Do people realize how good this game is Human vs Human on All-Madden?

[Valdarez]

Quote: Originally Posted by TNT713

- 1st route is a 12 yard In to Muhammad... The throw hits him just as he comes out of his cut. - Comeback Route to Smith on the opposite side. The throw is a little late, but still before the cut is made. - Post to the slot - Out to the X - bad throw. Too far inside. But it was before the cut. - Quick Out to TE - thrown off my back foot... Poor mechanics. Threw this one twice. - Post to the slot - I usually don't lead my posts, but I might start. - Hook to the Z - Had to throw this one 3 times. - C route to the Motion Z - released as cut is made - Corner to Motion Slot - changed the camera angle to show receiver cuts after ball crosses LOS Hope this puts some myths to bed... Later

That's lead passing. It's not the same. Like I said before, I didn't use Max Passing (basically the same thing as Lead Passing) in the video I put together highlighting routed based passing. Madden only throws straight, though you can use Lead Passing to control where the ball goes based on the straight directional pass and the Lead Passing direction selected.

[TNT713]

Quote: Originally Posted by Valdarez

That's lead passing. It's not the same. Like I said before, I didn't use Max Passing (basically the same thing as Lead Passing) in the video I put together highlighting routed based passing. Madden only throws straight, though you can use Lead Passing to control where the ball goes based on the straight directional pass and the Lead Passing direction selected.

What do you mean when you say, "Madden only throws straight." Because I've read from someone (probably not you) that you can't throw to where your receiver's route is going to go, only where the receiver is currently running. Yet the video clearly shows the pass being released before the receiver cuts and still being delivered to the right spot on the route...

If that's not route based passing, what is?

I never played 2K, so I have no frame of reference...

Thanks in advance...

Later

[Valdarez]

Quote: Originally Posted by TNT713

What do you mean when you say, "Madden only throws straight." Because I've read from someone (probably not you) that you can't throw to where your receiver's route is going to go, only where the receiver is currently running. Yet the video clearly shows the pass being released before the receiver cuts and still being delivered to the right spot on the route... If that's not route based passing, what is? I never played 2K, so I have no frame of reference... Thanks in advance... Later

So route based passing is throwing the ball before the receiver makes their cut, where the ball can leave the QB's hand before the receiver makes the cut, and without using Lead/Max Passing. What happens is the QB throws to the point where the receiver will be in the route. In other words, if I throw before they make their cut, the pass won't simply go straight, like it will in Madden, it's always going to go to a point along the route the receiver is running.

If you haven't played APF2K8, I can definitely see why you're having a hard time understanding it. It was something new to me in APF2K8 as well. It's what makes the passing game for me.

Question. How would you do the same thing in your video in Madden, without using Lead Passing?

[OrangeCrush]

None of the passes in TNT's video show route based passing, like the others said, try throwing the ball before the receiver makes his cut, you'll see Madden can't do it.

[TNT713]

Quote: Originally Posted by Valdarez

So route based passing is throwing the ball before the receiver makes their cut, where the ball can leave the QB's hand before the receiver makes the cut, and without using Lead/Max Passing. What happens is the QB throws to the point where the receiver will be in the route. In other words, if I throw before they make their cut, the pass won't simply go straight, like it will in Madden, it's always going to go to a point along the route the receiver is running.

What I'm trying to illustrate is that passes do NOT always go to the path the receiver is running when the QB throws. There are points in the route stem where I can throw and 'change' the route on the fly, but I can also deliver the pass to the spot on the route WITHOUT manipulating the stick to aim the pass.

Quote: Originally Posted by Valdarez

Question. How would you do the same thing in your video in Madden, without using Lead Passing?

Same video. While the out to Muhammad at the beginning, and the corner to Goodson at the end used Leading to make the throw, the TE Quick Out didn't have any leading to the pass, because the QB was falling backward. Nor did the Hook to smith, the Comeback to Smith, or the 2 posts to Goodson.

Quote: Originally Posted by OrangeCrush

None of the passes in TNT's video show route based passing, like the others said, try throwing the ball before the receiver makes his cut, you'll see Madden can't do it.

Actually, every one of these throws either is released OR the QB begins the windup before the receiver cuts. What I'm seeing is Madden doing what everyone seems to think cannot be done.

Later

[Pass_The_Cows]

TNT, go rent APF2k8 and you will see what everyone else is talking about. Then again maybe you shouldn't as it will completely ruin the Madden pass game for you...

[Senator Palmer]

I actually see where TNT is coming from. I've thrown passes before the receiver comes out of their break. The window is obviously smaller in Madden, but I've thrown deep dig routes before my receiver has made the break inside and had success. I've also thrown the deep dig where the corner ran the route with my receiver and picked it off. I've noticed that a receiver's route running rating has a lot to do with these situations and your QB's MAC rating will dictate how well the ball is placed when using the sticks to lead the receiver.

I've seen that kinda play on Sunday's also. I remember a game back in 2005 Bills vs. Falcons. Lee Evans runs a square in and Deangelo Hall runs the route with him, beats him inside and picks the pass off. I wanted to post the vid, but I've only got it on VHS.

Here's another vid of a Hall pick when he was with the Raiders that if it happened in the Madden, would have you throwing your controller. These kind of freakish plays do happen and are not the same as the psychic DB swat... although you will see that from time to time on Sundays as CB's are taught to read a receiver's hands and go up with them when they have their backs to the LOS.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-cant-m...lay-Hall-s-INT

[Only1LT]

Quote: Originally Posted by TNT713

What I'm trying to illustrate is that passes do NOT always go to the path the receiver is running when the QB throws. There are points in the route stem where I can throw and 'change' the route on the fly, but I can also deliver the pass to the spot on the route WITHOUT manipulating the stick to aim the pass. Same video. While the out to Muhammad at the beginning, and the corner to Goodson at the end used Leading to make the throw, the TE Quick Out didn't have any leading to the pass, because the QB was falling backward. Nor did the Hook to smith, the Comeback to Smith, or the 2 posts to Goodson. Actually, every one of these throws either is released OR the QB begins the windup before the receiver cuts. What I'm seeing is Madden doing what everyone seems to think cannot be done. Later

I don't think that you really get it and I'm almost positive that you never will. Which is fine.

I will leave you with this one last thing. People have told you to try out 2K to see the difference. I think that's a waste of time for you because I am willing to bet money that you still won't get it. And again, that's fine.

I don't know how long you have been playing Madden, but Madden USED to have a button called Route Based. It was one of the triggers. You held it down while passing with one of the face buttons that corresponded to the receiver. If you wanted to throw a pass based off of the route, you held the route based trigger. If you wanted to throw a pass based on the receiver, you threw like you do now. Now if there was no difference, why would they make a button specifically to do what Valdarez and others are saying you can not do now? Now maybe you might think that the game has been programmed to do both route based and receiver based passing so that is why they eliminated the button. If you believe that, then I don't know what to say.

Posters have discussed this issue with devs before. They have given reasons why it works the way it does. I have never once seen a dev say to a poster that raised this issue, that they were crazy and that this is how Madden behaves already. So the question you have to ask yourself is, if the devs acknowledge that there is basically no route based passing in the game (I say basically because there are a couple of situations, as I stated before, where Madden behaves like there is, but it is literally like a couple) then why don't you believe the people who made the game either?