciate that they just ported this time around and kept various things in the game rather than bare bones it ala 06, the foundation wasn't that great IMO.

And all the news about active sidelines and whatnot; I've yet to see evidence of that.

I don't think they stumbled as they said they were better prepared for NG this time around, but at the same time, they're still not utilizing NG's capabilities to their full potential..