Lack of info for Madden 13 Vita

[logical]

Quote: Originally Posted by SamitSarkar

Hey, thanks for the link — I'm the guy who wrote the article. Let me clarify something: Dan Baker, the supervising producer on the Vita game, told me that it was only running at 15 fps in mid-April. Back then, he said they expected to have it ready to show journalists at E3, and apparently, it wasn't. But I assume it wasn't still running that poorly only a few weeks ago. The game I played this week ran just fine, and I expect that the final version will be a totally playable, solid experience. My issue is that EA is marketing this game as "Madden NFL 13," when they really should just call it "Madden NFL Football" or something.

How does it compare to Fifa? Is it noticeably better than the iOS version?

[SamitSarkar]

Quote: Originally Posted by logical

How does it compare to Fifa? Is it noticeably better than the iOS version?

I haven't spent a lot of time with FIFA Soccer on Vita, since I don't own the handheld. But — and I mentioned this in my article — Madden 13 on Vita seems comparable to FIFA Soccer in that it's running on the previous year's engine (Madden 12 and FIFA 11, respectively) and doesn't have some of the important improvements of the current year, but is otherwise a competent sports sim.

If you look up reviews, you'll see that while people were disappointed that they were playing a year-old game on Vita after getting used to FIFA 12, they thought the game was pretty good anyway.

Madden 13 on Vita plays well, and I think it'll be a good game — but it's misleading for EA to market it as "Madden 13," because it's a year-old game with great new commentary and pretty good touch/tilt controls.

I'm not sure which game's iOS version you're referring to, but I don't have an iPad, so I haven't played either. But Madden 13 is basically a shrunken-down version of Madden 12's console versions, so... it's nothing like Madden on iOS, if that's what you were asking.

[logical]

Quote: Originally Posted by SamitSarkar

I haven't spent a lot of time with FIFA Soccer on Vita, since I don't own the handheld. But — and I mentioned this in my article — Madden 13 on Vita seems comparable to FIFA Soccer in that it's running on the previous year's engine (Madden 12 and FIFA 11, respectively) and doesn't have some of the important improvements of the current year, but is otherwise a competent sports sim. If you look up reviews, you'll see that while people were disappointed that they were playing a year-old game on Vita after getting used to FIFA 12, they thought the game was pretty good anyway. Madden 13 on Vita plays well, and I think it'll be a good game — but it's misleading for EA to market it as "Madden 13," because it's a year-old game with great new commentary and pretty good touch/tilt controls. I'm not sure which game's iOS version you're referring to, but I don't have an iPad, so I haven't played either. But Madden 13 is basically a shrunken-down version of Madden 12's console versions, so... it's nothing like Madden on iOS, if that's what you were asking.

As far as the comparison with FIFA goes, although FIFA is a year back it ran pretty well. It was above 30FPS most of the time and played pretty well. One of the main things they did with FIFA was port the current gen engine on the Vita.

I know its been said that Madden Vita will get the Madden 12 console engine, but how well does is translate. From looking at the player models it looks like they have lost a lot of polys. (not to mention the game will definitely not look as crisp as those press shots, I dont know who they think they are fooling with those)

As far as the iOS version of Madden.. it seems like its using last gen engine(PS2)



Visually how does it compare to that? I want an honest answer because frankly I dont trust the press screens posted on your site. If you look at the models of the iOS version and compare them to those of the newly released Madden Vita shots.. they look almost identical. What I really want to know is if the Visuals are night and day between the iOS version and the Vita version.

[mrprice33]

Quote: Originally Posted by logical

Visually how does it compare to that? I want an honest answer because frankly I dont trust the press screens posted on your site. If you look at the models of the iOS version and compare them to those of the newly released Madden Vita shots.. they look almost identical. What I really want to know is if the Visuals are night and day between the iOS version and the Vita version.

Run, Samit..****uuuuuuuuuuuun

[SamitSarkar]

Quote: Originally Posted by logical

As far as the comparison with FIFA goes, although FIFA is a year back it ran pretty well. It was above 30FPS most of the time and played pretty well. One of the main things they did with FIFA was port the current gen engine on the Vita. I know its been said that Madden Vita will get the Madden 12 console engine, but how well does is translate. From looking at the player models it looks like they have lost a lot of polys. (not to mention the game will definitely not look as crisp as those press shots, I dont know who they think they are fooling with those)

Quote: Originally Posted by logical

Visually how does it compare to that? I want an honest answer because frankly I dont trust the press screens posted on your site. If you look at the models of the iOS version and compare them to those of the newly released Madden Vita shots.. they look almost identical. What I really want to know is if the Visuals are night and day between the iOS version and the Vita version.

Hang on... I think you're conflating some things here, so let me clarify.

The game engine ≠ the graphics. The engine provides the gameplay underpinnings: for example, how players interact with each other (i.e., physics). Madden 13 on PS3/360 has a brand-new engine, the Infinity Engine, which provides real-time physics (similar to what Backbreaker offered). It won't be in the Vita version because the Vita game is based on Madden 12, which did not have the Infinity Engine.

Visuals are related, but it's still a different department, so to speak. For Madden 13, the presentation team has done a lot to make the game look more like real life and like a TV broadcast, adding elements such as dynamic shadows from multiple light sources, motion blur, and progressive HDR lighting. That stuff won't be in the Vita version, either.

