Since when is switching to the WR.DB closes to the ball not sim.

[johnnywobbles]

Quote: Originally Posted by Skyboxer

SMH at the "No Skills" comments. It had more to do with the rocket catches thad made user catching waaay to easy. VS CPU it's abuse as the CPU doesn't combat the player switching and the bursting to the ball. User vs user it's not that big of a problem any longer and is just a user preference. Also a lot of people like the "coaching" aspect and want the players ratings to matter more than the "Stick Skills". So again it's user preference and yes the term "Sim" has been way overdone just like the "game is broken" comments.

Exactly about the ratings. It does not make you a cheap player if you do it but why do ratings even matter for players if you are going to to control every aspect, basically just throwing the ball to yourself.

It is not an issue to be defensive about, but simply a preference that some of us have. The great thing about leagues and communities now is that you can choose to find and play with people who view playing the game as you do, whatever way that is.

It is a very simple minded approach to say it is skill issue, or lack of because you want to see players ratings matter more, especially in an online franchise where you are building a roster. I am really surprised more "purists" or "sim" players don't see it this way.

[BlackJackRabbit]

Quote: Originally Posted by Broncos86

I HATE this attitude and point of view. If someone wants to say that controlling players isn't sim, then let them believe that. But come on guys, we don't need to get into this ego-tastical point of view of "scrubs," as if one's skill in Madden somehow translates to worldly renown and success. There are some people (not myself) who want to run coach mode only. That's what they like. Don't spend your time knocking "they stick skilz" just because they enjoy the game differently. Moreover, quit getting offended just because someone says an aspect isn't sim. The very idea of "sim" is subjective anyways.

But the people who are claiming that switching to the player closest to the ball isn't "sim" are probably people who have trouble doing it; otherwise, they wouldn't attack others for switching to the closest player. They would just state that they don't like switching and prefer an opponent who does the same. If they attack people for switch, there has to be a reason why, and more than likely that reason is that they're not good at switching to the closest player.

Also, the idea of "sim" tactics is no more subjective that a game that's "sim." "Sim" or simulation means that a game is trying to be as realistic as possible. Only tactics and strategies that are used in the NFL should work, for the most part, in a simulation football game. Obviously, in a video game, perfection is impossible, so there may be some tactics that aren't sim but still effective. If you use those tactics ( at all) you aren't "sim.

Switching to the closest player in order to get involved in the playing isn't "unsim" because video games are meant to be fun, and playing ( for an example) as a defensive end the whole game would be incredibly boring. Let's say a player user controls a DE and get's 3 sacks, 3 tackles, and returns a fumble for a TD. That's seven plays in total, and a monster game for the DE, but who in their right mind would consider that an entertaining experience ?

[kehlis]

I don't think as many people as some of you guys think claim it isn't sim (which as previously mentioned means different things to different people).

I could care less what option anyone chooses, I myself prefer no switch for reasons already mentioned and I don't consider one method more sim than the other. I just like it better that way.

If you want to accuse me of "having no stick skills" then so be it, I could care less.


I won't play the game though pitting one viewpoint against the other and claim I'm more sim than you and I think there are a lot more people with this viewpoint on both sides of the argument then you make out to be.

[Broncos86]

Let's take a look here.

Quote: Originally Posted by BlackJackRabbit

But the people who are claiming that switching to the player closest to the ball isn't "sim" are probably people who have trouble doing it; otherwise, they wouldn't attack others for switching to the closest player.

That's a dangerous assumption based on nothing more than a blind opinion.

Quote:

They would just state that they don't like switching and prefer an opponent who does the same. If they attack people for switch, there has to be a reason why, and more than likely that reason is that they're not good at switching to the closest player.

And that's a problem, why? This statement holds no argument or statement that could be considered evidence for a point.

Quote:

Also, the idea of "sim" tactics is no more subjective that a game that's "sim." "Sim" or simulation means that a game is trying to be as realistic as possible. Only tactics and strategies that are used in the NFL should work, for the most part, in a simulation football game. Obviously, in a video game, perfection is impossible, so there may be some tactics that aren't sim but still effective. If you use those tactics ( at all) you aren't "sim.

You're reduced to play within the confines of the current game. Thus, which is more sim: allowing each player to act within the limits of their ratings, or controlling each player? I have no answer for you.

Quote:

Switching to the closest player in order to get involved in the playing isn't "unsim" because video games are meant to be fun,

"Sim" and "fun" are not intrinsically connected. Just because something is "sim," this does not in itself make the game "fun."

Quote:

and playing ( for an example) as a defensive end the whole game would be incredibly boring.

Your personal opinion, nothing more.

Quote:

Let's say a player user controls a DE and get's 3 sacks, 3 tackles, and returns a fumble for a TD. That's seven plays in total, and a monster game for the DE, but who in their right mind would consider that an entertaining experience ?