EA Canada did not "port the current gen [sic] engine," per se, for FIFA Soccer on Vita. That title came out in February 2012, but was based on a year-old game, FIFA 11. FIFA 12, which launched in September/October 2011, added its own real-time physics system, the Player Impact Engine, along with new defensive tactics/controls. The Vita game didn't have that stuff, but I didn't think too poorly of EA for it, since they didn't try to sell it as "FIFA 12."

I didn't spend a whole lot of time with the Vita version of Madden 13, but what I can say for now is this: it looks almost as good as Madden 12 did on PS3/360. Obviously, HB Studios had to make some visual sacrifices to get the game running — notice, for example, that 3D leg pads are gone — but the player models and frame rate seemed fine. I think it's more impressive in motion than the screenshots convey, especially on a five-inch screen at 540p (and isn't that usually the case?).

I don't know if I'd call it a "night and day" improvement over the iPad version of Madden, but then, the iPad is no slouch in the graphics department. Still, it plays like Madden 12 did on console (in terms of controls), and that's more than I can say for any iOS sports game.

[logical]

Quote: Originally Posted by SamitSarkar

Hang on... I think you're conflating some things here, so let me clarify. The game engine ≠ the graphics. The engine provides the gameplay underpinnings: for example, how players interact with each other (i.e., physics). Madden 13 on PS3/360 has a brand-new engine, the Infinity Engine, which provides real-time physics (similar to what Backbreaker offered). It won't be in the Vita version because the Vita game is based on Madden 12, which did not have the Infinity Engine. Visuals are related, but it's still a different department, so to speak. For Madden 13, the presentation team has done a lot to make the game look more like real life and like a TV broadcast, adding elements such as dynamic shadows from multiple light sources, motion blur, and progressive HDR lighting. That stuff won't be in the Vita version, either. EA Canada did not "port the current gen [sic] engine," per se, for FIFA Soccer on Vita. That title came out in February 2012, but was based on a year-old game, FIFA 11. FIFA 12, which launched in September/October 2011, added its own real-time physics system, the Player Impact Engine, along with new defensive tactics/controls. The Vita game didn't have that stuff, but I didn't think too poorly of EA for it, since they didn't try to sell it as "FIFA 12." I didn't spend a whole lot of time with the Vita version of Madden 13, but what I can say for now is this: it looks almost as good as Madden 12 did on PS3/360. Obviously, HB Studios had to make some visual sacrifices to get the game running — notice, for example, that 3D leg pads are gone — but the player models and frame rate seemed fine. I think it's more impressive in motion than the screenshots convey, especially on a five-inch screen at 540p (and isn't that usually the case?). I don't know if I'd call it a "night and day" improvement over the iPad version of Madden, but then, the iPad is no slouch in the graphics department. Still, it plays like Madden 12 did on console (in terms of controls), and that's more than I can say for any iOS sports game.

I think you are misunderstanding engines here Samit. Madden runs on multiple engines. The infinity engine is one component of the engine as a whole as it only handles physics(interactions between players.) It does not handle other things like graphics/polys.. etc etc.

To be on the same page, Id like to give you a a quick example. Bioshock 2 runs on the Unreal engine(the main engine) but it also uses the Havok physics engine to supplement the unreal engine. Unreal Engine with Havok engine. Current gen Madden engine with Infinity physics engine. If you took out the infinity physics engine from Madden 13 and left all other features you would most likely have NCAA 13.

When I say "current-gen" engine I mean in terms of console lifetimes not game cycles. When Madden made the jump to the 360/PS3 they started using the current-gen engine(not last gen which would be PS2 engine) Its apparent with weaker gaming systems like the PSP and iOS that they are using last gen engines which would be the PS2 engine, therefore the graphics are understandably inferior to that of the current gen engine.

As for Fifa Vita, it was ported using last years feature set, BUT the current gen engine they are using on the consoles. Whatever EA team worked on FIFA did a fine job IMO. As I played the game on my Vita it runs at a nice clip and they didnt have to eat too much into the graphics to get it there. I even liked their system that when going into replay mode.. the frames would take a hit but the game would provide substantially more detail on the players.

Quote:

adding elements such as dynamic shadows from multiple light sources, motion blur, and progressive HDR lighting. That stuff won't be in the Vita version, either.

Now we're getting to the good stuff. This is what I want to know. All the goodies they have to sacrifice to make the game run on Vita.

Quote:

I don't know if I'd call it a "night and day" improvement over the iPad version of Madden, but then, the iPad is no slouch in the graphics department.

Hmm. I dont know how much you play Madden, but I hope its not that often because if you cannot tell the difference between the iOS version and this new Vita version I think we are all in for a huge letdown.

Anyway, Samit, I dont mean to offend or attack so dont take any of this post personal. I'll just have to wait until they release some video of the game to make a good personal assessment of the game. If they can ballpark a port as well as the FIFA team did it will be halfway decent.

One last question though, in the beta version you played was the game as smooth looking as the screenshots you posted on your site? Were there really no jaggies present? Anti-aliasing seems to be really high.

[Afrikan]

"Now we're getting to the good stuff. This is what I want to know. All the goodies they have to sacrifice to make the game run on Vita."

"Now we're getting to the good stuff. This is what I want to know. All the goodies they have to sacrifice to make Madden 12 run on the PS3."

[logical]

Edited a little Quick post before lunch some mistakes were made.