Those who in fact actually enjoy it. You seem to struggle with visions beyond what you have. You're struggling to understand that the views of others could be just as viable, and their means of enjoying a game are just as legitimate. This is not an argument for or against anyone who wants to claim something as more or less sim. You can view the thread on Madden game speed to see a fun example of that occurring. However, if you're going to come here and make statements that denounce how others play, I'm going to point out that your method of play is no more right or wrong than their style.

The bottom line is, people need to get away from the whole argument of what is and is not sim, and quit being so darn touchy about these things. One person on the Internet disagreeing with you shouldn't rain on your picnic.

[nccomicfan]

I don't have a problem with user control, but far too often from I'm seeing that control allows that user to make a play that you wouldn't see irl.Guys controlling a DB to run completely around my WR to make a pick..not the user's fault really, just would be nice if EA bothered to accurately model WR body positioning.Any top wideout learns early how to put themselves between the ball and the defender...so it's ok to user control, but not in order to exploit crappy programming imho.

I'm an older player and admittedly not a fan of completely analog driven gameplay( any game I can toggle it off I do so).

I want ratings and my knowledge of the sport to matter, not how I flick a mini-joystick.

my opinion, don't expect everyone to share it

[MileHighSalute30]

You are supposed to PLAY the game. Not sit back and watch the computer play it. To each their own, but there is no way in hell I'm relying on Madden's AI to do anything for me.

[BlackJackRabbit]

Quote: Originally Posted by Broncos86

Let's take a look here. That's a dangerous assumption based on nothing more than a blind opinion.

Why is it so dangerous ? And what other reason would someone have for attack someone who user catches or attempts to make user picks ?

Quote: Originally Posted by Broncos86

And that's a problem, why? This statement holds no argument or statement that could be considered evidence for a point.

Why is it a problem when someone accuses users ( the ones that don't condone switching) of lacking the skills to switch to the closest player ? In all likely-hood, someone complains about a tactic ( calling it cheese or unsim) if it's effective, and they think that it's an unrealistic tactic. Otherwise, why complain ? Why complain about your opponent switching if it doesn't help your opponent win.

Maybe the people who don't switch just don't want to switch; they want play as the defensive end, linebacker, or safety the entire play, but the fact that they accuse others of cheesing, or being unsim, reveals that they're sore losers. That's not any better.

Quote: Originally Posted by Broncos86

You're reduced to play within the confines of the current game. Thus, which is more sim: allowing each player to act within the limits of their ratings, or controlling each player? I have no answer for you.

Here my answer for you: outside of coach mode, allowing each player to act within the limits of their ratings ( by not controlling them) is impossible. These people who don't switch on defense are still controlling a player ( and possibly making him perform better then his ratings suggest he should) when they're on defense; they're also controlling one player or more on offense. They're passing with the QB; they're running with the HB, or they're running with the receivers after the receiver makes the catch. Even if they let the CPU control the running back and the receivers, they're still throwing the ball with the quarterback. QB is the most important position in football, and maybe sports, so are these switch detractors (according to themselves) really as sim as they think they are ?

They want to pick apart somebody's defense by controlling the QB, but at the same time, the user on defense isn't sim because he combats that by controlling players ( in coverage) that are closest to the ball. You don't see the hypocrisy in that ?

If these switch detractors want to draw a line in the sand and say that controlling a player isn't sim, they need to look down and realize what side they're truly on.

Quote: Originally Posted by Broncos86

"Sim" and "fun" are not intrinsically connected. Just because something is "sim," this does not in itself make the game "fun."

I know that, but "fun" makes people buy it. The fact is that the majority of people don't play coach mode, or don't only play coach mode, and want to be involved in every play.

Quote: Originally Posted by Broncos86

Those who in fact actually enjoy it. You seem to struggle with visions beyond what you have. You're struggling to understand that the views of others could be just as viable, and their means of enjoying a game are just as legitimate. This is not an argument for or against anyone who wants to claim something as more or less sim. You can view the thread on Madden game speed to see a fun example of that occurring. However, if you're going to come here and make statements that denounce how others play, I'm going to point out that your method of play is no more right or wrong than their style. One person on the Internet disagreeing with you shouldn't rain on your picnic.

The thread is into response people who attack users for attempting to user catch/pick. They denounced my play; I'm denouncing theirs. The gave their opinion; I'm giving mine. The only one struggling to tolerate someone's opinion is you.

[kehlis]

Quote: Originally Posted by MileHighSalute30

You are supposed to PLAY the game. Not sit back and watch the computer play it.

This is where problem's arise. You cant say this (above) and then say this:

Quote:

To each their own, but there is no way in hell I'm relying on Madden's AI to do anything for me.

If it is "to each their own" how can you say "you are supposed to play the game?"



Everyone has their own definition of playing the game and want different things. No reason to try and come off as being indifferent when you really aren't.




And as a general statement. It really bothers me when I see others going back and forth on how to enjoy the game. Why is it so difficult to understand that we all enjoy different things? Why do we spend so much time arguing with each other about what is the "right" way to enjoy this game?

Why can't we agree we all want to get the most enjoyment we can and move on. I'm not talking about productive discussion but about back and forth that is doing nothing other than arguing about what is the right way to enjoy the game.